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then the right wing would go crazy crazier.

Guardian: France to issue citizens' handbooks to every child

French children are to be given a "citizen's handbook" to teach them to be better republicans, as part of national identity measures announced by the government today.

Schools will be ordered to fly the French flag and to have a copy of the 1789 Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen in every classroom.

But, then every public school classroom in the U.S. I ever have been has had a U.S. flag and the children in elementary school still recite the Pledge of Allegiance. In the 1920s, the words "of America" were added so immigrant children were clear they were pledging to the American flag. Most kids have alternative, creative words to say when reciting the pledge at least by 2nd grade.

Classrooms used to have a picture of Geo. Washington and Abe Lincoln too. Having the Bill of Rights, etc. may be good too, but only if they were explained. Personally, I think every American should commit the Bill of Rights to memory. So, if the 1789 Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen is taught in the French schools, would this be bad to have a copy on hand?

The measures, announced by the French prime minister, François Fillon, are the first to emerge from the country's controversial debate on national identity.

What it means to be American, French, or any nation is always debatable. What outsiders think of French "national identity" may not be what the French see it as. Even within a nation, it is hard to agree on a "national identity". In America, for example, I doubt much consensus could be reached.

by Magnifico on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 01:37:16 PM EST
Ah, flagwaving, where I have seen this before...

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 01:50:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I get the sense that "national identity" issues in France are their equivalent of "flag burning" and are really pushed only by the right.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 02:08:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It actually is: Sarkozy campaigned on and added to the government a "Ministry of Immigration and National Identity" with the implication that the latter is a threat to the former: dog-whistling to the racist right wing of the electorate.

You'll note the irony of Sarkozy, son of an immigrant married to an Italian woman (plus Prime Minister Fillon married to an English woman).

Europeans think a hundred miles is a long way. Americans think a hundred years is a long time.

by Bernard on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 03:51:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hypocrisy only matters for those left of center, at least in the USA.    

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 05:40:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Even within a nation, it is hard to agree on a "national identity".

I guess it depends on the cultural homogeneity in the country. In the UK there is an assumption of homogeneity that breaks down savagely upon close inspection, even before we get into those who arrived in the last couple of centuries.

If we think of millennium old differences then Viking culture left a large imprint upon the north east of England and Scotland. The Celts down the west side of Britain are different again. The anglo-saxons in the south eastern parts of the country. And that's before we figure in the later stuff.

And because these differences are largely ignored, we end up with a vibrant culture but no real idea who the "English" are.

I always imagine that the rituals of belonging in the USA are attempts to create a shared national identity beyond its immigrant cultures. Unfortunately as the the intent is lost in the pomposity of obesiance  the ritual becomes pointless.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 02:58:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

It hardly "breaks down savagely"; of course there are some differences between various areas in England lingering on from the past, and some living in various areas will argue that some cities in those areas, even villages, are very different from each other. However, the question is how significant these are in comparison with differences between England and other nations.

If you go to other countries you tend to suffer from culture-shock, whatever area of the UK you come from, though the severity may differ somewhat. When you meet other English people abroad you become very aware of how much you have in common - despite what might be considered big differences at home.

I recommend "Watching the English" Kate Fox, which I and others find makes us very aware of how very English we are ("Yes I do that/think like that") despite what we thought was our very individual character:

"To a foreign person English are often indecipherable, even when the language is not a firewall. This book is a very good instruction manual of the Englishnes and in addition to that it is absolutely very funny, being nevertheless scientific and correct. All my English friends have been a little bit disappointed to have been revealed so openly."

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 06:32:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This "National Identity" was an electoral gimmick launched by Sarkozy as dog-whistling to the racist right wing electorate in view of the local elections due next month.

But they were hoisted by their own petard: the whole debate turned into a farce and maybe a useful reminder of some of the ugly racism deeply entrenched in part of the right (and even some of the left), but it mostly alienated moderates against this governmental initiative.

So it was decided to bury the embarrassing corpses, hence the flurry of half-assed proposals: flags in official building? Civic education at school? Duh, who would have thought?

This is the last stage of "declaring victory and go home".

Europeans think a hundred miles is a long way. Americans think a hundred years is a long time.

by Bernard on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 03:46:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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