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I am honored that a rule would be put in place to exclude me specifically.

Shit, I'm disappointed and hurt.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:09:53 PM EST
Shame, that, considering how much you've contributed over there.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:22:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Truly sorry to hear that. Is everything set, I mean has a decision been made ?

When through hell, just keep going. W. Churchill
by Agnes a Paris on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:26:27 PM EST
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If they did need to put a rule in place to exclude you, you know what it means. As Talleyrand (not sure) said, the value of a man is measured by the number of his contenders.

When through hell, just keep going. W. Churchill
by Agnes a Paris on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:28:22 PM EST
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Insane.

You may be in Paris, but you've obviously shown a committment to Kos and have probably done more for American politics than many actual Americans.  I still think you don't fully appreciate or understand many things about our political system, but the same might be said for a good deal of American Kossacks...

Stupid Rule.  Markos is just afraid of having the France thing thrown in his face.  And here I was hoping we were over that whole "freedom fries" bullshit.

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:30:44 PM EST
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It would be nice if you substantiated that:


I still think you don't fully appreciate or understand many things about our political system

This is getting old.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:34:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Forget it.

I was trying to be supportive.

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:35:44 PM EST
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I saw that, and I am grateful. But there might be other reasons than ignorance for some of the things I write.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:58:52 PM EST
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Well, barred or not, you're still getting lots of nominations - even from people who read the exclusionary cause.

E.g.:

 I agree on Jerome (4+ / 0-)

I entered the thread expecting to see pro-Jerome sentiment and found it quickly.

Due to Kos' "within the borders" criterion, I realize my support of Jerome can only be honorary but I want to cast my vote that he is one of the best writers here for content, for style, and for breadth of topics.  And for policy, too.

If Jerome were from, say, Paris TX, I venture that his qualifications might actually be diminished.

I think Jerome adds an invaluable voice because his viewpoint helps to keep us from being too parochial.

by sawgrass727 on Tue Nov 28, 2006 at 08:13:03 PM FST



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 03:00:23 PM EST
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many thanks for digging that out, dvx. It is hard not to see things all black and white when experiencing a fresh disappointment, but contributions as yours help take some hindsight and put things into perspective.

As I say, one can never expect to get unanimity. And I feel there is a pretty wide consensus over here at ET on how valuable Jerome's contributions are. Okay, we are not DKos... yet ;-)

When through hell, just keep going. W. Churchill

by Agnes a Paris on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 04:58:50 PM EST
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On the other hand, I would imagine that a front-pager would feel obliged not to write anything that might be seen to undermine Kos' political strategy. So the bright side is that you can now post as many g_s t_x diaries and Iranian political cartoons as you want.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 02:32:25 PM EST
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Did you want to?

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 03:08:29 PM EST
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That's incredibly parochial. Although in many ways Kos is incredibly parochial. He's a very talented rabble-rouser, but he's been wrong or misguided about too many things for anyone to feel like his decisions are infallible.

If ET banned anyone in the US from being a front-pager it would seem very petty.

The 'We're a US site and non-US input is a bit suspect and not entirely welcome' vibe is getting a little stale.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 03:36:59 PM EST
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I think it's offensive, myself.  Especially since the rule seems to be specifically targeting Jerome.  I mean, sure, it's Kos's site, and he has the right to do with it as he sees fit, but I can't really understand why he'd bother to state that rule, other than to publicly insult Jerome.  Kos makes the final decision, and he's never felt it necessary to explain in any great detail why he hasn't selected specific individuals for FP status.  To preemtively do so now for a specific individual is just mean.

But maybe I'm a little touchy tonight.

All of that said... I don't really understand why Jerome would want to be a FPer at DKos, if for no other reason (and I can think of a few other reasons) than because of the time committment it would require, in addition to the time he already spends running this site, doing his actual paid job and taking care of his family.  It takes me an hour just to read the 900 comments on a single diary over there, 90 percent of which are usually not worth reading.

by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 04:05:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That's pretty much the way I feel.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 04:29:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Unless kos bans Jerome from dkos, Jerome still has the large audience he wants to reach. The rule isn't even parochial, it's dick waving.

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 05:05:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Finally, this is a site about American politics and will remain so. Apologies to our non-American friends, but foreigners don't have the standing to talk about our internal affairs the way Americans do. Thanks for any moral support and constructive criticism you might send our way, but ultimately, we have to take care of our own house.
Well, if took all your rabble-rousing and nearly becoming a front-pager last year for them to make it explicit. If you're not American they don't want to hear from you.

Those whom the Gods wish to destroy They first make mad. -- Euripides
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 04:33:10 PM EST
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Those lines jumped out at me too. They're actually insulting. "Foreigners" don't have "the standing". That says a lot for the Democratic America Kos thinks he wants to build. Isn't America the country where "foreigners" are integrated so well? Where it doesn't matter who you are or where you come from? Where you can have a Salvadoran mother and Greek father and be brought up in El Salvador and become a top political blogger?

Gah.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 04:50:49 PM EST
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I agree with you entirely.  It's chilling.
by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 04:58:11 PM EST
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Protectionism seems to run through American society.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 05:01:58 PM EST
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I was once told by my American [now ex-]girlfriend's relatives "if you don't intend to become a US citizen, shut up", and she thought it was funny, too, so I can imagine how Jerome feels.

Those whom the Gods wish to destroy They first make mad. -- Euripides
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 06:16:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I agree, this is a absolutely stupid rule - however, the bright side of this is that Jérôme will  have more time for ET. :-)
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 05:08:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"Finally, this is a war about American politics and will remain so. Apologies to our non-American friends, but foreigners don't have the standing to talk about our internal affairs the way Americans do. Thanks for any moral support and constructive criticism you might send our way, but ultimately, we have to take care of our own house."

wonder how history would have been after that...

by oldfrog on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 08:04:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That's what the Bushites told NATO in 2001 about Afghanistan: "thanks, you're cute, but no, thanks", and we've seen how that turned out.

It's all totally in character.

Those whom the Gods wish to destroy They first make mad. -- Euripides

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 04:03:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I must say that i was amused by the discussion between you and Welshman over there, although what was being said seemed to be going right over everyones heads.

It is disappointing to see that you've been specifically excluded. They do seem to be missing out on an opportunity by not having you there, but it would have been a big decision to make whether you had enough time to put in the commitment that would have been required to be effective over there.

Unless you are physically banned there you still have the pulpit, and can choose to give of your time as you see fit, (and if he did ban you I'm sure that there are plenty of people who would end up stealing your writing from here and posting it, not mentioning any names) All you would be gaining by by getting front page status, is the equivalent of a tin badge that says I am important, and much time working at the coalface over ideas that are more than likely not your own.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 06:08:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That is so wrong on so many different levels in so many different ways it would take a treatise to fully expound it all.
by ATinNM on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 06:24:02 PM EST
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Last year the excuse was that 2006 was an election year.

Jerome signs "ET: bringing DKos to Europe" over there. I sincerely hope not.

Those whom the Gods wish to destroy They first make mad. -- Euripides

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 06:40:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah, I need to change that.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 07:04:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
So are you still considering another round of Energize America for yKos?
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 07:19:55 PM EST
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The Energize America crowd I consider friends. And most of the kossacks at YK06 were great. And it is a worthwhile project... etc...

Sigh. Does this sound like rationalisation?

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 07:28:18 PM EST
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No, it sounds like a good plan.

dKos is - luckily - very much more than Kos. Kos may be the ringmaster, but it's not his circus, and I get the impression, albeit from a distance, that YK06 proved that.

If you can spare the time and think it may get some policy traction, it's certainly worth pushing again, at least another couple of times.

YK08 maybe not so much, because they'll be in full election mode. But I'd guess '07 is the time to try to set some policy for that cycle, so missing it could be a lost opportunity.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 09:24:05 PM EST
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But you don't have the standing to talk about the US' broken policies, but "ultimatele, Americans have to take care of their own house".

The Energize America crowd could always create their own Scoop site, focusing on energy policy. "An inconvenient blog" or something like that ;-)

Those whom the Gods wish to destroy They first make mad. -- Euripides

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 03:57:39 AM EST
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I irreversibly cooled on that objective after Jerome's Iran Cartoon post and Kos came out the closet. T'was not a pretty sight.

Personally, I'm thru with posting on DailyKos. I only go there as part of the ET swarm to boost up recommendations or use it as an information source. I know Jerome has carved himself a reliable platform there, but really... how much insults, sly or direct, should a person take...

by Nomad on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 07:13:47 PM EST
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Jerome knows I disapprove of the ET swarm to recommend diaries. It's a manipulation of the recommendation system by a largish group of people not generally vested in DKos.

Those whom the Gods wish to destroy They first make mad. -- Euripides
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 03:55:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The insult was obvious and it was what made me come here finally and join. I'm glad to be here.
by Magnifico on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 01:28:57 AM EST
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Welcome. In the light of the dental work discussion upthread, I think you'll agree we could use a Magnifico round here!
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 01:50:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And we're glad to have you here.  Welcome!
by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 02:34:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Mag-ni-fi-co-o-o-o-o-o-oh — Queen, in Bohemian Rhapsody

Those whom the Gods wish to destroy They first make mad. -- Euripides
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 03:59:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I believe this is what Jerome is referring to:

Finally, this is a site about American politics and will remain so. Apologies to our non-American friends, but foreigners don't have the standing to talk about our internal affairs the way Americans do. Thanks for any moral support and constructive criticism you might send our way, but ultimately, we have to take care of our house
.

But...I don't see this "rule" blocking you from your ongoing contributions on energy, etc. You will still be an influence!!

"Once in awhile we get shown the light, in the strangest of places, if we look at it right" - Hunter/Garcia

by whataboutbob on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 03:48:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Never mind hon, we still love and honour you here. And this way we'll still get to see more of you.

Of course, given the contribution non-citizens have made, his attitude does seems a bit hypocritical. However, kos wouldn't be the first US site where I've seen variations of the idea that "foreigners don't understand and so should just STFU"; which is why I never joined The Big Orange in the first place.

That said, I confess I bristle when yanks come to the UK and bitch about our tasteless food, our useless plumbing, our lousy transport, our crappy small roads etc etc. Yea ? We know already. It's part of our charm, now give us your money and f*ck off home. So I guess it's part of the culture we gave 'em :-))

And anyway, have you really got the time to go round all the sites looking for dirt on republicans to bring to the site's attention ?

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Nov 29th, 2006 at 06:15:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It will be decades before the US myopic, navel-gazing mentality is overcome, if ever.  Most people automatically revert to the "self-sufficient" myth, that has perpetuated itself, in their self-contained little world.

That self-important attitude was always antidiluvian, but it is now untenable.  kos has fallen into the  arrogant self-importance of sudden fame and dkos will suffer for it.  I really don´t see the need, nor the admiration of it, other than sheer numbers.

Hope you bring your EA friends over to ET and forget the ungrateful ass.  The few worthwhile posters will miss you and come here to read, so don´t look back.  Europe´s work to be done is more than enough.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Thu Nov 30th, 2006 at 04:27:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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