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By proud, I mean ready to defend the European concept against nationalist or unilateralist  arguments. I can't do anything about where I was born, and I am aware of all the privileges.

I have steadfastly, in the past, refused to 'join' anything because I didn't like other people speaking on my behalf. ET is the first organization that I have joined for serious reasons, and the development of a better Europe is one of the main reasons for ET's existence.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sun Nov 7th, 2010 at 01:12:14 PM EST
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"I have steadfastly, in the past, refused to 'join' anything because I didn't like other people speaking on my behalf."

This is one of the effects of the dominance of the ideology of individualism - while in reality unity is strength. Other people, not at ones you might prefer, get to power and so speak on your behalf, partly because too many others didn't join something that, collectively, might have been effective in getting someone into power closer to your own ideas and values.  

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Sun Nov 7th, 2010 at 05:37:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes.
I am pretty much a loner, but I recognize that the ultimate power- perhaps the final power- of the people is the ability to act in consort.
 "Joining" implies a commonality of interests and objectives, which requires the ability to communicate these things- to chew on them with friends of like mind, until an agreement emerges. Then, as Joachim Wach pointed out, a "flight leader" is a good thing, if the theater is on fire.
But US citizens are generally busy with their toys, - and "joining" is so over- like marching, the hippies and all that stuff.

Maybe when the shit hits the fan this will change.
Personally, my real fear is that, as the dragon flails it's last, it will nuke someone.
If we get past that, then it's all tough, but possible.
Then Nordic Europe may be a new, better model.

Capitalism searches out the darkest corners of human potential, and mainlines them.

by geezer in Paris (risico at wanadoo(flypoop)fr) on Tue Nov 9th, 2010 at 06:00:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I don't think I am a victim of the ideology of individualism. For most of my life I have worked in collectives, teams, groups and crews. I regard one of my skills as helping to motivate cooperation in creative effort. If there were hierarchies, they were very open ones.

So these types of loose 'organization' are not ones where others speak on my behalf. Corporations, political parties, unions, religions, social groups, gender groups etc - these are the organizations I do not want to join.

I'm not really interested in voting someone into power who I don't understand quite well through long contact. I have had all sorts of media available through which to make my 'vote' clear, along with others who thought the same (creative) way. It's one of the Estates, you know...

But if J, for instance, sought political office and I could help, then I would: one person who I would definitely allow to speak on my behalf.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Tue Nov 9th, 2010 at 01:53:09 PM EST
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