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Seems to me that institutional investors are one of the big sources of malignant corporate policies...

Say what you will about the CEO of a steelworking company, he's likely to understand the steel business a lot better than the CEO of a pension fund.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Fri Aug 27th, 2010 at 07:03:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, but the CEO of a steel company gets a massive pay increase for juicing the stock price from 1% below the strike price to 1% above the strike price on his options, and loses nothing if the stock price drops from 1% below the strike price to 50% below the strike price, so the incentive to take risks is far greater for the CEO of the company itself, paid primarily in stock options, than for the institutional investor.

And of course, its not always the case that the guy who was Chief Financial Officer of the Gap who is now CEO of a Steel Company actually does know more about the steel business than an institutional investor ... it certainly would have been true back in the day that CEO's primarily came up from operations, now that they primarily come up through finance, its not always true.

But more importantly, sure, hopefully even if the CEO started out not knowing a lot about the industry the business is in, they quickly come up to speed ... the incentive that we have set up for CEO's is to chase the quick bucks right away. Senior management blaming "the markets" are blaming the fact that they are chasing short term stock price increases ... and the right to chase short term price increases is what they were defending when there was a threat that the cost of stock options would be as such in the profit and loss statement in the 1990's and the corporate jets descended on Washington DC.


I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 12:03:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
While that is all true, what makes you think that the CEO of the institutional investor is less susceptible to these problems, or that the CEO of an institutional investor is subject to greater oversight?

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 05:13:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The exorbitant salary of the CEO of an instititional invester may depend in a similar way on the share price of that firm, but not on the share price of the shares they hold. Institutional investors have far less incentive to support risky gambles in the companies whose stock they hold.

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 10:12:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Why would that be so? If the CEO's plans fail, he'll lose just as much of his share value as the institutional investor will lose on his investment in the company.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 10:51:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But CEO's in the US do not get paid primarily in stock, they get paid primarily in stock options. If the option is to buy stock at $50/share, and the stock is at $48, nothing is lost in those options from the stock dropping by $8, and a great deal is gained in those options from the stock rising by $8.

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 01:44:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Really? And here I thought everyone knew that handing out stock options to CEO's is an insane way of rewarding management, as it disaligns the interests of shareholders with that of the management. It for example shifts the focus from dividends to share buybacks, among other things.

Really, doesn't everyone know this? I read of it (for abouth the thosandth time) as late as a few days ago, in  a book I just bought.


Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 01:56:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hence the occasionally discussed agency problem in corporate governance. In theory, corporate officers should be selected by and accountable to the shareholders, but this is rarely the case in practice. Just another one of those problems, about which we seem never able to do anything effective. Now the SEC is supporting a rule that allows any group that holds 3% of the stock of a publicly traded corporation to be able to propose candidates for the board of directors. We will see if this holds and if it makes any difference.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 09:38:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]
On the other hand, institutional investors have been on the forefront of the whole leveraged buyout game, and are the ones driving the unrealistic expectation of double-digit (or even high single digit) real return on investment.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 12:43:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
And the institutional investors were also heavily involved in the move by retirement funds into commodities. IIRCC, CALPERS is still reeling from the hit they took on oil futures when they were too slow to exit positions in June and July, 2007.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 08:41:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Doesn't lose anything? If the stock price doesn't go up, his options becomes worthless and he loses all the money he bought options for.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 10:45:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
He didn't spend any money buying the options, they were compensation. And the point about the moral hazard is that once the stock option goes out of the money, there is no further loss.

Consider the fair value of the following 50:50 bets for stock currently at $50 to someone with options to buy stock at $48, maturing sometime in the next three months (values times 0.5 chance of occurring):

$48:$52, incremental value -$1+$1=+$0
$40:$60, incremental value -$1+$5=+$4
$30:$70, incremental value -$1+$10=+$9
... and so on.

If the stock option is out of the money, it only makes the incentive to pursue bigger win / bigger loss bets stronger.

Of course if the stock price goes down, someone holding the stock does not recover until it returns to its original level.

By contrast, someone paid in short term stock options will have the stock options issued relative to current market price, so if last quarter they lost, they restart at a lower level and continue gambling from there.

Payment in short maturity stock options involves substantially higher moral hazard than payment in stock or in long maturity options.

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 01:53:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That's an utterly insane bonus system.

If you want to have bonuses for corporate officers, you could just give them an extra sack of cash. If they believe in the company they can use that money to buy shares, or even options, in it.

Alternatively one could issue shares to them, which would be held in an escrow account for 5-10 years after which they can be sold.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid (arvid.hallen at gmail.com) on Sat Aug 28th, 2010 at 02:00:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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