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The statistic one keeps hearing (and, no, I haven't verified it but it sounds right) is the the United States spends more in its military infrastructure than the next ten highest spending nations, combined.

Is that efficiently spent, or a bloated subsidy to the military-industrial complex? Because if it is just spent on expensive toys and duds like missile defence, your corollary doesn't follow.

I don't know either way.

The peak-to-trough part of the business cycle is an outlier. Carnot would have died laughing.

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 06:04:40 PM EST
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It's not either/or. A lot of computing and communications projects started with DARPA funding, so in a very literal way military research created the entire US computer industry.

People like Bill Gates and Steve Jobs packaged the research for popular consumption, but there would have been no Apple and no Microsoft without Whirlwind and SAGE.

At the same time vast amounts of military spending are pure pork - either spent corruptly, spent on projects that are plainly silly (like a 50s attempt to create a nuclear powered bomber), or militarily and diplomatically questionable, like missile defence.

The US could probably afford to cut military spending by 50 or 75% without losing any real military effectiveness.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 06:35:39 PM EST
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Quite true, indeed.  But you also have to look at it the other way -- is it ever possible to achieve large military budgets without providing enough pork to gain domestic support.  At least since the Roman Republic, empires and international endeavors of any kind have always required some level of bribery to secure enough votes for such absurd and counter-intuitive adventures in the Senate.
by santiago on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 06:47:55 PM EST
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That's a good question, but it is a relative one.  How much more, or less, efficient are American military expenditures than anyone else's?  We just don't know, so we should probably presume that everyone is about as bad in that respect until we've got other data on it.  (And from a friend of mine who is an American army colonel in logistics commands, the anecdotal horror stories in Turkey, Germany, and Australia are pretty astounding too.)

But another way to look at it is who else has enough economic resources and domestic willingness to establish fully staffed and supplied military commands in every region of the world that are capable of toppling the governments of large, enemy powers? Who else has Naval and Air base networks allowing logistical movements capable of toppling governments of large countries like Iraq and Afghanistan. Note, that although it has not proven easy or possible to politically impose peace or allied governments in Afghanistan or Iraq by military means, America found it quite easy to remove, virtually single-handedly, the offending governments from power, which really was the only military objective in each adventure. Is there any other country, or collection of countries, in the world that has the capacity of doing that today  (even Russia couldn't do it in Chechnya, a tiny country by comparison), because that is the infrastructure that would have to be replaced by any group of countries hoping to replace American power with their own collective version of a security bubble for liberal democratic governance.

by santiago on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 06:41:25 PM EST
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Why would Europe want to have a global base empire capable of removing governments at will throughout the world? I don't see any long term strategic benefit from it. Attempting to build an empire on which the sun never sets has broken the economic power of first Britain, then Russia and now very possibly the United States of America. Why would we want to repeat that mistake? It should be perfectly sufficient for our strategic needs to be able to defend our own shores, patrol the sea lanes and have enough men under arms to make an invasion a prohibitively expensive endeavour.

Nor have these interventions, on balance, done very much for global security, democracy or human rights and dignity. While you may be able to name one or two cases over the last fifty or sixty years, for each case of high-minded humanitarian intervention, I can give you at least a handful - more like a dozen - colonial wars aimed at securing the shady dealings of various moneyed interests.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 07:17:05 PM EST
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Attempting to build an empire on which the sun never sets has broken the economic power of first Britain, then Russia and now very possibly the United States of America.

You forget Spain before Britain, and the phrase was coined to refer to the Spanish empire.

The peak-to-trough part of the business cycle is an outlier. Carnot would have died laughing.

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 07:19:49 PM EST
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FOr one thing, because trade with places like China, India, Africa, South America, and maybe even the US, might depend on the protective bubble and the discourse of liberal democratic institutions.

This means that opting to go America-free in terms of international commitments might by the same as becoming trade free regarding the level of external contact outside of the EU that currently exists.  Perhaps that's okay and even a desirable outcome, but it might behoove us to look first and see what kinds things that we do actually like in the world today might not exist were it not for the sizable commitment made to international institutions by the United States and that might then have to be replaced by someone else if the US was to reduce its provision (or capability) of providing them.  

At the very least, with the threat of expanding additions of carbon and greenhouse gases by non-OECD countries, a means of asserting and compelling international commitment outside of a narrow EU region are probably necessary for the well-being of the EU.  

by santiago on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 07:26:29 PM EST
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The US has been one of the biggest obstacles to global action on climate change. And it has been undermining international institutions which didn't just rubberstamp US actions. I seriously don't see the US as a stabilizing influence in international affairs.

The peak-to-trough part of the business cycle is an outlier. Carnot would have died laughing.
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 07:32:57 PM EST
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The US has been an obstacle for the last 8 years, maybe.  On the other hand, Kyoto was brokered and almost entirely written by the US (Al Gore), the only country in the world to not eventually ratify itth -- go figure. (Which supports the thesis the German sociologist of imperialism, Karl Schmitt -- who has now been rediscovered by the left in that discipline.  His thesis was that you can tell who the true sovereign state is within an international system by looking at the one never seems to have to be held to its own rules for that system.)
by santiago on Sat Jul 11th, 2009 at 07:54:22 PM EST
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