Display:
It's certainly possible that a scenario of euro's replacing dollars will play out (or a shift in that direction), but let's look at this from strictly an investment standpoint to see other criterion that will be used in making this decision.
  1.  What is the creditworthiness of the US versus the EU?  One criterion to answer this question is how does each parties' current debt compare to their current income?  As this graph from the OECD shows, the US debt has fallen from roughly 75% to just below 65% of GDP from 1995 to 2004.  During the same period, Euro area debt has risen slightly, to just under 80%.  Euro debt load is 80% of their income versus 65% for the US, as of '04.  Advantage clearly to the US.
  2.  What is income, or GDP, growth like in the two areas.
    Real GDP growth


Average annual growth in percentage, 1991-2004

The OECD chart does not show a Euro summary here, but we note that the largest economies supporting the Euro, France, Germany, and Italy, all show GDP growth below 2%.  Meanwhile the US shows GDP growth of close to 3.5%.  Advantage clearly to the US.  This trend continued in '05 and appears to be continuing in '06.
3.  What is the situation with the budget deficit on an annual basis, which shows each areas ability to live within their means?  The OECD graph shows the Euro area averaging budget deficits of just over 3% from '02 through '04, while the US is running about 3.5% over that timeframe.  However, here, while I have not been able to quickly find '05 figures, I would imagine US will run a larger deficit, perhaps 4.5--5.5%, while I would imagine the EU stays at just over 3%.  This would be primarily due to the Iraqi war, but also increases in social spending and tax cuts in the US.  US forward looking budget defecits call for this getting back into line, but this is an issue that leans to the Euro.

Other issues could play into this.  The US is currently running large defecits in their current accounts--ie. they are buying more things from abroad than they ares selling abroad.  This is currently being offset by investors willing to invest in Treasury bonds, which are roughly 5% for the 10 year bond; and in American assets such as the stock market.  This means that foreigners are buying more of the US debt, and more of American companies, than they have in the past.  And over the last 15 months the dollar has strengthened from 74 cents to the Euro to 82 cents today--though that shows a slight slippage from 84 cents over the several months.

So the argument is certainly not overwhelming that there will be a downfall of the dollar, and in fact I would suggest there is a pretty strong argument that investors will continue to choose to invest in the US, and in effect, support the dollar.  While their may be some imbalances, they may be corrected by the normal swings in exchange rates--Euro's versus dollars versus the yen versus other currencies.  There is also a reasonably strong financial reason for countries trading with the US to want to maintain a strong dollar.  The US current account deficit means that the US is buying a significant amount of manufactured goods from overseas.  A lowering of the value of the dollar would make foreign goods appear more expensive to American buyers, who would likely respond by cutting back on foreign goods and buying more American produced goods, and by cutting back on their spending habits in general.  (And of course it would make American exported goods look much cheaper to overseas customers).  This would have the desired effect of correcting the current account balance,,,,but likely for many countries would lower demand for their products, with all of the side effects that follow from that--certainly recessions in certain countries could result, including the US, and perhaps a global recession.

by wchurchill on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 05:37:58 AM EST
I consider the GDP figures suspect as most of the expansion in the US in the past 5 years has been in defense and security sectors (government employment), healthcare spending (massively out of line with international costs elsewhere) and the housing construction boom.   None of the sectors is actually "productive" in terms of future earnings potential and international competitiveness.  The US also supports a huge prison population which distorts unemployment statistics.

By contrast, although Europe has its problems the accession states will provide scope for a lot of future growth and employment, as well as prompting a realignment of old Europe industries toward more competitive footings.  And the grey economy is much bigger.

The OECD statistics don't capture reality fully.  An economist looks at the market in practice and wonders whether it works in theory.

by LondonYank (LondonYank (at) aol.com) on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 05:59:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And I certainly agree with your title, "it takes two views to make a market".  Imagine a financial world where everyone agreed that that the price of General Motors should be exactly $30 a share.
None of the sectors is actually "productive" in terms of future earnings potential and international competitiveness.
So, not surprisingly as you might imagine, I have a contrary view on this point.  I think US business has a significant market position and competitive advantage in three industries that will grow rapidly globally over the next 20 years: information technology, healthcare (more in the sense of drugs, medical devices, and biotech than in the sense of the provider side (hospitals, doctors and nurses) and in financial services.  There are strong worldwide trends that will drive each of these business segments in the forseeable future, and US business will benefit greatly from that.  These industries dominate the S&P 500, which is a broad view of the importance of industries in the US.  These three industries represent half of the S&P value
S&P 500 Industry weightings   

How various industries were represented in the S&P 500 as of Jan. 22:

Financials 18.2%
Information technology 18.2%
Health care 14.4%
Consumer discretionary 12.9%
Industrials 10.9%
Consumer staples 8.4%
Energy 6.1%
Telecommunications 5.3%
Utilities 3.1%
Materials 2.5%

Source: Standard & Poors

(My apologies that this data is from 2002, but it was all that I could quickly find, but I'm quite confident this is still roughly the picture today.  Also I realize that there are other measures of industry importance, but I just didn't have the time to track these down this afternoon.)  Most of these companies have very significant sales outside the US, so they are truly global in nature in terms of market, but primarily American owned today--but I expect more global ownership over the next two decades.

I do think European companies will do well because they are also global in nature, as will Asian non-Japan companies.  Right now investors believe US companies will do better, as reflected by the 17 P/E ratios in America versus the 13.5 P/E ratios in Europe (I would have to dig to pull that out, but I saw it in the last few days--sure I could find it with a little more tiime).  The higher P/E reflects investor expectations that those companies wil grow faster than lower P/E companies.

However, and here I am very much the contrarian on this site, I expect the overall GDP growth rates (not addressing equity issues with these comments) to remain higher in the US than the EU.  The EU has made political, social and economic choices that have limited their GDP growth over the timeframe shown by the OECD graphs, and that has continued in 2005 and early 2006.  This is not meant to be a criticism of those choices made by the EU.  Clearly there are lifestyle benefits enjoyed by Europeans that they value when they make these choices, and I think it's illogical for people outside those societies to criticise choices made by people in free democratic societies.  But choices involve tradeoffs, and policies that have led to a broader social net and more equality among income classes, IMHO, have also led to lower GDP growth and higher unemployment.  But it's not just coincidence that these numbers have been so consistent over the last 15 years, and the policies are not changing, so I don't expect the numbers to change.

by wchurchill on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 05:07:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Here are some comments on the healthcare and technology industries from a post, Significant growth over next 5 years , last September.
IMO two western industries will do especially well, and I mentioned this in an earlier post.  Those industries were information technology and health care (where I used medical devices as the example, and specifically the endovascular segment of this industry).  Demographics in Western countries and increasing wealth in developing countries will lead to rapid growth in healthcare, and many life savings products and technologies.  The technology base in healthcare is incredible right now to support new innovation, with gene structure information available and many new tools available to exploit that data base.  Minimally innvasive technology forms a wonderful base for miniaturized chips and "machines" to be placed in the body for diagnostic and therapeutic purposes.

In technololgy, there is the same type of opportunity in the sense of a wonderful existing base of technologies, tremendous opportunities to improve productivity in general industries by using these new technologyies, which is a key driver of improving GDP per capita.  Asia is heavily involved both as a consumer and a producer.  Both technology and healthcare are truely world wide markets.

by wchurchill on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 06:27:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]



In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 07:02:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
This is another one of our fundamental economic disagreements--we have two or three, I don't think many more than that.  I expect the US to run current account deficits for the coming years, particularly as the baby boomers retire.  I think today's situation is a little unnatural due to the yuan being artificially devalued through central control in China, but that will likely be corrected over the next three years or so.  but there will still be a current account deficit.  

Americans will sell their investments to cover their retirement and other spending.  American companies, many of whom already receive half or more of their profits from doing business outside the US, will be bought be "foreign" investors, and thus have much more foreign ownership.  Treasury bills will also continue to be bought by foreign investors, as long as the government has a plan to manage the annual deficit--which it does and it's laid out in the long term US budget projections--, the plan seems doable, and the plan is basically achieved over the years.  Investors will simply not ignore the fact that the debt/GDP ratio for EU members is significantly higher than the US.  If the US falters on its long term budget projections---well, that's a different story, and investors, such as me, will move more and more of our investments to the EU and Asia.  But my view today is that capital account surpluses in the US will have no problem covering current account deficits--and what's wrong if the US simply maintains a ratio of Debt/GDP that is lower than the EU (and that means a lot more borrowing due to GDP growth), and what's wrong if these American companies that are so global anyway are owned more and more by people outside of America.  This trend will not go on forever, but it will for quite a while.

by wchurchill on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 05:22:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
...I know of these matters, and despite the instructive post of yours, I also tend to agree with the points raised both by LondonYank and Jerome that the numbers upon which you build your "dollar confidence" are constructed on historical gains, and not on future projections. A smart investor looks ahead, not backward.

Thoughts?

by Nomad on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 02:36:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thank you for your comments.  Please note my responses to London Yank and Jerome above.  I agree with you that trending from the past does not necessarily lead to accurate projections of the future.  But the above questions and yours have allowed me to lay out more fully the reasons for my views of the future.  To LondonYank I basically responded that I see US GDP continuing to grow strongly because of US domination of key growth industries in the world.  I also briefly explained that I think the American economic system will drive faster growth than the EU.  I think the past does support this comment (though not prove it), because clearly the economic/social policies of the two areas are different, and my understanding of economics made me predict faster US than EU GDP growth 10 years ago--and since the policies followed by the two are not fundamentally changing, I expect that to continue.  I don't criticise the EU for its choices--they are fair choices and don't really hurt other countries.  In fact, it's to some degree a plus for other countries, because if this model can provide better economic results with the social benefits--hey, let's all do it.

As to the current account deficit, I'll don't think I can add to how I responded to Jerome.

by wchurchill on Sat Apr 22nd, 2006 at 05:46:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Display:
Login
. Make a new account
. Reset password
Recommended Diaries
Clipping the wings of a judge
by Migeru - Feb 10
31 comments

Hunger March wins PR battle
by DoDo - Feb 9
3 comments

Romania: protests change government
by DoDo - Feb 8
6 comments

Sarkozy: Enemies Ahoy!
by afew - Feb 10
18 comments

Murdoch - Outsourcing and Hubris
by ceebs - Feb 3
18 comments

Obama wins GOP Primaries (to date)
by Frank Schnittger - Feb 8
8 comments

LQD: Unsustainable irrigation
by Melanchthon - Feb 9

Bristol Pound
by ChrisCook - Feb 7
14 comments

Recent Diaries
Sarkozy: Enemies Ahoy!
by afew - Feb 10
18 comments

Clipping the wings of a judge
by Migeru - Feb 10
31 comments

LQD: Unsustainable irrigation
by Melanchthon - Feb 9

Hunger March wins PR battle
by DoDo - Feb 9
3 comments

Obama wins GOP Primaries (to date)
by Frank Schnittger - Feb 8
8 comments

Romania: protests change government
by DoDo - Feb 8
6 comments

Answers to the Renewable Energy Consultation
by Luis de Sousa - Feb 7

Bristol Pound
by ChrisCook - Feb 7
14 comments

The Imitation Of Germany
by afew - Feb 4
31 comments

Strange Fruit
by Frank Schnittger - Feb 4
14 comments

Murdoch - Outsourcing and Hubris
by ceebs - Feb 3
18 comments

Mismatch with the Natural Gas Market
by Luis de Sousa - Feb 3
22 comments

The Future of Economics
by ARGeezer - Feb 2
191 comments

Desert Island Discs - Helen's distortions
by Helen - Jan 31
48 comments

Gorila
by DoDo - Jan 29
14 comments

Rail News Blogging #7
by DoDo - Jan 29
15 comments

Obama's State Of The Union: LQD
by Crazy Horse - Jan 25
74 comments

Democracy Technology
by gmoke - Jan 24
1 comment

The Hydrogen dream
by Luis de Sousa - Jan 24
49 comments

ET Paris Meet-Up 2012 (2 UPDATE)
by afew - Jan 23
113 comments

More Diaries...
Occasional Series