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BBC NEWS | UK | 'Respect atheists', says Cardinal

The Archbishop of Westminster has urged Christians to treat atheists and agnostics with "deep esteem".

Believers may be partly responsible for the decline in faith by losing sense of the mystery and treating God as a "fact in the world", he said in a lecture.

Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor called for more understanding and appreciation between believers and non-believers.

What are they up to saying this, it's a bit of a change from "Burn the heretic"

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:22:34 PM EST
Great marketing strategy for getting people into the pews:  "Church, it's not just for God anymore."

I was told by an English person that today some vicars, or whatever it you call them there, are openly atheist.  I have a hard time believing this, but the person swore it was true.  And in fact, they did have a family friend who was a minister, or whatever it you call them there, who was actually an atheist, and having an affair with a parishioner to boot.  I don't get it, really...

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:33:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Cormac Murphy-O'Connor ain't Anglican. Not by a long way!

But Church of England is infamous for being more social club than religion - Church of Ireland is possibly even worse.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:35:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The definition of "atheist" is what isn't known here.

It's an open secret that many serious and high-ranking theologians understand that the bible "fairy" story as told to the laity is at serious divergence with the original source texts. Their understanding of the relationship god is supposed to have with Jesus and the rest of us wouldn't be recognised as "theistic" by many of the more fundamental literalist religions more commonly found in the USA. Hence they're atheists.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:41:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It's fairly common over here as well. About half the members of the church I went to as a kid were actual Christians, the rest were there for the social network. No one talked about it openly, of course.

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 04:56:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Are you talking about Unitarian Universalists or some more mainstream Christian denomination?

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri May 9th, 2008 at 02:47:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We used to have a Bishop in the CofE who was frequently harangued by the daily mail for his borderline atheism. By chance I was at college with a trainee priest who was his nominee. He was a former central committee member of the Communist party of Great Britain. and although he would have been spectacular at the pastoral side of the job, I don't think he was the worlds greatest believer.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:42:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I think we need to see how this unfolds. Those two are obviously working together on some plot to advance superstition somehow and are trying to gull their critics with weaselry.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:35:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The leader of Roman Catholics in England and Wales said that a "hidden God" was active in everyone's life.

How about you fuck off? Thanks. Bah.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:36:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
My hidden god is called chocolate.

by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 02:43:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
My son went on a school trip to the Millfield area yesterday.  It's Peterborough's melting pot-most immigrants start off in the area.  So they visited Pakistani, Polish, Italian and Portuguese shops and met some of the older residents.

However-one of the buildings they passed was a Christian community centre.  Why, the head asked, did they think it was there?

To make new arrivals feel welcome, piped up the class.

"Because they want to convert them into Christians," said my son.

Oh, dear...  :)  

by Sassafras on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 05:19:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Good to see there's some thinking happening in the youth of today.

is the Lithuanian centre still there? and the synagogue? watching gangs of different factions youth chase each other from community centre to community centre in the early 80's was always entertaining.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 06:04:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
There's the odd violent clash, though things seem to have been quiet for a while.  Mostly, any trouble was between British born ethnic-minority youths (in this area almost all are the children or grandchildren of immigrants) and dispersed asylum-seekers, who were mostly young men in enforced unemployment.

It will be...ahem...interesting to see what happens when the children of recent Eastern European migrants reach their teens. They do face prejudice, both from the indigenous population (if the UK can truly be said to have such a thing) and more established immigrant communities.  And it would be fair to say that, in my experience, some of the newly-arrived families have brought their own prejudices against other ethnic minorities with them.

by Sassafras on Fri May 9th, 2008 at 02:32:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It very rarely got to violence, yelled insults (or in winter snowballs) would result in the younger youth following the opposing pack to the point where there were older youths outside their community centre where discretion would become the better part of valour. My youthful taste for alcohol was developed in pubs in and around that part of town before moving on to a place that sold jug served real ale in the centre of town.


Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri May 9th, 2008 at 04:19:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Sounds to me like you have a very smart son. :-)
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Fri May 9th, 2008 at 02:35:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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