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For a good electorate map showing the first 4 constituencies to have declared formal results, go to http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2008/0613/breaking1.htm

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:11:52 AM EST
currently 58:42% no with 7 largely western/rural constituencies declaring.  I would expect the gap to close somewhat as more eastern constituencies come in, but the NO side will still win by a clear margin.

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:47:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And if it doesn't, they'll claim fraud and have a Shamrock Revolution demonstrating in Dublin.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:49:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Huge class disparities in voting patterns.  Middle class South Dublin 63: 37 YES, more working class South West Dublin 35:65 NO vote.

The has been a large increase in unemployment recently - mainly due to a collapse in the building industry.  This has left huge numbers of working class people fearing unemployment, whilst it has yet to effect the vast majority of middle class people at all.

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:59:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Let's stop saying "fear of unemployment" is the only reason for the working classes to vote no. Another reason might simply be that the working classes, who by sociological nature are less involved in the political process, simply don't feel the EU is being built with them, for example. I'd think the middle classes would still vote yes even under unemployment threats, for example - for them the possibility to move to another part of the EU to find work is more realistic.

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 09:42:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You're right. Some of it is religious fanaticism, some is racism, some is nationalism, some of it is sticking it to the man ...
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 09:47:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'll point out I'm talking about my own relatives here.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 09:48:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The Lisbon treaty was drafted thanks to Sarkozy who was pretty much elected thanks to nationalistic racists sticking it to what they saw as the man...

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 09:59:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yup. We can't fix the European project until we fix national politics. How the fuck do we do that?
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 10:00:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Proper MSM daring to hold politicians accountable both for national and European decisions would be a nice start, and isn't that what we're trying to work on ?

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 10:03:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
well you could start by sorting your relatives...:-)

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 10:04:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I've tried. Turns out that slogans are immune to facts.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 10:05:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
with almost half of the constituencies reporting official counts now it's looking like a 45:55 NO vote with a uniformly high 50+% turnout averaging in the mid 50's.  This is no fluke result brought about by a poor turnout but a resounding rejection of a treaty virtually no one read or claimed to fully understand.

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 09:21:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Frank Schnittger:
a resounding rejection of a treaty virtually no one read or claimed to fully understand.
And that is a bad thing?

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 09:25:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No - in the sense that that is what popular democracy should be about, but the consequences could be very bad indeed...

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 09:42:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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