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Gringo:
industrial-strength insurgency.

now there's an odd adjective for an insurgency. irony free, i'm sure, considering the source.

Gringo:

Progress in reconciliation is most likely when you are in a position of strength

aka 'bash your way to the top, and then tell everyone else to negotiate'.

Gringo:

  1.  Sometimes the more force is used, the less effective it is.

  2. Sometimes doing nothing is the best reaction.

if only they really believed that...

perhaps the average afghan peasant knows more about the geopolitical reasons why america's there than the media-mystified american public, us bloggers, or even the pars-that-be.

thanks for the link, surfing on from that i found this, which is another well expressed point of view to take on board...

The one thing you need to read about Afghanistan By Christian Brose | Shadow Government

One of the great fallacies of development is that all we have to do is to show 'them' how to do it and they can take it on for themselves. This is not the case and will never happen. Our ability to provide this kind of assistance is rooted in a cultural bias which recognizes abstract notions like 'society', civic responsibility, public/private partnerships, and a whole host of mental infrastructure which has taken centuries to develop. In Afghanistan the conditions for self-development are unavailable as they have been corrupted by outside interference for most of their modern history. If we are going to stay and fix Afghanistan then we will have to do just that...stay and fix it ourselves....If we want them to do it the let's provide a generation of peace and a whole new system of education. Afghan ministers are like mafia dons who dispense favors to their friends and wallop their foes....development is not in their vocabulary.


"It's very hard to see what is kept invisible" Roseanne Barr
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sat Feb 28th, 2009 at 05:26:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thanks for the Brose link.  I saw reference to it in FP earlier and do want to read it.

I can swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell. _ Blood Sweat & Tears
by Gringo (stargazing camel at aoldotcom) on Sat Feb 28th, 2009 at 06:09:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The Brose statement is one reason why sending them American or European mayors and other local administrators probably won't work.

I can swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell. _ Blood Sweat & Tears
by Gringo (stargazing camel at aoldotcom) on Sat Feb 28th, 2009 at 06:11:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
and another, also from a great analysis of O's speech at the orangerie from monkeybrains.

"It's very hard to see what is kept invisible" Roseanne Barr
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sat Feb 28th, 2009 at 06:40:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
oops, linky

Daily Kos: Obama's historic speech, Republican nightmare

 One point I saw from tweety (20+ / 0-)
Recommended by:
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afterward was that they have nothing left because Obama occupies the left and the center so they have to move extreme right because that is all there is left.



"It's very hard to see what is kept invisible" Roseanne Barr
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sat Feb 28th, 2009 at 07:21:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Masterful!

I can swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell. _ Blood Sweat & Tears
by Gringo (stargazing camel at aoldotcom) on Sun Mar 1st, 2009 at 12:22:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What I don't think Tweety gets is that people in the center generally agree with people on the left.  They're running about 60/40 or even 65/35 for Democrats right now.  They're just more hesitant about it than we are, so the problem is, I think, more one of leading them in the right direction than of trying to move to where they are.

That's also a point on which I think the "Obama Must Be Huey Long or He's D00m3d!" crowd fails massively to appreciate the politics.  Simply addressing people in the center as adults will do more than pumping "populist" bullshit in their ears ever will.  It's a problem at both extremes: They treat everyone else like they're morons and ultimately undermine their own program.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (pedobear@pennstatefootball.com) on Sun Mar 1st, 2009 at 12:46:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
heh, great comment, drew.

seems the louder they are, the less adult...

"It's very hard to see what is kept invisible" Roseanne Barr

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sun Mar 1st, 2009 at 04:30:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
nice example of out-the-box thinking, i thunk.

"It's very hard to see what is kept invisible" Roseanne Barr
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sat Feb 28th, 2009 at 07:09:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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