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But ignoring that difference for a minute, consumption is just the demand at the "equilibrium" point. Nobody is counting all the times someone goes and says "gee, I want to buy some more of this but it's too expensive" or "gee, I wanted to buy some more of this but the shelves were empty" and so the demand curve is unobserved (unobservable?). Similarly with the supply curve.

In the simple equilibrium models of textbook economics, individuals do not set the price (both for consumption and production). The times that someone did not consume don't matter, because someone else will. Same for production.

AFAIK...

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 11:53:03 AM EST
So, in simple equilibrium models, are the variables of interest consumption and production instead of demand and supply?

The only market where anything like textbook supply and demand applies is a Dutch auction. Er, well, nearly

Dutch auction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This type of auction is convenient when it is important to auction goods quickly, since a sale never requires more than one bid. Theoretically, the bidding strategy and results of this auction are equivalent to those in a Sealed first-price auction; however, experiment indicates that a Dutch auction typically results in lower sale prices [1].


We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 12:26:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
No, they are supply and demand, I'm just substituting. I think a Dutch auction is not a textbook example of a market where there is no price-setting because there is only a small number of suppliers (at a single auction).

See perfect competition.

Theoretically, the 'lead time' it takes for a producer to change supply to deal with shifting demand is not relevant on a market when there is a sufficiently large number of producers and consumers (there also is no real shifting demand on a market with perfect competition).

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 12:54:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
How is the supply curve measured? Ditto for the demand curve.

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 02:02:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The demand curve measures what happens to the price if there is a shift in supply and the supply curve what happens if there is a shift in demand :-)
by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 02:27:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The curves don't measure anything: they express relationships. How are the relationships measured so they can be expressed by curves?

When people talk of a "shift" in demand or supply they normally refer to a movement of the whole curve. So half the time "demand" refers to the whole "demand curve" and the rest of the time it refers to a quantity (apparently, to "consumption"). Similarly Supply" can refer to "supply curve" or to "production".

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 04:06:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The curves are part of a model, the model expresses idealised relationships. How these are measured seems to be an empirical question?
by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 05:00:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Empirical questions seem to fall outside economics.

The point is, of the model only the intersection of the curves, that is, the clearing price and the production = supply = demand = consumption are observable.

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Nov 10th, 2007 at 05:07:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, and it is important to distinguish a theoretical construct intended to predict patterns of results, from a predictive scheme that gathers and crunches data, outputting numbers and dates. To be a falsifiable scientific theory, the former need only predict what patterns of behavior may occur (or equivalently, what patterns won't occur).

The idea that economic theory is necessarily about prediction, like celestial mechanics applied to planets, is the source of much confusion. "Economists can't predict recessions, so what do they know?" The answer is that, in principle, they could know a lot, yet never predict a price or an economic fluctuation.

That economists commonly think they know many things that aren't actually true is a different issue.

Words and ideas I offer here may be used freely and without attribution.

by technopolitical on Sun Nov 11th, 2007 at 02:34:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Forget about prediction. If the demand and supply curves cannot be observed the theory doesn't even describe what is observed.

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Nov 11th, 2007 at 04:27:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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