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!grin!  sign me up for Frankfurt-am-Main...

reading between the lines I'm guessing local drivers are also aggressive, compounding the other problems?

sounds like what the city centre needs is a radical planning change-of-heart a la Curitiba.... (something like) a grid of "boulevards" rendered one-way by traffic barriers, to expand the road space shareable between mv and bikes;  light rail and buses with incentives for ridership and disincentives for driving;  and some kind of emissions regs to discourage the dirty engines.  breathing stinky filth is very discouraging for cyclists and peds, and though studies tell us that the occupants of the car may be even more heavily exposed to the nasty stuff than those outside it, it's small consolation...

sorry to hear urban form is so maladaptive there.  but imho the solution is never to pave over even more open land and build more and more roads, a whole parallel network for bikes -- it is to take space away from the private auto  and give it to other transport modes...  the problem with trying to accommodate the ever growing private-auto fleet is that it not only takes up an enormous amount of public space, it discourages and displaces more efficient transit modes as you report.


The difference between theory and practise in practise ...

by DeAnander (de_at_daclarke_dot_org) on Fri Jul 8th, 2005 at 05:50:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yep, local drivers are indeed aggressive, and not just aggressive, but generally assume that roads are there only for them (pedestrians are sometimes honked at even at crossings!). However, the main problem is the narrowness and crampedness of inner city roads: there is barely space between the cars.

imho the solution is never to pave over even more open land and build more and more roads, a whole parallel network for bikes -- it is to take space away from the private auto

Well, that was kind of my point, with our 'maladaptive urban form': there simply is no open land within city limits for bike roads, it has to be taken away from car roads :-) And that's exactly what cities like Stockholm, Amsterdam or Frankfurt started to do from about the eighties, but which was done only in a partial lackluster way here.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Sat Jul 9th, 2005 at 11:29:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You mentioned light rail - so, by the way, my city has an extensive light rail network, and the world's busiest tramway line. On it the world's longest tramway trains (two long articulated units coupled) follow each other almost at stopping distance at rush hour. However, this is nothing to be proud of, instead it is again a sign of lack of investment into upgrading public transport even just to needs: a subway line should have been built along its way (along an orbital road) to take away the bulk of the traffic. At least, the city is now buying new tramways for this line (again the world's longest units).

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Sat Jul 9th, 2005 at 11:41:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Two more issues. The stinky engines, I suspect, aren't yet puhed our rigorously from kind of a 'social' thinking: these cars are owned by poor people.

Second, radical re-thinking in Western Europe was kind of forced by the fixed width of main roads - at the stage the entire width of the streets were used up, traffic just didn't have any more places to grow into, yet car ownership was further increasing - and regrettably we in the East didn't use the fall of communism as a chance to apply their lessons, but are continuing to repeat the learing curve with a delay.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Sat Jul 9th, 2005 at 11:51:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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