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One British source said: "Is France really saying that it is going to hold up a funding deal for the whole of Europe? We think the new members will gradually come round to the idea that a deal this week is in their best interests. If we don't get one now, they might have to wait a long time.
I don't read this as spin, but as another thinly veiled threat that, if the budget is not agreed during the British presidency, Britain will prevent one from being reached during 2006.

Britain has too much at stake and is clearly not acting an honest broker. Austria and Finland are both much better placed to act as honest brokers here.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 03:58:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
a deal this week is in their best interests. If we don't get one now, they might have to wait a long time.
That is, if France does not let the UK have its way, the new member states will have to wait for a long time.

And since it is a native speaker saying this, they can't claim that they somehow fumbled their pronouns.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 04:19:14 AM EST
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I agree but see what Jerome says below. There's a new frame on the situation that the UK is putting out through the Eng-lang media, since it had started to be clear Britain had lost contact with the new member states. The new frame is a tendentious if not fraudulent presentation of the facts, aka spin.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 06:36:10 AM EST
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It seems to me that it is not a frame put out throught the English media as spin, but the actual UK negotiating position. Apparently that's what Blair himself said in the press conference after he met with the Visegrad group a couple of weeks ago. DoDo and I discussed it in last week's EU (p)review (linked), where I also dug up some amazing remarks by a UK minister at an EP committee meeting.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 06:41:48 AM EST
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Migreu,

From reading about the EU, your comments appear to be spot on. What benefit is there to the UK to behave in this manner over the EU budget?

Also I want to clarify some very thoughtless remarks I made on 8 Dec 2005 in Frans column.

I deeply apologize for any upset my remarks caused. As an American I am having a great deal of trouble with the now known fact of just how involved the American government is involved in all the various aspects of the atrocities associated with Torture, Renditions, Secret Prisons etc. Though I love my country, It makes me feel dirty, deeply ashamed, beyond outrage and physically sick to my stomach. When I saw your reaction to my comments, I realized what my state of mind was, and decided I needed a few days off Blogs to get my thinking straightened out.

The European Tribune did an outstanding job of highlighting the various aspects of these crimes last week on their pages. Frankly it was almost a relief to see that your press made it at least visible. That is so much more than the American Corporately owned media did here. I have long admired the manner in which Europeans seem able to so much more sanely think situations through, and formulate possible outcomes and solutions. So, I responded like an angry and scared child wanting my older and wiser cousins to come rescue us, instead of as a sane adult. Living in the U.S.A. right now feels like being in an insane asylum, with the inmates in charge.

This is by no means excuses my thoughtlessness, and is offered only as an explanation of my state of mind.

I said After all Bush can't carpet bomb Europe or the corporations would be very angry that their markets are now rubble. I should instead have asked, of what or why is Europe afraid of what the US would do, and why are they not reacting more strongly against these crimes?

You replied I would hope the reason Bush could not carpet bomb Europe would be that the Joint Chiefs of Staff would refuse. I would sincerely hope so.

You know Migeru, I too would like to hope the Joint Chiefs of staff would behave responsibly. Yet with each day that passes, there are new revelations of complete insanity, lies and a yet deeper lowering of conscience and morality by these people. Never in my 60+ years have I seen our government controlled by so many sick, twisted, lying, depraved and perverted pyscopathic individuals.

Input from the Military is rejected by the Bush Administration and, dissenters, with the civilians in charge, will have their careers and lives destroyed. The ONLY thing that seems to catch the attention of these awful people are bottom line corporate wealth and their next great scheme to totally loot the American treasury for generations to come. So I am not sure just how much effect the advice of the Joint Chiefs or any military person would have. And this Criminal Cabal somehow believes it is their "Divine Right" to strike out using Military technology against perceived enemies.

When I used the term "dramatically alter", you responded with "Dramatically alter" meaning the rendition flights would stop over to refuel in North Africa? Perhaps I have misunderstood or not read enough, but I still think that European Pressure would force the Bushitas to back down. My reasons are:

  1. Europe, using diplomacy, has better relations with Mid East countries than does the United States. That translates in more trade with Europe.

  2. THE EU is perceived as "the group" with whom the Mid East prefers to do all its business after the treatment they have received the last 5 years from the Bushita Cabal.

  3. Iran (if they can ever agree on an Oil Minister) and Argentina have already adjusted their countrys' monetary systems to switch from "Petrol Dollars" to "Euro Dollars". Other oil producing countries would follow in retaliation for the bullying hubris of the Bushitas. Perhaps this change would be good for Europe, but in reality it would cause the American economy to completely crash. It would be a public humiliation for the Bush regime. Yet, at the end of the day, it is the 98% of Americans on the lower side of the economic scale that would pay the most penalizing price.

I realize this is a long comment, and somewhat off topic from today's discussion. Yet I felt I did not have the right to participate in any of these discussions, if I did not attempt to make my amends. Please forgive my faux pas.  

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within." Cicero
by Grandma M on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 10:12:58 AM EST
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Grandma M, I have two things to say.

  1. I am too cynical for a 30-year-old
  2. I have a tendency to apply a 90-degree turn to people's comments
  3. I put a lot of obscure irony in what I write, and I can't count to two.


guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 10:20:51 AM EST
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Thank you Migeru.

As to not being able to count to two, seems like math and scientific logic are your forte with the name of your email address. I use to teach at a college in New Hampshire - language  and absolutely nothing to do with science or math. Where do you teach/work? Ever the curious teacher I am!

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within." Cicero

by Grandma M on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 10:29:56 AM EST
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I don't teach any more. My students could not stand my (mis)demeanor.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 10:44:31 AM EST
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The problem with all that maths and logic is that arithmetic becomes more complicated than it seems ("2 + 2? You mean base 10, right? And that little cross sign, that's integer addition?") . And anyway, he's a physicist, which means he has to do experiments to confirm the outcome of this "counting" thing, if it exists.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 01:17:23 PM EST
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I'm not a physicist, I'm a dilettante.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 13th, 2005 at 01:49:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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