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Tax cuts are fairly instant - maybe one of the fastest stimulii - but have to be short term only.

I was watching 'Flood' DVD yesterday - the first UK catastrophe movie showing how a storm, a surge and a high tide conspire to flood London by the barrier being overtopped. Simple-minded, but not without excitement.

The solution, according to the professor character of Tom Courtney, is to catch the tide on the turn and release all the flood  water behind  the sluices so that the power of the surge and the storm are defeated by the gravity of the downstream release. And of course the lowered barrier has to be raised to allow this to happen. Therein the movie drama.

But it occurs to me that in a  world of 'Love Me' numbers, where perceptions and expectations outrule statistical risk evaluation, the concept of the counter surge is not inappropriate. The economy as a psychological phenomenon. Hope and change as drivers. A tax cut is a psychological driver - in the short term...

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Fri Nov 14th, 2008 at 02:54:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I tend to take the reverse view.  Consider that someone paying taxes is a stakeholder in the system.  The people want to do their part so tell them they will pay X more in taxes and receive X.  Then deliver X.  The failure to deliver X is the primary reason for the tax revolts of the past 30 years.  

The people should have pride when paying taxes into their own government.

by paving on Fri Nov 14th, 2008 at 04:25:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Theoretically of course. But people do not feel themselves to be stakeholders - persuade them that they really are and yes, things will change.

There will be surge of births 9 months from the date of Barack Obama becoming President-elect. People are not rational ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Fri Nov 14th, 2008 at 04:43:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Unemployment benefits are the fastest stimuli, since they set a floor on household budgets and help to hold up collapsing demand.  Tax cuts are good if they're directed at people who can really use them.  Obama's proposal would do some good in the states, for example, although, as I've said, I think they're too broad going up to households making $150k or 200k or whatever it is (those making above $150k or $200k but below $250k stay put, I believe).

Those are more immediate stimuli, but for something along the lines of what we're facing (very real possibility of deflation), governments are going to need programs that put people into actual work with serious wages/salaries.  Takes longer to draw up plans for that kind of thing, of course, but I think it's the more forceful pillar of a stimulus package in the end.

Conservatives want live babies so they can raise them to be dead soldiers. - George Carlin

by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Fri Nov 14th, 2008 at 07:14:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Tax cuts are rarely geared to those who need them. The past three decades have been one race towards tax policy as a way to transfer ever more loot to the top, not to those who need it.

Unemployment benefits, and other forms of income support, as you say, are far more effective than tax cuts, even when they are said to be for the the benefit of the poor. (Unless they're talking about doing away with sales and vat taxes and replacing them with more highly progressive income tax regimes, which I doubt.)

Fai de bèn a Bertrand, te lou rendra en cagant

by redstar on Sat Nov 15th, 2008 at 09:52:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Agreed.  Unemployment benefits are the most immediate and effective.

I'd ad aide to the state and local governments in America's case, since that will save jobs directly within those governments as well as keep services up and running, which keeps other jobs going and provides for the general welfare of communities.  States and locals generally have balanced-budget amendments, so when things go to shit, they get slammed.  Similarly, but going the other way, they spend big during booms.  This is, of course, the opposite of how it should work.  It's completely insane, but it's nonetheless the reality of the system.

Sales taxes in the states are set by the state governments, and local governments add to the rate for their cut, so the feds can't really do anything about those.  Those are already somewhat progressive, because essentials are generally not taxed, but I agree that progressive income taxes are better than sales taxes.

If you were going to design tax cuts to maximize the impact, you'd want to do them on people at or below (say) $45k/year, and give rebates to those below the threshold under which they don't pay income taxes.  You could also jack up, for example, the Earned-Income Tax Credit or other negative-taxation mechanisms.

Conservatives want live babies so they can raise them to be dead soldiers. - George Carlin

by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Sat Nov 15th, 2008 at 01:30:06 PM EST
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