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 and they could care less about US military might.  they need to make a return for their customers.  Have you ever talked to a trader who said, "I think I can make more money on the Euro, but i think I'll take a lower return on dollars because I like the military."  If you believe the polls, most of them, particularly overseas, are against American policy anyway==so why would they do this?

In terms of long term strength, I'm just looking at productivity trends, growth, and the US position in what I think are key markets for the next 5 years--technology (IT), healthcare, and financial services.  I for one like where the Dow is in terms of the last 5 years, and where the Dow is in terms of the very long term.  I see it positioned perfectly for significant growth, but as you correctly state, others see doom and gloom.  That's good--different opinions make markets work well.  But actually I'm not trying to convince anyone of this, it's a forecast that obviously could be wrong--I only mention it because I find people think very seriously about economics before they bet their pocketbook, their retirement, their future--so you'll know I've thought about it--but still could be wrong.  Since I wrote my growth diary on Sept 15, the Dow is up 2% ish, and the Nasdaq 5% ish (nasdaq has a higher perc entage of the growth stocks I like).  Now my forecast was for 5 years, with ups and downs--so I'm not celebrating--but it's better than a stick in the eye.

by wchurchill on Tue Nov 22nd, 2005 at 01:14:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
traders of course drive the markets that they are given.

Given that they could have a Euro Oil market if certain major producers switch from dollars, then of course they will find the right price to make a profit.

Traders cannot trade in markets that become defunct. So I don't think you quite understood the argument.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Tue Nov 22nd, 2005 at 02:36:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
is that the Dow has been moving sidewards since 2005. And when you're not looking at the indicators above, but at what the Americans actually can spend (no savings, housing bubble to go bust soon), it's hard for me to see the imminent significant growth. In fact, the argument could also go the other way round: the traders are critical of the soundness of the growth and thus the Dow's not been able to go past the 11000 mark.
by srutis on Tue Nov 22nd, 2005 at 03:57:39 PM EST
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noticed that the Dow is almost within 1% of 11,000 at today's close.  The Fed seems to be getting concerned about continual interest rate hikes--particularly with the 10 year treasury not going up, because people don't see long term inflation--see Jerome's new story just posted within the last hour.

Now I'm playing this for the med--long term, 5 years, and expect ups and downs,,,,but I am becoming more encouraged with my prognostication based on events this month.

by wchurchill on Tue Nov 22nd, 2005 at 06:17:16 PM EST
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From the Economist both are year/year figures:

CPI: +3.2%
M3: +7.3%

The DOW is down 1.2% versus CPI and down 5.3% versus M3.  

I concur both figures have problems.  The CPI is notoriously a "political" estimate.  But loss of year/year Purchasing Power needs to be estimated when analyizing investment returns.

by ATinNM on Thu Nov 24th, 2005 at 11:27:23 AM EST
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