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The pint !! The English Imperial Pint. For which the metric equivalents are either too small or too large for decent drinking.

And what is 4 ft, 8 and 3/4 inches in metric ? (And despite Dodo's protestations, I will persist in suggesting that it's the width of a roman cart).

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 04:52:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The metric measures seem to work fine in Bavaria.... (though can get problematical during the Starkbier season in Lent).
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 05:12:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
A half litre is too little, two gulps and it's gone. A litre is too much cos it goes flat and is too heavy for easy drinking.

Tested over millennia of drunken revelry to be just right.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 05:32:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Why are "the metric equivalents" of a "pint" restricted to a half litre and a litre? The Pint is 568 ml so how is 600ml not a "metric equivalent" of it?

And how is 568ml just right and 500ml too small? The difference is just over 10%.

As for the rail gauge, according to wikipedia it's 1/2 inch, not 3/4 inch. Then, 4' and 8 3/4" is not exactly exact as far as imperial units go. If you remember it to the nearest 1/2 inch, that's just like remembering it to the nearest centimetre so 144cm works as a "metric equivalent" and 144 is an easy to remember number (being a perfect square, and all)...

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 06:17:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Wikipedia: Early origins of the standard gauge
There is an urban legend that Julius Caesar specified a legal width for chariots at the width of standard gauge, causing road ruts at that width, so all later wagons had to have the same width or else risk having one set of wheels suddenly fall into one deep rut but not the other.

In fact, the origins of the standard gauge considerably predate the Roman Empire, and may even predate the invention of the wheel. The width of prehistoric vehicles was determined by number of interacting factors which gave rise to a fairly standard vehicle width of a little under 2 metres (6.6 ft) These factors have changed little over the millenia, and are still reflected in today's motor vehicles. Road rutting was common in early roads, even with stone pavements. The initial impetus for the ruts probably came from the grooves made by sleds and slide cars dragged over the surfaces of ancient trackways. Since early carts had no steering and no brakes, negotiating hills and curves was dangerous, and cutting ruts into the stone helped them negotiate the hazardous parts of the roads.

Neolithic wheeled carts found in Europe had gauges varying from 130 to 175 centimetres (4 ft 3 in to 5 ft 9 in). By the Bronze age, wheel gauges appeared to have stabilized between 140 to 145 centimetres (4 ft 7 in to 4 ft 9 in) which was attributed to a tradition in ancient technology which was perpetuated throughout European history. The ancient Assyrians, Babylonians, Persians and Greeks constructed roads with artificial wheelruts cut in rock spaced the wheelspan of an ordinary carriage. Such ancient stone railways connected major cities with sacred sites, such as Athens to Eleusis, Sparta to Ayklia, or Elis to Olympia. The gauge of these stone grooves was 138 to 144 centimetres (4 ft 6 in to 4 ft 9 in). The largest number of preserved stone trackways, over 150, are found on Malta.

Some of these ancient stone rutways were very ambitious. Around 600 BC the citizens of ancient Corinth constructed the Diolkos, which some consider the world's first railway, a granite road with grooved tracks along which large wooden flatbed cars carrying ships and their cargo were pulled by slaves or draft animals. The space between the grooved tracks in the granite was a consistent 1.5 metres (4 ft 11 in).

The Roman Empire actually made less use of stone trackways than the prior Greek civilization because the Roman roads were much better than those of previous civilizations. However, there is evidence that the Romans used a more or less consistent wheel gauge adopted from the Greeks throughout Europe, and brought it to England with the Roman conquest of Britain in AD 43. After the Roman departure from Britain, this more-or-less standard gauge continued in use, so the wheel gauge of animal drawn vehicles in 19th century Britain was 1.4 to 1.5 metres (4 ft 7 in to 4 ft 10 in). In 1845 George Stephenson copied the gauge of British coal wagons in his area (about 1.42 metres (4 ft 8 in) for his new locomotive, and for technical reasons widened it slightly to achieve the modern railway standard gauge of 1.435 metres (4 ft 8.5 in).



En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 06:27:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Migeru:
The largest number of preserved stone trackways, over 150, are found on Malta.

So now we know...

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 08:37:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We all know what happens on Malta....

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 11:06:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And how is 568ml just right and 500ml too small? The difference is just over 10%.

I think the difficulty is psychological in how many people (in UK I grant you- but I've heard similar complaints from germans) approach drinking. Generally when you get a beer, you have a good drink of it to start and then slowly drink off the rest of it and then when it's nearly finished you polish off the final 2 cm in one go.

The loss of that 10% interferes with the middle "grazing" period of drinking. You have the first glug, then a couple of sips later, you finish it off. Gone in seemingly no time.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 06:36:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Okay, how is 600ml too much?

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 06:51:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Until this morning, no one ever offered it as an option. I'm sure it'd be fine, but that's not how weights and measures go. Halves and wholes generally.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 07:05:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
that's not how weights and measures go. Halves and wholes generally

That's ridiculous. Inches are divided in powers of 2, but with the metric system you just add one more decimal place. So, any multiple of 100ml is an acceptable option at that level of tolerance. If you need a tighter fit, multiples of 10ml...

I don't think I have a single half-litre or full-litre glass at home and I live in metric-land. Plus, in Spain a customary measure for beer is a third of a litre (tercio, probably something like 330ml), which is also the standard measure of aluminum cans and small bottles.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 07:11:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's more likely that pints were simply rounded down in order to charge people 10% more for their beer. If a pint had been 666 ml it would have been rounded down to 600ml for the same reason.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 07:14:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The difference is just 6 or 7 centilitres. If a half-litre is "two gulps", then so is a pint, pretty much. And don't let's forget that the US has another set of most of these measures, including a (smaller) pint.

The rest is just a matter of what you're used to.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 08:27:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I thought the proper way to drink beer was quaffing it...

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 08:52:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I really liked the tiny ice cold beer glasses used in Amsterdam. I'd drink more beer if it was served in 1 dl glasses: those first two gulps is all the pleasure I get from beer.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 11:09:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Small glasses are associated with drinking beers that have low carbonation, such as kolsch (around Cologne), where any more than a taster and they'd go flat.

Can't think of one in Amsterdam it'd apply to but I'm sure that's the reason

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 11:32:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Interesting. So that's true of all beers with low carbonation? Or is flatness appreciated anywhere?

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Tue Dec 22nd, 2009 at 12:01:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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