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    I have a bit of a problem with the idea that consumer demand needs to be stimulated. Is it possible that people are not spending money because the are content with what they have? Does saving have to be the result of being discouraged about the economy? I have been in debt (and to some extent remain there), and the experience was not particularly enjoyable. In my opinion keeping a car or clothing until it is worn out is a sign of wisdom, not discouragement. I guess it is the result of the decision that "Greed is good", if we can only get people to want much more than they need the economy will grow. I suppose contentment is only fashionable when it can be accessorized.
by toad on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 02:05:31 AM EST
I agree with you there. What's wrong about living within our means and enjoying what we have? Funny that people are considered "unconfident" because they are not borrowing our spending themselves into debt. What's wrong with that picture?

TGeraghty, thank you for this excellent piece! It's nice to see our front pages of good news about France and Germany! "Confidence" is a psychological thing...if we start to talk more publicly about the good things that exist and are happening in Europe, people will start to feel better and more confident (even if they don't trust the political class...though this gap seemingly must be addressed, at some point),

Half the population is under the age of 18. Tanzania's future is NOW...join the 50% campaign!

by whataboutbob on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 02:50:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I agree with you too. And I am also wondering if this saving is not just ingrained in their mentality. There used to be even songs like: "Schaffe, schaffe Häusle baue und nit noch de Mädle schaue..." sort of like - working, working, building a house and don't look after the girls. I am not up-to-date if they still have that kind of songs, but I do belief it is or at least used to be quite symbolic.
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 02:58:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I am also wondering if this saving is not just ingrained in their mentality.

N-n-n-n-o, I don't think so. The current phenomenon is deffinitely a change from the nineties.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 07:06:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I am also wondering if this saving is not just ingrained in their mentality.

- N-n-n-n-o, I don't think so. The current phenomenon is deffinitely a change from the nineties.

Fran's comment might be a bit exaggerated, but actually I think it is not too far off the mark. German consume society has some deficiencies which stem from its lacking and multiply fractured historical tradition.

During the last century, whenever economic crisis became severe, one of the first ideas that were thrown overboard, was that of the comsume society. Moreover, the beginning of the consume model was quite late, compared to other western industrial countries (first of all, of course, the US). It began in the 1920s but failed to establish itself before 1929 when the World Economic Crisis, in Germany aggravated by several extraeconomic factors, wiped it out. It tried a new start in the 1930s under the NS regime and was, for a short period, very successful. But the the NS war economy, especially since 1942, again cut it short.

Consume society returned no earlier than mid-1950s and now was, as it seemed, strong enough to survive economic and political crises (as, for example, the oil crisis in the 70s). But, to be honest, I am not so sure if confidence in the consume model has grown sufficient roots in German mass psychology.

Thinking about writing a diary about the issue.

by Saturday (geckes(at)gmx.net) on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 08:33:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Now, you are talking to someone who is not a big fan of consumer society :-)

But thanks for supplying the historical outlook.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 09:49:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Actually our relationship to consumer society is not so different. I'm not a big fan either. But the more I committed myself to my country's economic-political history, the more I learned to appreciate the "American" model of consumer society. At least to some degree :-)
by Saturday (geckes(at)gmx.net) on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 11:24:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
My development was the opposite - and mostly based on studying that "American" model :-)

(In the early nineties, I even had the idea that multinational corporations, while problematic on other fronts, might eventually spell the end of wars - how naive I was...)

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 11:49:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If you want balanced economic growth, demand must increase with productivity. That means some combination of growth in consumption, investment, government spending (or tax cuts), and exports.

Exports are already doing quite nicely, there are limits to what government can do, and businesses tend not to want to invest today unless there is the strong prospect that people will buy their products tomorrow.

So, yes, I think consumption growth and increased consumer confidence are part of the answer to re-start economic growth.

Having said that, I think there is a middle ground between where Germany is now and the debt-ridden consumer society of, say, the US, where Europe should not want to go.

by TGeraghty on Sat Aug 20th, 2005 at 04:26:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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