The Lisbon treaty is, as Newsweek properly called (I can not believe I am writing these words), a pseudo-constitution.
Europe is now, formally halfway there.. where there is a European president with a European Federal Congress and a Head-of_State Senate. Plus a bill of rights.
the question is how long will it take fro Europe to do the final step. With the present constitution , Europe can work fine at the international economic level (and at the enviromentalist level) for a long, long time...
the final jump will be a matter of will as far as I can see... maybe in half a century a crisis appears which requires a completely united Europe, but I do not see it now.
So... I am with afew.. we are half-way there, and the previous treaty , whcih the French blocked, was closer to the final goal , but still it was not the whole deal.
So, cheer up.
A pleasure I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude
As long as the only mechanism for amendment is another international treaty, the EU is an international organization. En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
Article V, U.S. Constitution
The Constitution of the United States * * * * * * * * * * Article V The Congress, whenever two thirds of both houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, or, on the application of the legislatures of two thirds of the several states, shall call a convention for proposing amendments, which, in either case, shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the Congress; provided that no amendment which may be made prior to the year one thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any manner affect the first and fourth clauses in the ninth section of the first article; and that no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal suffrage in the Senate.
* * * * * * * * * *
Article V
The Congress, whenever two thirds of both houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, or, on the application of the legislatures of two thirds of the several states, shall call a convention for proposing amendments, which, in either case, shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the Congress; provided that no amendment which may be made prior to the year one thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any manner affect the first and fourth clauses in the ninth section of the first article; and that no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal suffrage in the Senate.
Would the US be an international organization if only the Senate could propose amendments? A vote for PES is a vote for EPP! A vote for EPP is a vote for PES! Support the coalition, vote EPP-PES in 2009!
Another point is that the current arrangement doesn't recognise a single European sovereign entity (the "people of Europe") but rather a number of sovereign entities entering into an agreement. En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
I was writing the same point below.. je je je
When I wrote the comment about the senate I assumed that the early senate was an assembly appointed by the State Governors. However, I have been unable to find how the early (pre-election) senators were appointed, so if anyone has a link...? A vote for PES is a vote for EPP! A vote for EPP is a vote for PES! Support the coalition, vote EPP-PES in 2009!
Still, in 10 years we will have to start drafting a new treaty.
This pseudo-constitution seems rather functional even for 40 countries.
Why do you think it would need another step closer to the full political union in 10 years? What would malfunction?
You mean we are closer than I think because the EU institutions can change teh treaty without teh acceptance of the member-state? Or because it would be easier than I think to create the European congress-head of states (senate)-presidency (executive=comission) structures?
At the end of the day, the treaty could say that it needs the ratification of all national parliaments, and then it would be no different than now.. and I would not call it a constitution.
Back in the 18th century... not so much (cf. the Holy Roman Empire's "electors"). En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
Sorry about Lévi-Strauss, though he was 100 and, as they say hereabouts, podia far un mort.
I just read
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/04/world/europe/04levistrauss.html?hp=&pagewanted=all
A rather interesting summary... although they do not talk about later work on which topics are universal to mythologies and which ones are not...even less which specific myths are more common than others regarding universal topics... Still, they comment the universal structure behind most of them which is, probably, his best-known accomplishment.
Now...I only hope that his knowledge is not lost, and that we keep repeating that most of our differences come from the different structural mythologies we inherit from our ancestors which are perfectly suited so that our brain makes sense of our conscience in society.
Let us try to broaden people's minds by providing more myths that they can think of.
RIP
That's it.
This is partly based on the existence and strength of federal forces, but even more so on the self-definition of the state forces. If the state forces sees themselves primarily as citizens of the federal state, they are unlikely to fight for the state executive at all. A vote for PES is a vote for EPP! A vote for EPP is a vote for PES! Support the coalition, vote EPP-PES in 2009!
But, more importantly, even if you had a federal police force and military, its members would have to see themselves as European first. This is unlikely to happen until long after the EU constituent treaties recognise a single EU-wide sovereign entity that the federal authorities can identify with. En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
Article 50 1. Any Member State may decide to withdraw from the Union in accordance with its own constitutional requirements.
Leaving in disregard of the rules was just chosen as an example of an act that disregards the federal rules. It is such a final act, which makes it a good example. Any act that should land the local executive in federal prison would work as example of where the real sovereignty resides. A vote for PES is a vote for EPP! A vote for EPP is a vote for PES! Support the coalition, vote EPP-PES in 2009!
Any act that should land the local executive in federal prison
Power of the purse (real power, with real enforcement) makes you a federation. If for no other reason then because of the concentration of power on the federal level required for enforcement.
- Jake If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.
