Met some interesting people in Stockholm - a lawyer with the ICC in Den Haag, a political advisor to a Swedish minister, and the administrative director of a major swedish theatre: all conscription service pals of my Swedish military intelligence friend. What I've noticed also in many of my Finnish friends is the strong friendships that last from those bonding times in military service. You can't be me, I'm taken
Politiicans are such shits for making people do that. keep to the Fen Causeway
I am for conscription under the circumstances above. It's a useful test of various physical skills that these young guys might not otherwise experience, they get mixed up with young people outside their usual crowd, they get fitter, and they also understand the pros and cons of organization - outside of school.
My comment to the ministerial advisor when he said that Sweden had become opposed to conscription because of the reduced freedom, was that society has already done the same to them for a year when they were 11, a year when they were 12, 13 etc.
As I've argued with my daughters several times, freedom comes with responsibilities, and society tends to demand that the responsibility is shown before the freedom is bestowed. Of course, it is a gradual process of small freedom, small responsibility - give and take. You can't be me, I'm taken
I cannot see any advantage in placing the best of society at the (non-existent) mercy of the worst. especially as we know that class based discrimination exists, money buys exemptions. In the military as elsewhere, life is a shit sandwich, the more bread you got, the less shit you eat.
At least in civvy street, aka civilisation, people can negotiate safe space fopr themselves. It is impossible to hide in the military.
And do women get to buy their place in society, or do they get a pass like they used to ?
Sorry if that's dismissive and aggressive, but I get a lot of "bring back national service" crap over here and the thought frightens me. keep to the Fen Causeway
Looking is not the same as Being.
There are reasons for this, of course: society doesn't need Hunting Cults when all one has to do is trundle thyself down to the local grocery store to get a haunch of meat. Society need young males to train for careers of various sorts some of which require decades of education and training.
Once again it's a situation where our evolutionary heritage molded our little primate brain/mind to need psychological and socio-psychological stimuli and structures that are not necessary - even harmful - in Modern Times.
male-bonding socialization rituals
sounds so robert bly!
all kinds of mbsr's have gone by the board over the last couple of generations. even brother and brother rivalry is encouraged, all in the name of holy competition.
there are some kinds of newer bonding, through gathering around mutual interests, but i think it's pretty weak tea still compared to the bonds formed, for example, farming food that leads to family survival together, or cutting wood that will permit staying alive through the winter.
playing music creates interesting bonds, sometimes extremely deep and durable ones. ~"When an inner situation is not made conscious, it appears outside as fate." Karl Jung~
quite big stateside in the mid eighties. ~"When an inner situation is not made conscious, it appears outside as fate." Karl Jung~
Modern western society has few male-bonding socialization rituals left.
Banking and finance.
Seriously. If you're not macho enough, you're eliminated from the job pool.
I've known people this has happened to. It's deliberately Darwinian, and entirely based on ruthless competition. The survivors certainly have a loyalty to their caste, if not necessarily to their corporate alma mater.
