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The United Kingdom was assembled over a thousand years or so. Breaking it up may involve unpicking a number of different unions. Changing it in other ways may produce a workable system of federation or devolution all round.

1. England (divided into regions). There were seven Anglo-Saxon Kingdoms which eventually got consolidated into England, with some other territories like Cornwall and Cumbria. Although those Kingdoms are not, as such, a current concern there is a regional feeling within England which has not really had much expression in government during the last thousand years. The attempts by central government to create English regions by drawing lines on a map rather than have the people define their own regions, has been a terrible setback. I suspect that given the chance regions would have been constructed largely based on one or more of the traditional counties. For example the three counties of Berkshire, Buckinghamshire and Oxfordshire have traditional links. They would form a more natural unit than as part of the vast South East Region to which they were assigned by government whim.

Of course the result of a bottom up regional policy would be more regions with smaller populations than Whitehall is comfortable with. They would also have to be given far greater powers than central government would want (I would suggest the minimum should be the powers the Scottish Parliament was given).

  1. England (as a whole). An English Parliament and Executive, whether as distinct bodies or a sub-set of the UK Parliament, (on the Scottish model) implies the speedy breakup of the United Kingdom. As I have previously suggested the only hope of avoiding this would be to elect the UK and English Parliaments by a proportional system, so it would be unlikely there would be a single party Labour UK government contending with a single party Conservative English executive.

  2. Anglo-Welsh union. Plaid Cymru exists but it is not clear that a majority of the Welsh would want independence.

  3. Anglo-Scottish union. The original Union deal was that England got security, because Scotland could no longer acquire a different Monarch from England or ally with English enemies, whereas Scotland got the economic advantages of free trade with England and its colonies. In modern circumstances neither of those objects requires the retention of an incorporating union. It is a matter for Scotland whether it wants independence. The ostensibly unionist Conservative Party has done much to weaken the union and its latest policy is lighting matches in a gunpowder factory. Cameron may do more to end the union than the SNP ever could.

  4. Anglo-Irish Union. The most problematic of the lot. Do we really want to end up with the United Kingdom of England and Northern Ireland? I suspect the default position of the loyalist community if that union was not on offer would be an independent Northern Ireland. I do not see that a United Kingdom of Scotland and Northern Ireland is likely but if everyone wanted it I am sure the English would be delighted to agree.
by Gary J on Tue Jul 4th, 2006 at 12:43:46 PM EST
The ostensibly unionist Conservative Party has done much to weaken the union and its latest policy is lighting matches in a gunpowder factory. Cameron may do more to end the union than the SNP ever could.

Which begs my question in today's breakfast... What's wrong with the Tories? Are they that desperate to get back to No. 10?

Nothing is 'mere'. — Richard P. Feynman

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jul 4th, 2006 at 12:50:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"What's wrong with the Tories? Are they that desperate to get back to No. 10"?

Yes.

The longer answer is that Cameron is imitating the worst part of Blair's governing style. Making major changes piecemeal with inadequate thought and consultation.

The Conservatives would prefer to go back to the pre-devolution status quo ante. As that is not going to happen why should they not engineer a country which they think they can keep control over?

The Conservative Party has for generations considered itself the party of the union, but at the same time they always considered Labour and Liberal majorities produced by non-English MPs as a bit illegitimate.

by Gary J on Tue Jul 4th, 2006 at 01:13:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I think if if Brown does make it to No. 10, he would be well-advised to sit down with Ming Campbell and introduce PR into the Westminster elections. If Labour could do it for London, Wales, Ulster and Scotland, it can do it for the UK.

Nothing is 'mere'. — Richard P. Feynman
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jul 4th, 2006 at 01:19:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
PR for the House of Commons should have been the core of the constitutional changes introduced since 1997. The fact that Labour preferred self interest to principle is the greatest missed opportunity since the Liberals made the same mistake in 1918.
by Gary J on Tue Jul 4th, 2006 at 01:28:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
amen to that. Short-term self-interest rules

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Jul 4th, 2006 at 03:53:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Don't know a damned thing about this issue but what I've observed.

I believe in free internet commerce, and getting the best price I can for what I buy.

Was buying pipes from a tobacconist in Edinburgh, Scotland. Scotch pass a law 1/06 banning smoking in public places. Guy more or less shut down.

Googled a bit. Found a great 4th generation tobacconist in Yorkshire. Get what I want at an even better price.

Think it's a bit about keeping officious fools out of our lives, our bedrooms, our lifestyle choices, and our EMails, among other things.

I live in Virginia, USA, by the way.

Keep to the Great North Road, Helen.

"When the abyss stares at me, it wets its pants." Brian Hopkins

by EricC on Tue Jul 4th, 2006 at 06:21:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
We're Scots not Scotch ( Scotch is a drink ).

Get it right.  

Money is a sign of Poverty - Culture Saying

by RogueTrooper on Wed Jul 5th, 2006 at 04:40:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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