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Is the point of a job to provide social status to the employee or to actually accomplish something useful for society ?

What's the point of the former definition - which seems to be the one used here ?

The probleme with unemployment isn't the jobless wanting jobs, it's the jobless wanting money.

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Tue Oct 7th, 2008 at 09:32:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The need to have enough money is an issue but even to have a job in itself is an important thing in terms of people 'feeling useful' and having something to do.

Unemployment increases the likelihood of depression and that isn't just a money related issue but stems from having nothing to do.  Being a bag filler isn't necessarily an alternative nor is any random pointless 'job' but nor does that mean that the aim of job creation should be written off.

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Tue Oct 7th, 2008 at 09:43:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What about teaching people to occupy themselves so that they can fill their days with something else than work and TV ? (which is also easier with a bit more money than given on many unemployment benefits)

There are many ways to "feel useful" that don't require the exchanges of power and time required by employment. There are -used to be- many channels of social contact available, beyond employment.

We're building a society where "holding a job" becomes the only avenue of social interaction and fulfillment. The problem is that "holding a job" is a lousy way of social interaction and fulfillment - work can become an tension filled environment where friendships are hard to form ; fulfillment is not so easy to come by when doing someone else's bidding.

And our capitalist societies aren't shaped to provide "good jobs for everybody" ; the producticity requirement in much of private employment, the fact employers want full time employees, and that our automatising societies don't require as much human labour as it used to, converge towards more and more unemployment.

We can decide to force our societies into the full employment paradigm of the twentieth century, or try to change them towards a different paradigm - did you see Martin's diary about Basic Income ?

The rentier of the 19th century didn't seem so depressed about not being productive...


Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Tue Oct 7th, 2008 at 10:14:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Haven't seen Martin's diary, I'll try and take a look soon.

I agree that there are other ways of being engaged and useful but the challenge is changing societies where it is a badge of honour to appear on daytime tv shows like Jeremy Kyle - think Jerry Springer...

It's a problem that is so deeply ingrained in the UK that I can't work out where it begins or ends or where it isn't.  It ties in with everything, the education system, the principles of 'welfare', inequalities, employment...

The scenario you wish to present - how do you shift the paradigm to begin to move towards that?

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Tue Oct 7th, 2008 at 10:33:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]
See Martin's diary...

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Tue Oct 7th, 2008 at 10:34:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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