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Hey forgive me too. The above was, again, a joke, and a slightly cruel one, I'll admit.

I don't have an "answer". I think there are some points worth making, even if there are real consequences which would cause us not to make such points in other circumstances (and which I acknowledge). I also think that the issue is not going to go away and that it is simpler to take a stand now.
It's not a matter of certainty, it's my opinion today, I very much think it is right but I don't know for sure - and that's the whole point of this debate, to have some perspective, and all of you guys have provided a lot of it, for which I am grateful even if I argue against some of the arguments provided.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 06:07:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Which is why Jérôme doesn't qualify as a fundamentalist: he allows for the possibility of error.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 06:09:57 AM EST
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To reiterate Fran's quote: "The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool"
by Nomad on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:06:32 AM EST
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The question is : does he allow for the possibility of an error for the others as well as for himself ? :) I'd say he does, and that's why we like him.

I guess the reason why sometimes some of us over-react to snarks is that irony  always carries a part of truth with itself. That's what Kundera wrote in one of his novels. Irony is sometimes a way to make one's point while disguising a direct confrontation.

When through hell, just keep going. W. Churchill
by Agnes a Paris on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:16:08 AM EST
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Irony is sometimes a way to make one's point while disguising a direct confrontation.

Really?

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:18:29 AM EST
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Okay, Okay, still sometimes it is good to kick open already open doors (rusty translation again).
What's the equivalent English for that saying ?

When through hell, just keep going. W. Churchill
by Agnes a Paris on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:20:45 AM EST
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Beating on a dead horse.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:22:39 AM EST
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Flogging a dead horse.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:23:43 AM EST
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by Sirocco (sirocco2005ATgmail.com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:43:17 AM EST
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You don't seem like the epitome of self-doubt here:
So what should that school do? I'd like to hear from those that argued that the cartoons were needlessly provovcative: how would YOU react to the demands?
But I may have misunderstood, too. So forgive me if I did.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 06:13:08 AM EST
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How on earth can asking a question be taken as a proof of certainty???

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 06:23:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"see, I was right! How would you react to this one?"

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 06:25:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
When you read my posts, you should always be in doubt whether I am writing seriously, as a rhetorical point, in jest or in snark. Doubt is good. It makes you ask questions.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 06:29:45 AM EST
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You should apply yourself the advice you give me, and make <snark> explicit.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 06:54:45 AM EST
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Jérôme, you cannot be serious demanding that. Trust is the line you have to draw and not go beyond : if we have to wonder all the time whether what you say is serious or a slighjtly provocative joke, how can limited (and touchy) minds  as mine not feel at a loss ?

When through hell, just keep going. W. Churchill
by Agnes a Paris on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:10:51 AM EST
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Jerome's mine field - step in at your own peril.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:14:11 AM EST
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You are right. It is a good exercise.
One's value is to be assessed by the number of contenders, not of supporters.

When through hell, just keep going. W. Churchill
by Agnes a Paris on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:23:22 AM EST
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Quality is better than quantity.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 15th, 2006 at 07:27:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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