What we can't do is act as if our own house is in order, which it's certainly not, or as if we are the model to which all others should aspire, because we're not.
We're talking about degrees here.
No, we're not. He said "the sexual environment is healthier," and I don't think that what I linked to is even remotely healthy. It's disturbing, as is much of the oversexualized environment within which nine-year-olds wear fishnet tights and corsets for Halloween.
And, uh, finally, I don't think I'm being terribly defensive. I have not for a single second said that folks in this part of the world are doing things the "right way" and everybody else needs to listen up and start behaving. But that's essentially what's been said to me. If you want defensive, I can hook you up, because there is a much stronger reaction to that kind of attitude than the one I've taken, and it would be not-uncalled-for at this point.
Woah! I think there is a common position here:
"X society is not perfect and we already have information that could make it better."
But then we get, "So country Y could learn from country X"
Or is it "Country X could learn from country Y"?
Or is it "They could both learn from each other"?
Or is there even, maybe, a mythical country that at least one of the people arguing is also implying exits, the one the other two are supposed to become--in the ideal world; then one of the arguers says, "The place that I think [insert their country of choice here] is closer to, in some respects--"
"But further from in other respects--" says the other arguer.
My preferred option in these kinds of arguments would be for each side to admit their own weaknesses and applaud the strengths of the other side.
I know that becomes impossible because of politics, but a rule could be applied: "You are not allowed to say anything good about your preferred country, only bad things."
(Heh! I can imagine it. "In our country, we're just too nice! We take criticism too well! We're just too damned wonderful, it pisses everyone off!" Well, okay, not that. More likely: "We have been slacking in introducing genuine organic healthy meals free to all children under the age of sixteen; they have made a step forward by no longer torturing four year olds--they have now raised the lower limit to five")
(I imagine the "religious cartoons" argument had a similar trajectory--it'd be interesting (for me) and maybe useful to go one step "meta" and deconstruct the arguments to see what's underneath--I know, I know, I've wandered into an argument....I'll go to the bar. Anyone want a drink?)
(Saw a woman in her fifties in the pub last night. She'd asked, probably, for "a bottle of sparkling water." This is a drinkers' pub, so they had to search in the basement, but they found a bottle--not chilled, of course. The barman handed it to her. She held it up, turned it, pulled a face like it was mouldy, then said, "Okay, well, I suppose it's water." So yeah! Or I can recommend the...er...it's a pub....hmmmm....maybe--okay I'll risk the idea of "a cup of tea"--I have tea bags! All we need is a kettle and some cups!)
</strange interlude> Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.
