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It's not about the Treaty itself!  Almost nobody has read it anyway, and those who have don't understand it.  It is a generalised vote of no-confidence in "the powers that be" for any number of private and public reasons - chiefly to do with a darkening economic climate and a sense that the political system is screwing the little people.

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 06:45:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Can you blame them?

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 06:47:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes?
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 06:48:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I am increasingly of the view that the era of "eurofudges" may be over and that the time has come for a much simpler and clearer statement of where the EU is going, and how it is to be governed.  Some member states may well reject this - the UK at least - and we will then have the reality of a two speed Europe.  The elites have taken this project as far as they can.  The next step can only be taken by the people of Europe themselves, and some hard choices may have to be made - with some countries getting off the bus if that is what they really want to do.

The Irish people were given a choice with no real downside - except perhaps the status quo - and no real upside either.  Nanne spoke of the EU progressing by bay steps.  It is time for the Baby to grow up and make some major decisions about future direction - and that will mean hard choices with real down and upsides attached to them.

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 07:00:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Frank Schnittger:
I am increasingly of the view that the era of "eurofudges" may be over and that the time has come for a much simpler and clearer statement of where the EU is going, and how it is to be governed.

Is this a bad thing?

Who knows - if the statement were clear enough and positive enough, people might even vote for it.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 07:32:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I think most would - and the UK and possibly some others wouldn't - and then the real fun and games would begin.  I doubt that any new two-speed proposal would be as favourable to smaller countries as Nice/Lisbon was.  Ireland's honeymoon is over.

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 07:55:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Colman claimed the other day that most two-speed proposals would be of the kind that ireland would like to be part of.

I mean, you're in the Euro and you're not in Schengen only because of the open border agreement with the UK.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:01:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We would have no choice but to be part of the faster part - but our ability to negotiate terms favourable to a smaller country would be much less.  Few in Ireland seem to realise just what a good deal - at every level - we have gotten from the EU in the past.  This was always going to change - slowly - now it will change much faster.

"It's a mystery to me - the game commences, For the usual fee - plus expenses, Confidential information - it's in my diary..."
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:06:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Do you trust our current political elite to draft a clear, positive statement ?

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:09:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You know, I keep thinking the last time we had people capable of that was with Delors, Kohl, Mitterrand and Gonzalez, and that we owe them the 1992 Treaty on European Union.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:12:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And Mitterrand, at a low point of the PS's popularity, was able to get it through the French electorate, which was quite an impressive feat. At the time, the Gaullist right wing was still quite anti-EU.

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 08:20:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The two-speed Europe will start today. Remember it's the French Presidency starting in July. The french have always been fans of l'Europe à géometrie variable.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 13th, 2008 at 07:47:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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