OTOH, if we limit our analysis to the blowhards who actually get a broadcast voice, that voice in decidedly right-wing.
Objectively speaking of course, again imho, the center of gravity of the Democratic party, as far as OECD norms are concerned, is decidely center-right. Fai de bčn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant
if we limit our analysis to the blowhards who actually get a broadcast voice
... then we wouldn't be talking about the "average" Irish-American, would we?
Catholics used to vote Democratic because of social justice stuff, and a lot of them still do. Regarding Irish Americans' political leanings, my experience has been pretty much the opposite of yours. But as you said, that's anecdotal.
At any rate, I don't think you can possibly generalize to the political leanings of "Irish Americans," since the population is too large, too diffuse, too diverse and in most places too integrated into "mainstream" American society for their ethnic identity to have any bearing on their political identity. Unlike, for example, African Americans, there are few election-day issues that affect Irish Americans as a group, and would therefore drive them to vote as a bloc, at least not on a national level. I would submit that there is no "Irish American" political identity, with the possible exceptions of Boston and a few other cities.
On the center of gravity in the Democratic party, of course, you are entirely right. Er, correct.
Catholics used to vote Democratic because of social justice stuff, and a lot of them still do.
I'm not up on US social history as much as I should be I guess, but seems to me there was a Tammany Hall Democrat element to why many "ethnics" in the US voted for the Democratic party. Patronage and whatnot. Not a bad plan back in those days of discrimination.
I imagine those who still do, given the weakening (but certainly not disappearance) of patronage machines in US cities, do so for reasons to which you allude.
There is, however, the phenomena of the so-called "Reagan Democrat" to contend with, though. I suspect if one imagines a density map of Reagan Democrats in the US, and overlay it with fans of the Notre Dame Fighting Irish, we might see a pretty good correlation... Fai de bčn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant
Maybe you think Reagan was Irish-Catholic? Despite the name, he certainly was not!
And Pat Buchanan too. Fai de bčn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant
It's the ones who moved to America, and forget their class roots, I have an issue with. And I've cited some of the more famous examples, too. Far more religious than their cousins still in Ireland. Prickly as well.
But we all know it's ok to say frog all one likes you see, but throw out an aspersion on the Irish-American community and, well, you've uttered some fighting words, eh? Fai de bčn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant
While our country had some misguided angst toward France because of the war, I don't know of any of French-Americans who get a lot of shit. I'm from St. Louis, where there are a lot of people with French heritage, most of the place names are French, and there are even old French settlements. Never heard anyone get shit about it.
Irish Americans, however were historically segregated and subject to institutional racism in America. When my great grandfather came here, there were signs on buildings "No Irish Allowed." It was legal for people to refuse to hire the Irish. My grandfather went out of his way to hire and help African Americans, long before the Civil Rights movement, precisely because of what his own father went through. He knew the racism was bullshit.
And to this day, there persists a stereotype of Irish Americans as corrupt, working class, etc. Certainly nothing to the extent that it was, but here in Chicago, well, the Daleys aren't doing anything to improve the situation.
So, yeah, you don't mess with the Irish. Sorry.
You should rent the movie, "In America." Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire
I thought not.
We're talking current affairs, not the history of our grandparents' grandparents.
How 'bout "No blacks allowed"...that's right, that's still going on, less obvious than before, but going on all the same. Didn't stop those Irish-American Catholics from voting overwhelmingly for Ronald Reagan, he who popularized the term welfare queen, what with its racial overtones. That's right, once you get yours, you forget about those who are still in line, don't you?
As for French being thought of poorly, I'm first generation. In fact, I'm a dual citizen, and my wife is only now getting 'round to naturalizing US. We speak French at home, I did growing up, and I do with my kids and wife now. We also speak it occasioanlly out in the real world. And I can tell you, it wasn't too cool to be speaking French while waiting in line at the grocery store three years back. Suddenly, total strangers had an opinion of you, and they were quite willing to let you know what it was. Fai de bčn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant
Pot meet kettle... Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire
Again, this is offensive. It's not Irish, just Irish Americans you have an issue with, eh? You are talking about 34 million people, not a few talking heads on tv and some people you met. That's practically the population of Poland. If you have an issue with that many people, that falls along ethnic lines, that sounds like racism. Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire
Have nothing to do with ethnicity, and everything to do with ideology. Fai de bčn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant
whaddaya think? Fai de bčn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant
