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I'd choose nuclear power over a climate crash. But will the government grow up and clean its mess up | George Monbiot | Environment | The Guardian

Keep It In The Family, Gordon

What makes this decision politically sensitive, is that Gordon Brown has close family connections to the nuclear industry. His younger brother Andrew Brown works for EDF Energy, the UK subsidiary of EDF, which operates nuclear power stations in France, and which is one of the leading companies pushing for a nuclear rebuild programme in the UK. Andrew Brown was appointed as EDF Energy's Head of Press on 13 September 2004.

http://www.nuclearspin.org/index.php/Gordon_Brown



~"When an inner situation is not made conscious, it appears outside as fate." Karl Jung~
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Tue Nov 10th, 2009 at 04:45:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
A bright nuclear future: true or false? | Jeremy Leggett | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk
If you think the Labour government has done the right thing in its decision to expand nuclear power in the UK by 50%, see how you fare with this quiz. Are the following dozen statements true or false?


Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue Nov 10th, 2009 at 05:01:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
As noted in another thread, that list is not very convincing and to a good extent in bad faith.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 04:26:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I think your reaction is based on french experience.

The UK experience is different in that we've been badly lied to about the nuclear power programme. Very serious accidents have been covered up and denied, large tracts of land and the people living there were irradiated and not told, the Irish Sea north of Windscale Seascale Sellafield was deliberately contaminated as part of a long term experiment into the effects of low level radiation (why keep changing the name unless for pr cleansing).

And all the time they were telling us that nuclear energy was our future, was too cheap to meter, even as costs sky-rocketed and they still don't know what to do with the waste. So, given our expeiences of the deceit and duplicity of government when it comes to nuclear power, that list is both persuasive and politically powerful.

I fully accept it doesn't have to be the way it has been here in the UK, that the french experience is somewhat different. So I accept you find the list unpersuasive. The British will see it differently.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 04:38:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Build lots of pumped hydro plants like the one in Wales (like 5-10 GW), import surplus night-time French nuclear power and voíla, no more need to build new British nukes.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 04:44:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
From the quoted article

A bright nuclear future: true or false? | Jeremy Leggett | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

5) This July, a heatwave shut a third of French reactors, because rivers became too hot to act as coolant. France was forced to import electricity from the UK.

6) Things got little better as winter approached. With almost one third of France's reactors out of service for maintenance and other reasons, France will have to import electricity at peak hours during the winter - for the second year running - to avoid the risk of blackouts.



Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 05:14:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So what? Did you see vast rolling blackouts? Operating power stations means you will have some downtime, for various reasons. That's not a bug, it's a feature. The alternative is not having electricity at all.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 05:43:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Looks like France needs to build more nuclear plants...

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 05:45:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Certainly not. France already has a suboptimal (=too high) fraction of nuclear power. Just look at the low capacity factors.

At least if you ignore evironmental and security of supply issues, if you include them the the too high nuclear fraction becomes more reasonable.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 05:52:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The other problem with ths is the enormous political problems that would be generated  by flooding yet more pieces of Wales. It would almost inevitably lead to Welsh independence, rather than filling many more valleys with water, and that would then remover the possibility for this to occur.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 05:48:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Oh come on. The only pumped hydro facility in Wales is the Dinorwig station, which is located in an old quarry. I'm not Welsh (or Scottish, the other possible site for plants like this), but I bet the locals would enjoy the say £10-30 billion pound investment a 15-30 year project like this would entail.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 05:55:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No, the Flooding of Welsh valleys has in the past  caused more Welsh nationalism, and even Welsh terrorism, hunger strikes, mass civil disobedience, especially when the main beneficiaries appear to be the English. As a plan it would only be vaguely possible after Welsh independence. Which various other parts of Britain would find Politically impossible

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Nov 11th, 2009 at 06:11:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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