Display:
All interesting points (in particular the sociological explanation of the discrepancy between census and "independent" studies)!

But now I've got to make a joke, a bad one preferably, because on topics such as this, which like Israel/Palestine diaries are traps for anyone getting too involved, joking is the easiest way to comment without commenting.

So I'd just like to say that the Czech Rep., Slovakia, Hungary, Bulgaria may have large numbers of gypsies in their population, but in France we have the best of the best, we have the Gypsy Kings.

ps: anything after the first sentence in my comment is not addressed to you in particular, DoDo

by Alex in Toulouse on Tue Apr 18th, 2006 at 09:11:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Now time for a real comment.

In France, gypsies, or gitans, are nicknamed in a somewhat pejorative manner "manouches". Administrative properspeak is "gens du voyage", which could translate as "the nomads" but is closer to "people that are into travelling". This is another one of these politically correct expressions, just like "personnes à mobilité réduite" (people with reduced mobility) is another one for handicapped people in wheelchairs.

All towns in France are required by law to provide parking spaces for gypsies, and seeing how a town goes about providing this space generally gives a good indication of what the mayor thinks of them. Sometimes the spaces are nice, near parks. But generally they are near garbage dumps, in floodable areas of land near rivers, etc. If gypsies do not like the arragement that is provided to them, they can't invade other areas as these are craftily blocked by towns (for example a height limitation horizontal bar will be placd at the entrance of another parking place in town to prevent caravans from entering).

In larger towns the municipality must caretake mobile education and doctors for gypsy youths.

In general, gypsies keep to themselves, but are widely distrusted, seen as thieves etc. A farmer who sees a gypsy group park near his farm will start blaming them if eggs get stolen from his hatchery. But not to them directly, to visitors, friends and family. Because no one is manly enough to challenge the source of one's prejudice.

Recently the town of Perpignan was the scene of street fighting between French Arabs and French Gypsies (I added "French" here because I frankly don't know why we should call them Arabs or Gypsies).

What else can I say? The cigarette brand "gitanes" may popularly convey French culture, but I can assure you that no one thinks of it as relating to the actual "gitans" (gypsies) behind the name.

The only thing I dislike about gypsies is the mess they leave behind them (litter etc) when they move on to the next town. But this is not something I direct specifically at them. Tourists do the same, drunken youths do the same ...

by Alex in Toulouse on Tue Apr 18th, 2006 at 09:30:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Somewhere in Southern France, near a small village, Gypsies hold a regular (every year, ever four years?) big gathering, with tens of thousands attending. I can't recall more details (but vaguely I recall as if it were a Christian festival) - maybe you know what and where this is?

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Tue Apr 18th, 2006 at 10:07:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by Alex in Toulouse on Tue Apr 18th, 2006 at 10:29:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
At Sainte-Maries-de-la-Mer the Roma venerate Saint Sarah, a black virgin. I wonder how this is related to the Catalan Virgin of Montserrat, the Swiss Virgin of Einsiedeln, or the  "Black Madonna" of Czestochowa. Just how many black Virgins are there in European Christianity?

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Apr 18th, 2006 at 11:46:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I agree, it's quite amazing. Maybe it's balanced with all the Africans who worship a white virgin.

sidenote: do you know of anyone who worships Jesus as a Palestinian Arab?

by Alex in Toulouse on Tue Apr 18th, 2006 at 03:57:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Display:
Login
. Make a new account
. Reset password
Occasional Series