Display:
The Blairites seem to fetishize introducing some market mechanisms as a way to make public spending more efficient

...or that's what they claim. However, this creeping privatisation never worked out as such. Rail privatisation was a mess that required large state bailouts, some PPP projects like the Channel Tunnel Rail Link pushed up prices in advance (i.e. once it got to signing contracts it was slated to cost a lot, which takes away the plua in the fact that during construction there were no cost overruns), the idiotic London Underground PPP scheme (forced through by NuLab against great opposition - there they showed resolve...) hasn't brought anything that wouldn't go without the privates (most of the recent improvements can be credited to the public management). Similar attempts in hospitals only led to cost increases, and I am the angriest about schools - where Bliar allowed (again against great opposition) a small network of private creationist schools to be established, in this idiocy Britain overtook even the USA.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 04:02:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Larry Elliott wrote a piece in yesterday's Guardian.

A passage I particularly like:

If the government is really ready to change course, there would be no better place to start than with a radical rethink of the PFI. Britain is an immeasurably wealthier country than it was when loving attention was paid to the detail of schools, health centres and public housing of the 1930s. The government is forever boasting about how the UK is now the fourth biggest economy in the world, so there is no obvious reason why we can no longer afford what was deemed essential for the public realm then.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 04:19:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The article isn't bad but that passage shows a serious level of historical illiteracy. 'Loving attention' in the thirties? Is he kidding?  First of all the really big push for the creation of the welfare state came after WWII - that includes all aspects, but especially health care. Secondly, and more seriously, it ignores what living standards were like back then. If the government wanted to provide what was decent quality health care and infrastructure back sixty and seventy years ago it could slash its budget to the bone. Unfortunately I don't think too many people would be happy.

On a more general criticism - the history of public housing is rather poor. Neither the council estates of Britain, the HLM's of France, or the projects of the US are nice places to live.  Could they do better this time? Maybe. But I could certainly imagine public housing being one area where contracting out stuff wouldn't be a bad experiment.

Personal anecdote:
In Poland I lived in model workers' housing built by the Nazis in the thirties. For one person the apartment wasn't bad - more room than I needed, so-so otherwise. But it was intended for a family, and while it would certainly be livable for one, we're not talking particularly good living conditions.

by MarekNYC on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 05:02:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The current plan here is to force developers to provide a certain amount of affordable/public housing as part of their developments. At the beginning they had to build some on-site or offering parts of the development to the council at some discounted rate. Of course this drove both the developers and the asshole snobs batshit, and after a while donations in kind became acceptable. It's quite visible in the suburban estate I live in: there are a number of African immigrant/refugee families in what I suspect was social housing in the earlier phases and almost none in the later phases.

It's worse in the city, where I believe developers are offering social housing out in the sticks to offset exclusive development in the central area.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 05:10:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
the history of public housing is rather poor. Neither the council estates of Britain, the HLM's of France, or the projects of the US are nice places to live.

Still, it was better than nothing, better than the places poor workers lived in before. But should it have been done better? No question. Yet again, was it more of a money question or a planning question? I tend to believe the latter.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 05:40:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
One thing to remember is that HLM were a real progress when they were built. They had in-house plumbing, water and electricity, which were by no means a given back then. Remember that there was still a big slum (a bidonville, just like those you still have in South america nowadays) in Nanterre, just near where the ultra-modern high-rise district of La Défense is located (and where many of the workers who built the first towers of La Défense lived)

The problem seems more about how to keep these places functioning, clean and save after several decades. Maintenance and construction are not the same budget.

PFI grapples with the same issues - what kind of services will be provided for the duration? The HLMs show that rules or regulations from 20 years back are not always applicable - or enforced.

The problem is not public or private ownership, PFI or public housing - it's how to run these things over long periods when there is little benefit (political or monetary) for anyone to do it.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 05:49:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Of course, the worst example for public housing is what was done under the communist regime: the concrete block high-rises. Ugly, cramped, hot in the summer, you hear the neighbours across the walls, flat roof that leaks; and poor maintenance and security made them infamous places after 1989.

However, for a few brief years before and after the regime change, at least here in Hungary, things changed: newly built public housing became more liveable, with roofs and fewer floors and gardens and such.

Then again, a few years later, public housing construction came to a virtual standstill. And private investors on the housing market focus on rich customers. Thus the old concrete high-rises remain as affordable housing, one of ever lower quality.

Germany, of course, took a very different path: with incredible amounts of money, the construction of private homes and the dismantling of concrete block houses was supported.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 06:39:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Perhaps you have lived in different parts of the UK to me, MarekNYC. There are whole districts of housing built by the city councils of the thirties that even now provide pretty nice environments for their residents.

Of course, one real issue is that as Jerome notes, part of the reason many of these areas are still nice is perhaps that they passed out of council ownership in the post war period.

Likewise, there are a whole host of public buildings (swimming pools, health centres and the like) that have lasted seventy odd years. Sure, we're looking at replacing them now, but they provided a lot more value than the crumbling efforts of the sixties and seventies.

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 06:47:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I read that setting off public housing was the only success of the MacDonald minority government (the first Labour government) - and that was even earlier, in the twenties. However, Marek was probably more thinking of NHS, an Attlee government creation.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 07:15:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
it was not necessarily for the phrase "loving attention" (though I believe it's true that a great deal of serious attention was paid at the time to new public projects -- people believed in them as a new way forward).

It was for Elliott's pointing out that, if we're so wealthy now, why aren't we putting a commensurate amount of wealth into the public realm? His article focuses mainly on education, not the "welfare state". He's talking about how much we're willing to put into public education, and he's comparing to a time when the willingness was greater -- in relative terms, of course (your comparison, 30s/today, of the absolute sums invested omits to mention the enormous overall increase in wealth from then to now). And he's talking about a kind of pride in quality public infrastructure that was neglected in the 60s and 70s before being mugged and left for dead by Thatcherism in the 80s.

Essentially, he's saying that education belongs in the public realm, that it has been skimped on for far too long (including by New Labour's "harnessing" private capital), and that this must change. A1 for me.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 08:55:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
you misunderstood me. I'm not saying that they're right on their methods - that's why I said 'fetishize' - that's not an endorsement. I don't fully understand the health care changes, but from what I've read I'm skeptical. I'm simply saying that their aim is to make the welfare state work better, not to dismantle it. That in itself seems like a perfectly good objective. Nor do I necessarily mind introducing market mechanisms to achieve left wing aims. For example I rather like the idea of emissions trading. In other words I don't like either the insistence that all government programs could benefit from more capitalism nor the idea that using the market in government policy is always wrong.  Needs to be looked at carefully on a case by case basis.
by MarekNYC on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 04:45:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm simply saying that their aim is to make the welfare state work better, not to dismantle it.

But I said (admittedly, implicitely) that IMO that's not true. It is only claimed as the aim, but the real aim seems to be privatisation by stealth: what the Bliarites don't believe they can achieve outright, they achieve by selling it as improvement upon the welfare state.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Tue Aug 30th, 2005 at 05:34:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Display:
Login
. Make a new account
. Reset password
Recommended Diaries
Occasional Series