European Tribune - Comments - Europe is doomed because Germany has too small an army!

Europe is doomed because Germany has too small an army! | 40 comments (40 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

Americans have a stunning problem with seeing the dynamics by which Europe functions. Since EU paradigms are based on EU history, which Americans have no experience with, most of them have no clue how things work here or what life is like here, or what peoples values are. I doubt America will ever get it...

btw I used this in one of my business English classes here... the reaction was pretty much, what are those idiots talking about... now they WANT us to have a stronger military and more aggressive foreign policy?? WTF????

Life is not a dress rehearsal

by johnfire (johnfire@christopherrehm.com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 05:04:57 AM EST

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 8)

I think Americans and Europeans both suffer from the delusion that the US and Europe are more similar than they actually are. Something like Churchill's "Britain and America are two nations divided by a common language".

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 05:08:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 5)

good point. and very true. having lived here now for 4 years, in Germany and Switzerland its very clear that the cultures are totally different. really different underlying value systems. but there is something unique about americans that blinds them to the rest of the world, and that is the ingrained american notion that somehow in spite of our flaws america is the greatest country in the world. it isnt. as soon as most americans are confronted with data that proves it they start to have something of a breakdown because it shatters a deeply held false myth that america is the greatest country ever. i dont expect america to change, and i dont think the rest of the world should waste anymore time on expecting america to dig the world out of the current situation. it isnt going to happen, rather , i think america will basically go broke in a few years and split up...

Life is not a dress rehearsal

by johnfire (johnfire@christopherrehm.com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 06:00:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 4)

I have seen many Americans go through that sort of "breakdown" in the Bush years. Starting with anger and denial, of course.

The question is what consequences the Obama presidency will have. It seems like in 2008 he allowed people to believe it was all a bad dream that would soon be over (well, some people - for some others a Black president with a muslim name was proof positive of the endtimes). What if people become disenchanted? And, are the teabaggers going through the same breakdown as the progressives did 8 years ago?

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 06:08:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 2)

i expect that at some point the dollar will collapse and the american govt will be bankrupt. at that point everything breaks down, america goes into the worst depression the world has ever seen( its heading there already.. trust me) and civil unrest breaks out. it could be a neo fascist type takes over and reorders the american way of life, or it could just devolve into another civil war( far more likely than most europeans realize, as the differences between the rural and industrial states culturally are much larger than most euros realize) and eventually balkanizes into 6 to 10 smaller countries...

Life is not a dress rehearsal

by johnfire (johnfire@christopherrehm.com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 06:12:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 5)

at some point the dollar will collapse and the american govt will be bankrupt

The US doesn't have much debt (public or private) denominated in currencies other than the US Dollar, so the government can only go bankrupt if the Fed makes the political decision to let it go bankrupt.

However, the US is a net importer so a collapse of the dollar would be painful for consumers.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 06:24:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 4)

a deeply held false myth that america is the greatest country ever

Not just "a" myth. I think that has claim to being the US' national myth.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 06:09:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 17)

It's not so strange that they didn't get it. You need to translate the newspeak first. And that is not surprising, since it really is a masterpiece of the art. The use of "Related Articles" is particularly elegant, and may signify a new development in the net-savvy of professional astroturfers.

In the spirit of improved international understanding, permit me to provide a handy guide:

Make the European Union more efficient at home and stronger abroad.		Provide Europe with a phone number that Kissinger could call when he wanted the Europe to do something.
a newly emboldened world power stepping up to calm trouble spots, using aid and persuasion where it could, but prepared to send in troops when it had to.		Playing good-cop, bad-cop with the US State Department where that could work, and footing part of the bill for American colonial wars when the uppity natives didn't play ball.
At the climate change conference in Copenhagen in December, it was China and the U.S. who haggled over a final deal, while Europe sat on the sidelines.		All international action still has to involve the US, no matter how much they drag their heels and fail to take meaningful action. And if somebody looks like he won't play ball, they'll find a way to torpedo the initiative.
Whether or not to bail out Greece, whose debt has dragged down Europe's currency.		[Europe.Is.Doomed™ Alert]
Little wonder that Europe finds itself in one of its periodic bouts of angst-ridden self-doubt.		Thinking is for wussies. Real Men^TM Stay The Course^TM.
Where does it fit into a world that seems set to be dominated by China and the U.S.?		Neutrality is for wimps. Pick a goddamn power bloc already, or start making your own colonial wars.
Would anyone notice if it disappeared? (See pictures of immigration in Europe.)		[Europe.Is.Doomed™ Alert] because Europe lets in so many brown people who speak funny. And everybody knows that brown people who speak funny are here to take our wives and hate our freedoms.
Charles Grant, director of the London-based think tank Centre for European Reform.		Tory Bliar's Poodle at the belief tank Centre for European Thirdworldization.
But the good life at home doesn't make Europe strong abroad.		Neutrality is for wimps.
On the grand stage it has lacked the weight and influence of others.		How many divisions does the EU have?
At times, it simply seems unable to say what it thinks.		At times, it simply seems unable to say what we want it to think.
the U.S. has a reasonably well-articulated China policy		Having finally woken up to the reality that China is a serious Great Power (after about fifty years of pretending that it sorta didn't exist), we now have a clear and coherent, if not particularly well thought out, position on it.
Engage economically, encourage democratically, and criticize on human rights when appropriate.		Import unemployment, export Democracy^TM (which we don't need at home anyway), criticise on human rights grounds when it doesn't cost us anything.
What's the E.U.'s China policy in a few words? (Read: "Should Europe Lift Its Arms Embargo on China?")		Detail and nuance are for wimps. (Read: And we're the only ones who are allowed to sell guns to dictatorships we wish to cozy up to.)
"When it comes to pressing international problems like Afghanistan, Pakistan or North Korea, the E.U. is either largely invisible or absent," wrote Grant in his essay, provocatively titled "Is Europe Doomed to Fail as a Power?"		"When it comes to sending men and women to die and kill in other people's colonial wars, the EU is either largely invisible or absent," wrote Bliar's Poodle in his essay, titled in an appeal to the Conventional Wisdom of his target audience, " [Europe.Is.Doomed™ Alert] "
Editor of Limes, one of Italy's leading foreign policy magazines.		Editor of Limes, one of Italy's English-language foreign policy magazines.
says the problem is a Cold War hangover.		Projection (n): (psychology) An expression of denial which involves attributing one's own perceived character flaws to others.
The post-World War II period was a golden age for Western Europe, a time of reconstruction under the U.S. security umbrella,		Real Men^TM have one eye on the Russians and one finger on the Button at all times.
"We're in denial," Caracciolo says. "We see that the Americans are not interested — to put it mildly — in our interests."		With the Russian empire having collapsed, it is no longer self-evidently true that Western Europe's geopolitical interests are coterminous with American ditto.
And we put our head in the sand.		And the uncomfortable realisation is beginning to creep into an unfortunate number of people (though fortunately few that really matter) that American and European interests on the subcontinent are no longer aligned.
Europe "happily decides," Caracciolo says, that Afghanistan, Iran, are American affairs.		Some parts of Europe figure out that there really isn't any good reason to fight American colonial wars any more.
"Any major crisis is something that is analyzed abroad.		Thinking is for wimps. Real Men^TM Stay The Course^TM
We are not up to the responsibilities of the time." (Read: "Protecting Europe's Bank Data: U.S. Access Denied.")		Europe is dimly beginning to realise that the Wrr on Trr is a crock of shit. (And we're really pissed that we can't use it as a cheap excuse for industrial espionage anymore.)
The Lisbon Treaty, establishing the new offices of the President of the European Council and the High Representative for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy, was supposed to change all that.		We were really hoping that Bliar would pull off his coup d'etat and bring the EU firmly back into line with American foreign policy.
In practice, however, the new E.U. will be run by a complex mechanism with four axes:		But he failed, so the EU will still be run under the principle of separation of powers (as opposed to the ~~Führerprinzip~~ Unitary Executive that we've had so much fun with on our side of the Pond).
the President and Foreign Minister; the country holding the rotating presidency; the President of the European Commission and national heads of state and government.		The directly elected European Parliament and the European courts do not exist or have no real power.
The new setup looks like a parody of all that is wrong with the E.U.,		Constitutional government and separation of powers are for wimps.
bureaucratic and complicated, built on least-bad options and seemingly designed to encourage turf wars rather than action.		Compromise is for wimps. Real Men^TM do first-past-the-post elective monarchies.
Critics point to the selection of Herman Van Rompuy and Catherine Ashton as Europe's President and Foreign Minister as symbolic of a lack of vision.		The Villagers would really, really have liked Tory Bliar's coup d'etat to succeed, and are really, really disappointed that the people who were actually appointed have some respect for the actual treaties and the rule of law. Because rule of law is for wimps.
Van Rompuy, a former Belgian Prime Minister, is known for his ability to balance local sensitivities — no small feat in Belgium — and cajole opposing camps towards a consensus. Useful attributes, no doubt, but hardly the ones needed to make the E.U. count on the international stage.		The European President should be an international figurehead. Like Tory Bliar. (Nevermind the fact that the treaties do not stipulate any such role for the chairman of the Council - see above on Real Men^TM and the rule of law.)
"Van Rompuy and Ashton give the impression of being chosen for their limits rather than their merits,"		Van Rompuy is a puny wimp who (probably) won't try to arrogate powers and prerogatives that he is not constitutionally entitled to, and Ashton was the only PES candidate who wasn't Tory Bliar (and yeah, we're still sore that our Manchurian Candidate lost - just in case you were wondering at this point).
One senior European official frets that when it comes to the E.U. projecting itself, the choice of Van Rompuy and Ashton means the grouping will have to reconcile itself to five years of underperformance.		A sockpuppet whom I just made up out of whole cloth is concerned that Europe won't be spilling blood and treasure fighting American colonial wars.
But for all that ambition, Europe is no closer than it ever was to answering Henry Kissinger's famous question: "Who do I call when I want to call Europe?"		"... to give them an order that I can expect will be obeyed?"
[The EU] could end the violence that had regularly engulfed the continent for centuries. Judged by that measure — and notwithstanding the pathetic failure to prevent or quickly end the wars of the Yugoslav succession — the E.U. has worked out fine.		Neutrality is for wimps. And American policy was what salvaged something from Yugoslavia, after American policy made a rather heavy contribution to the need for such a salvage operation. But nevermind the last bit.
By extending an area of peace and liberal government to the east, the E.U. has done much to calm a part of the world that not long ago was the cockpit for murderous rivalries.		Bringing the insane, fundagelical League of Polish Families and the Latvian neofascists into the EU was a great idea - it both ensured a permanent far-right presence in the European government and pissed off Russia.
Beyond its neighborhood, however the E.U. has rarely punched its collective weight.		Neutrality is for wimps.
"They see Europe as a place — with a common market, a common currency, but not a power that should project itself onto the outside world." (See pictures of immigration in Europe.)		The brown people who speak funny and hate our freedom are coming to eat us.
That argument begins to break down when you have aspirations to help fix the world.		How many divisions does the EU have?
Many in the rest of the world would welcome a stronger European voice. Capitals from Pretoria to Washington are constantly urging more from their European allies.		We want Europe to foot more of the bill - both in blood and treasure - for our colonial wars.
"We hope E.U. member states will invest the post-Lisbon institutions with the authority and capacity to make concrete contributions to the pressing global challenges we face together."		We hope EU member states will start obeying us more consistently, and stop pretending to have an independent foreign policy.
In Africa, India, Latin America, leaders would fall over themselves to engage more closely with a power that's neither the U.S. nor China		Hey, two or three centuries of colonial exploitation is just water under the bridge, right? Right? (Oh, and China is just as unpopular as the US on the world stage. Right?)
European leaders arrived in the Danish capital giving the impression that setting an example would be enough to persuade others into making concessions. But the conference took a different turn. A group of developing countries threatened to walk out.		The breakdown of COP15 had everything to do with Europe not being a bully and nothing at all to do with the fact that the Americans and the Quislings and traitors in the Danish government had made a backstage deal that was even less ambitious than what was eventually decided.
With negotiations on the verge of collapse, Obama entered a room where delegates from China were meeting those from Brazil, India and South Africa. They struck a deal and then presented it to Europe and other participants.		Seeing their cozy do-nothing arrangement threatened by a firm third-world bloc, the Americans had to go in and broker some kind of compromise.
In a bitter irony, it is one of modern Europe's most cherished convictions — that the force of arms rarely settles political disputes for long — that inhibits it from being a more powerful player.		Neutrality is for wimps. How many divisions does Europe have?
European nations have sent thousands of young men and women to fight the Taliban, but the memory of the 20th century means European public opinion seems unwilling to commit to the war in Afghanistan for the long haul.		Some Europeans are starting to ask themselves why we're pissing away blood, treasure, political capital and the lives of the locals to fight an American colonial war in a part of the world where they have no perceptible strategic interest.
To Washington, which knows that the world remains a dangerous place, these attitudes have become a serious concern.		We are really scared that Europeans may decide to stop paying for, killing and dying in our colonial wars.
"The demilitarization of Europe — where large swaths of the general public and political class are averse to military force and the risks that go with it — has gone from a blessing in the 20th century to an impediment to achieving real security and lasting peace in the 21st."		When you were our rivals, we wanted you to demilitarise. Now that you are our vassals, we want you to rearm.
Plenty of European diplomats would agree with him.		Look: All my sockpuppets agree with me.
"We have to explain to our own public opinion," he said, "the world we live in." (Read: "What is Robert Gates Really Fighting For?")		Democracy is a real bitch sometimes, getting in the way of a nice little colonial war. (Read: "What part of our empire do we want Europe to pay for maintaining?"
Yes, Britain still sees itself as having a global role		Britain, fortunately, labours under the delusion that it can treat its imperial phantom limb pain with a quick dose of US-led terrorism against some semi-random third-world country.
so does France, whose President, Nicolas Sarkozy, has been active on issues from the Georgia war of 2008 to the consequences of a nuclear Iran.		And thank God for the French finally managing to elect a Quisling who will proselytise for our policy in exchange for a photo-op (nevermind that the Russians pretty much presented him with a fait accompli and told him to go suck on it).
But since the end of the Cold War, [Germany] has stepped back from the E.U., [...] and strengthening ties with Russia, to the chagrin of Britain and France.		Germany isn't buying into our policy of belligerent encirclement of Russia, and that's really worrying us.
But the U.S. President's decision to skip the Spain summit, and his failure to attend the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall, has had Europe acting like a jilted lover.		The fact that the American president doesn't spend more time in Europe is worrying the Villagers, because it deprives them of their photo-ops.
reaching out in a true partnership to the nations of North Africa — another good Sarkozy idea		Let's claim that the idea of Mediterranean cooperation was the personal invention of our sockpuppet in Paris, rather than a long-standing policy hijacked for the greater glory of Sarko.
"In a post-American world, the United States knows it needs effective partners. If Europe cannot step up, the U.S. will look for other privileged partners to do business with."		If you aren't a servile vassal, you're an enemy.
Position: President of the European Commission Powers: Head of the E.U.'s executive branch. It's possible that this role and that of Council President will one day be combined		We would really like the Council to usurp the prerogatives of the other branches of government.
Position: President of the European Council Powers: Should Europe's top job be an administrative role or that of an assertive continental boss? Much will depend on the tone set by this former Belgian leader		We would really like the chairman of the Council to usurp the Foreign Minister's job.
Position: President of the European Parliament Powers: Chairs parliamentary debate and represents Europe's legislature.		The Parliament debates and discusses but does not really make decisions. Since we know that debate is for wimps (Real Men^TM Stay The Course^TM, remember?), we may safely discount this branch of government.
[End of article.]		Let's not mention the European courts and hope that they will just sort of go away. Judicial review can be such a pain in the ass sometimes.

Hope that clears up any confusion.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 07:22:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 2)

As an aside, can we petition Google for a Newspeak to English translator?

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 07:31:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (none / 0)

I was wondering where you have been. Good to see you, Jake!

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 12:21:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 4)

That would make a great handout for johnfire's "Business English for Germans" course...

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 07:32:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 5)

Superb post.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 07:58:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 6)

Target rich environment.

It felt a little unsporting, actually. Like shooting fish in a barrel... using a tank-mounted machine gun.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 08:25:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 4)

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 09:02:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (4.00 / 2)

- MfM

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 09:23:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (none / 1)

I think it's a very apt deconstruction.

It may seem obvious to you, but it won't be obvious to everyone.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 11:48:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Europe is doomed (none / 1)

devastating deconstruction, prime A!

European Tribune - Europe is doomed because Germany has too small an army!

Britain, fortunately, labours under the delusion that it can treat its imperial phantom limb pain with a quick dose of US-led terrorism against some semi-random third-world country.

ROFLMAO

very nice to see you back, and so on form, Jake.

~"When an inner situation is not made conscious, it appears outside as fate." Karl Jung~

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 01:25:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

niceè (none / 1)

If you re-post this as a diary, I'll front page it.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 01:33:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: niceè (none / 0)

Done.

I may clean up the layout later. Or maybe not. Depends on how much I still hate it tomorrow afternoon.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Mar 7th, 2010 at 05:53:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Europe is doomed because Germany has too small an army! | 40 comments (40 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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