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Jerome. Why do France and Germany have a much lower disability rate among men than do the UK and Sweeden?

Hey, Grandma Moses started late!
by LEP (rafifoon@yahoo.com) on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 04:12:42 AM EST
Because they did not use disability as a way to push workers out of the jobs market painlessly?

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 04:15:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I posted this graph a while ago:



In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 04:19:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes LEP, the graph above does not mean that there are less people with disabilities in France than in the UK/Sweden, but that in France disabled people are not necessarily as encouraged to "take the pension and go home" as in the UK/Sweden. (that's for the case in which people must choose between getting the pension or being allowed to work).

Actually in France there are different levels of disability pension, some of which are compatible with work (you can then get the pension and still work at the same time).

This graph above overall means that disabled people are more likely to work in France, because the system lets them do just that.

by Alex in Toulouse on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 04:31:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
yes, in France, you need to be rated with more than 66% of disability to get a real disable pension, and it is very hard, people are very often rated 65% !!!!

by the way, we created something else : RMI, 700euros of minimum ressource for any person older than 25 yo.

there is always 1 or 2 millions that can not be employed, they just do fit the system.

by fredouil (fredouil@gmailgmailgmail.com) on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 04:59:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I this 700€ per month? Taxed?

Not bad, seems like you could almost live on that (outside large cities).


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 05:17:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So a French person who is on disability and also working would be classified as....How?
It seems, as Jerome points out above, some countries use disability as a statistical ruse to reduce the unemployment rate.

Hey, Grandma Moses started late!
by LEP (rafifoon@yahoo.com) on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 05:00:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well that person would be classified as a person with a disability pension of category such and such, and would actually have a good chance of finding a job because of quotas imposed on companies to recruit people with disabilities. Provided that this person lives in an area where opportunities exist (quotas not already filled up, not a too rural area, proper qualificiations etc).

But France may have an encouraging policy towards disability and employment, we're still far behind the UK when it comes to actually making life easier for people with disabilities. The new municipal library in Toulouse, the médiathèque, however, has done a great job for wheelchair access, braille books etc etc. But phone booths, public toilets, and even administration offices etc with proper access are still lagging.
 

by Alex in Toulouse on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 05:08:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We need to be clear on "disability". There are countless disabled people who can work and wish to work. In France, there are some incentives for employers to hire such people. They are simply classified as people at work, but the employer gets rebates on social contributions for them.

On the other hand, there's "incapacity", which means the person is medically considered unfit to work (until such time as the medical appraisal changes). Now that can be a "sink" for long-term unemployed persons the government would like to shunt off the unemployment stats. France doesn't do this; the UK has done a huge amount of it. (see these comments from the other day.)

ET has been in the forefront (long before McKinsey or the latest OECD report) in pointing out the importance of incapacity numbers in masking unemployment for propaganda purposes. Here is a diary I wrote about it last October.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 05:44:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Thanks afew. I just read your October diary. It explains a lot.

Hey, Grandma Moses started late!
by LEP (rafifoon@yahoo.com) on Thu Jun 15th, 2006 at 06:14:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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