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What the EU needs is someone capable of uniting disparate factions.  That is the essence of the EU project.  I don't know that Tony is the right person for the job at all, but if the criticism against him is that he knows hot to dissimulate and knows what its like to have blood on his hands, I suggest that those are possibly positive traits rather than negatives.
by santiago on Sat Jul 18th, 2009 at 10:12:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"What the EU needs is someone capable of uniting disparate factions."

Exactly, and also exactly the capability that Blair does not have.

As for "knows what its like to have blood on his hands", Blair has gained about as much knowledge of that as I have from playing RTS war games. He has ordered men to their deaths, but has he ever taken the time to look honestly and unflinchingly at what he wrought? You and I might agree that Blair has blood on his hands - I very much doubt that he does. And rest assured, he firmly believes he is right.

An ability to lie is definitely a negative trait if it is used to extensively lie to oneself.

by det on Sat Jul 18th, 2009 at 10:33:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
As you say. In power, Tony only knows
  1. crushing all opposition (something he won't be able to as merely a de-facto permament chairman),
  2. building top-down power structures below him (something he won't be able to do either),
  3. be a nice puppy to various masters (be them the USA, Murdoch, or financial or industrial lobbies) he deems either too powerful to confront or part of an exclusive club he would like to join (something we don't need in a top EU official).

...furthermore, a warrior uniting sovereign heads of states and governments, what a ridiculous idea.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Sat Jul 18th, 2009 at 02:34:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But most of all, utterly destroying his party.

And it's a pattern. While Saint Tony has been the Extra Secret Super Special Hot Sauce Quartet Envoy to the Middle East, the Gaza situation has devolved into naked barbarism and atrocity, and Israel is - still - seriously considering an attack on Iran.

Does Europe want someone so likely to destroy the EU?

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun Jul 19th, 2009 at 09:10:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
... if the conclusion is to be "Tony is the right person to bring people together", which is whether it is well understood by all parties that he is an able liar and willing to have blood on his hands in pursuit of what he sees as his own interest.

That common knowledge undermines rather than strengthens his capacities for bringing people together ... setting aside the leap in the dark regarding believing that he has changed his ways and will be trying to bring people together.

After specifying that he is an able liar, we are supposed to believe that he has reversed his modus operandi by 180 degrees on his say so?

Indeed, even if he seriously intends and is 100% committed to changing his modus operandi ... he is entirely untested in that role.

Its like picking someone for the starting XI in the Ashes because he's the star pitcher for the Olympic Baseball team.

Better pick someone who has some runs on the board for that particular contest.

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat Jul 18th, 2009 at 02:11:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well he's only shown an ability to unite people in distaste.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Sat Jul 18th, 2009 at 08:37:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
santiago:
he knows hot to dissimulate and knows what its like to have blood on his hands, I suggest that those are possibly positive traits rather than negatives.

thanks for sharing, that's some belief system you've got going there, lol!

~"When an inner situation is not made conscious, it appears outside as fate." Karl Jung~

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sat Jul 18th, 2009 at 08:05:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Not my belief system.  But I'm not getting anywhere on this thread but knee-jerk reactions to presumed ideas rather than what is actually said, so I'm through.  chao.
by santiago on Sun Jul 19th, 2009 at 01:24:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
santiago:
Not my belief system.  But I'm not getting anywhere on this thread but knee-jerk reactions to presumed ideas rather than what is actually said,

i don't think you're convincing anyone here of your points of view, but you have a lot of knowledge and time to share it, helping to provide some interesting counter-arguments, thickening the mix, as it were, and certainly helping avoid any notion ET is a cosy corner of choral communion.

to me the fault line occurs when you say things are true, but you don't necessarily believe them, which is like trying to reverse engineer glenn beck's brain.

(he thinks it's important to believe in something even though it's wrong, hmmm, you could say these two approaches are halves of a whole.)

because everyone else in this discussion, it appears to me, (and everywhere else at this blog for that matter, is intent on sharing things because we believe them to be true.)

by the way, i do have a life, thanks.

although you will get the the occasional 4 by throwing insulting comments my way, i'm guessing that's not really why you're here, lol.

enjoy your stay, and thanks for helping to catalise the discussion through your comments here why it is we have such a strong desire not to see Tony Blair get any more rewarded for his actions than he is already.

ansi...

ciao

~"When an inner situation is not made conscious, it appears outside as fate." Karl Jung~

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Fri Jul 24th, 2009 at 08:59:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

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