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Neo-con is a slur that is rapidly becoming uninformative, but for the sake of the discussion let's operate on the assumption that some U.S. hawks are pulling the strings in Georgia. This is a win-win for them.

Say Russia would have just let Georgia take South Ossetia. A win, small one,  but still.

Say, as it now seems, Russia overreacts. A big win, they are one big step closer to restarting the cold war. Which would suite some Russians hawks just fine, what I don't understand though is why exactly they think it would work out any less badly for them this time.

There ought to be some kind of recovery therapy for ex-superpowers.

by teme on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 07:10:14 PM EST
Say, as it now seems, Russia overreacts. A big win, they are one big step closer to restarting the cold war. Which would suite some Russians hawks just fine, what I don't understand though is why exactly they think it would work out any less badly for them this time.

if we suppose some neo-con/u.s. hawk conspiracy behind all this, i don't think even those guys are fool enough to think they will making strategic gains against Russia through this fiasco.  more likely, they were thinking short-term and domestic: they wanted to dial up the volume on "national security" just in time to make McCain look like a more serious contender for the U.S. presidency than Obama.

Cynicism is intellectual treason.

by marco (cowannar at gmail punkt com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 07:51:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
THE thing the hawks or neo-cons DON'T want is someone like Obama as president.  He certainly doesn't share THEIR values.  They respond on a visceral level to perceived threats.  He is analytical.  They see him as a threat to the very continued existence of the USA, that continued existence being guaranteed only by having ever vigilant hawks in control of the armed forces.  

On a visceral level, they fear and loathe Obama and the possibility that he might get elected.  If Georgian president Saakashvili and/or his newly US trained army, along with an untold number of Georgans, including Osetians and Abkhazians have to be heroically sacrificed to feckless Georgian agression and to the Russian Bear as pawns in the game, that is regretful.  They will remember their sacrifice.  

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 09:29:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
His positions don't seem to be that far away from what they want: sane (or at least competent) American imperialism.

His advisors on Russia are the same ones that have been selling the "democratisation" during the Yeltsin years. McFaul for one.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 06:07:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
He might do for the Demo-hawks, I'll grant you.  

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 09:33:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But so far there is no indication that Russia has overreacted.

Newsies on the ground that are neither American, Georgian, Russian or South Ossetian (does South Ossetia have any newsies at all by the way?) confirm that Russia has secured or is in the process of securing South Ossetia, and that Georgian military installations in Georgia proper have been targeted by air strikes.

Various apparatchiks in the Georgian administration and the American press have made wild allegations that Russia has launched a full-scale attack on several fronts and shock-and-awed terror-bombed Georgian cities. But these reports remain unconfirmed, and given where they were originally published, are more than likely to remain unconfirmed.

All in all, the Russian response does not strike me as disproportionate.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 11:44:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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