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What I don't understand is the obsession with speed at the cost of efficiency (as you point out DoDo). Surely the answer is to make the time spent on trains 'productive', rather than passive relocation.

For business people, 3G networks and portable devices mean that communication, management, media post-production, design, engineering and whatever are not tied to location. One could even run a help desk on the move!

This is why I believe that European coastal transport by ship is feasible - with considerable rethinking on the design of those ships. Ships need to be designed for productivity rather than low-end entertainment. This already happens in a half-hearted way on the giant ferries running between Finland and Sweden: there are conference rooms, auditoria etc. - but surrounded by low end entertainment.

The Finnish Intercity double-decker Pendolinos have an excellent business section. Many use the time on board to prepare for meetings ahead. The Pendolinos are not run particularly fast, but they don't need to be if you can do some work on board. I travelled to Turku once with a songwriter who remixed a song on his laptop using Pro Tools and headphones during the journey.

The problem with energy, as one of my clients is fond of saying, is that its use is sub-optimized. In the case of energy for transport, the concept of relocation has to be rethought. Getting from A to B as fast as possible, has to be rethought as getting from A to B as productively as possible.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 02:32:49 AM EST
While much of the Chinese drive for speed seems to be all for prestige, there are some real factors, too: China is a big country. Even reaching 380 km/h, the Beijing-Shanghai trip would be around 3h40m, difficult to compete with airplanes.

Finnish Intercity double-decker Pendolinos

Nitpick: surely you mean locomotive-pulled double-deck Intercity trains and Pendolinos?

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 02:47:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You are the expert!

But more info here


You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 03:02:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Surely the answer is to make the time spent on trains 'productive', rather than passive relocation.

Damn right. On most French TGV, you can't plug your laptop, so that either you're on your own power, or you somehow know which trains do offer the possibility, or maybe you travel first class.

Just plain old 220v. power on a recent electrical train : it can't be such an engineering challenge ?

by balbuz on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 06:14:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's not. The modern German trains all have power, at least at the seats next to tables, and some trains have them at most seats.

The ICE from Munich to Frankfurt even has WLAN (I haven't actually had a chance to try it yet), and this should be extended to Hamburg by the end of the year.

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 06:30:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It shall come with the regular refurbishment, I guess. When I travelled across France last year, of my three trips on TGV, one was on a refurbished one, and from Reims to Le Mans, laptops were loudly replaying movies all around me...

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 06:37:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
(In most cases, those were cartoons which fathers showed their children.)

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 06:37:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Our bog standard economy class Great Western trains to London have plugs for each seat. I think Virgin trains do too but definitely not all lines offer that.

Ad astra per aspera
by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 07:20:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
have power plugs (at least in first class) and Thalys now has wifi throughout the train (which works fine).

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 09:20:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Have you been forced out of the business jets to London City Airport? :-)

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 09:21:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I should damn well hope so ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 09:34:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's still more convenient for me when I go to London. But there is no plane service to Brussels.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 05:09:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Nor Eurostar service, unless you change trains at Lille?

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 05:10:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Or, eh, thinking jet-set, maybe you frequently travel from London to Brussels?

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Thu Sep 4th, 2008 at 05:11:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Actually, Thalys is the Eurostar equivalent on Paris-Brussels line.

Europeans think a hundred miles is a long way. Americans think a hundred years is a long time.
by Bernard on Fri Sep 5th, 2008 at 03:36:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well duh, but Jérôme said "Thalys and Eurostar have power plugs", so he must have experience with both.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Fri Sep 5th, 2008 at 04:35:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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