The point of nationalising the clearing system is not to prevent another speculative orgy. That is likely to be impossible. The point is to take away the ability of the criminals on Wall Street to take the entire monetary production economy hostage to their games of three-card monte.
Once the clearing system is nationalised, the rest of the banking sector can and should be allowed to burn to the ground when they fuck up on this kind of scale. That's what happens to every other company or sector in a capitalist economy.
- Jake If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.
Like I said before, states are by far unable to guarantee, let alone replace the whole banking system. This is why I don't agree with US voices speaking against big state, for instance: state's power and influence is already quite small - except maybe the chinese case.
Unless, that is, you want to nationalize the whole economy. Because this is where your reasoning is heading to, in reality, right :) Free at last! Free at last! Thank God Almighty, we are free at last! (Martin Luther King)
Preserving the electrical grid is of little help when the generators break down. Preserving the railroads is pointless when there are no trains in the first place.
Yes. That is why you don't unbundle the grids.
Like I said before, states are by far unable to guarantee, let alone replace the whole banking system.
They do not need to replace the whole banking system. GoldmanSachs does not need to be run by the government - it can be allowed to go into Chapter 7 like every other insolvent company which is not worth keeping as a going concern.
All the government has to guarantee is the clearing system. And that is perfectly well within its capabilities. It may have to confiscate the assets of a few hedge funds to do so, but hedge funds are expendable.
Precisely, so nationalizing the clearing system is not enough: we need to nationalize the banks also, really the whole banking systems. We cannot possibly satisfy to a few ATM, right :) That's why I said earlier that we'll be led to taking over all intermediaries. If G Sachs is allowed to fail, who will finance the economy then? The state, since it's the only big actor standing. If it needs to finance the whole economy, that means it'll have to take it over - or at least that's what it'll all amount to. Free at last! Free at last! Thank God Almighty, we are free at last! (Martin Luther King)
If G Sachs is allowed to fail, who will finance the economy then?
In the short term, the state, via massive construction programmes to green the economy. Programmes that are long overdue and will have to be implemented anyway, eventually.
In the medium term, some of the several thousand local and regional banks will fill out the market for project finance. And some of the big banks will go into Chapter 11 instead of Chapter 7, which means that they will still be around, but under new (and hopefully improved) management.
Perhaps you haven't been paying attention, but the guaranteeing part is exactly what just happened in the US.
As for the rest - where's your evidence that states can't replace the banking system? States can certainly buy and run banks, and historically they've usually done this with greater success than the bankers have.
Your position seems to be based on nothing more solid than wishful thinking, repetition and ideology.
It's certainly not based on history or fact.
States can buy and run banks, better or worse. The example of Credit Lyonnais comes to mind here.
My position is that the state is not some all-powerful monster. I don't say it's not competent, although even that can be discussed, but that it isn't big enough. Free at last! Free at last! Thank God Almighty, we are free at last! (Martin Luther King)
the state is not some all-powerful monster
You don't need investment banks for that, but you do need deposit accounts and debit cards. The brainless should not be in banking. — Willem Buitler
