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No-no, what I'm saying is that Islam in the middle east, and the eleventh century in Catholic Europe, saw the reapparition of the city. Whether in the form of the city-state in Northern Italy, or as part of an empire in Islam : the important thing is the concentration of people in the city.

After the Renaissance, the city slowly lost its political independence, but by that time it was ruling the world : in the middle age the nobility was living in its castle in the countryside ; in the 18th century it was living in luxurious hostels in the city.

Indeed the first intellectual evolutions appeared in Mesopotamia, at the time of the Sumerians which seems to have been of the city state ; Greeks were organized along city-state lines but the Hellenistic period (i.e. empires left over after the death of Alexander the Great) had the emperor-as-deity, yet saw the summits of Greek thoughts.

Romans are boring, have little litterature and next to no philosophy and science. It's not amazing the Roman intelligentsia spoke in Greek, not in Latin.

As for the mongols, because they had destroyed the Arab middleman between Europe and China, and instituted peace in Central Asia, they made possible the coming of Europeans in Cambaluk ; i.e. Marco Polo. Europeans who brought back the plague when coming back...

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Mon Jun 25th, 2007 at 05:04:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Romans. Didn't they invent concrete? First use of the spherical dome? Lovely aqueducts. Good artists (the house of the mysteries in Pompeii). Fantastic roads.
Romans were builders.
by bil on Tue Jun 26th, 2007 at 09:55:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I agree, the Romans were good builders ; but that's most of it. As for the artists, the thing is, Pompeii has almost all of what's left of Antiquity paintings ; we have nothing left from Greece, which was quite great as the history books tell us. But we're left "admiring" second rate pulp artistry on vases.

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Tue Jun 26th, 2007 at 10:22:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
As I understand it, the romans applied previously known techniques, so they were developers but not inventors.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concrete#History

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vault_(architecture)#Dome

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acqueduct

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road#History

(Hey, you got me thinking...)

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Jun 26th, 2007 at 11:15:47 AM EST
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