Three months that will test the Eurozone | 223 comments (223 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Disclosure (none / 0)

Those are good questions, but I don't know the answers any more than I know where in the Treaties the following comes from:

The eurozone was founded on the three principles of No Default, No Bailout, and No Exit

Economics is politics by other means

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Apr 11th, 2011 at 08:08:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

My guess is that it would be politically much easier to gloss over a default, using some twist that may probably be found in some treaty and then, in a few months, prepare a solution through a new treaty (as for the deficit and debt rules). Spain would be in a political mess, sure, but this wouldn't be the end of the European Union, as would be excluding a member.

I personally pray for Ireland to default first, because that would weaken the anglo-group of countries in the EU political game.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Mon Apr 11th, 2011 at 08:28:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 0)

The Anglo countries aren't the problem this time around ...

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Mon Apr 11th, 2011 at 09:36:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

Seen from a federal EU, they are. It's Ireland and Britain which mainly pushed the agenda of privatization in the EU commission regulation.

A default in an Anglo country would, I feel, be important to rule out the return of the deregulation at the EU level.

On the contrary, if one of the southern PIGS breaks up, it would reinforce the Britain view on the EU, which is a huge cause of social stagnation in Europe.

Germany, notwithstanding the current issues, is usually more prone to state regulation, probably due to its industrial background.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Mon Apr 11th, 2011 at 12:24:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

You'd think with all that influence the Irish would have been able to get themselves a better deal, eh?

Don't confuse the Irish being held up as an example with the Irish doing the pushing.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Mon Apr 11th, 2011 at 12:29:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I am reminded of the period in the late 1980s (4.00 / 4)

when New Zealand was, for a couple of years, the poster boy of Chicago-school economics.

When it became obvious to everyone what an unmitigated disaster that was, it completely dropped off the radar (in fact the country was never heard of again)

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Mon Apr 11th, 2011 at 12:38:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

In any case, the narrative will be profligate public spending if the Irish default. You lose anyway.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Mon Apr 11th, 2011 at 12:30:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

This may be so... but as you guys in Green Eire are english-talking people, it will be easier to convince the Good Bankers Guys that it was not public spending.

To be clear, I believe that there is a strong xenophobic bias in the mainstream analysis of the mediterranean crisis. So, if you allow me a bit of cynicism, if it's a bunch of white aryan guys who get dunced first, then it would mitigate this view.

The best would be the fall of Britain bank's. I'm counting on Cameron on this issue.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 02:35:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

Xavier in Paris:

This may be so... but as you guys in Green Eire are english-talking people, it will be easier to convince the Good Bankers Guys that it was not public spending.

The bankers that need to be convinced are German-speaking.

Economics is politics by other means

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 04:09:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

Xavier in Paris:

I believe that there is a strong xenophobic bias in the mainstream analysis of the mediterranean crisis. So, if you allow me a bit of cynicism, if it's a bunch of white aryan guys who get dunced first, then it would mitigate this view.

You're assimilating the Irish to "white aryan"? You're aware of the Irish being called "white niggers", aren't you?

In any case, the "superior race" in this here crisis is the Protestant, and the Irish are Catholic.

Economics is politics by other means

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 04:13:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 0)

I believe that compared to what the british may think of the greeks, Irish people get out well.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 06:37:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

I just figured out why you keep talking about the British - you're thinking about the "market" while I'm thinking about the ECB...

There are two principal centers of action here: London (via the City, the Financial Times and The Economist) and Frankfurt (Bundesbank, ECB, Financial Times Deutschland).

Economics is politics by other means

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 06:47:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 0)

Frankfurt (Bundesbank, ECB, Financial Times Deutschland)

On the last, you mean FAZ (FTD is in Hamburg).

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 08:03:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

I think Migeru an opthers are using Frankurt more like a imaginary place. Not so much the real location.

by IM on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:31:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (4.00 / 2)

Metonymy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Metonymy (pronounced mɨˈtɒnɨmi, mi-ton-uh-mee [1]) is a figure of speech used in rhetoric in which a thing or concept is not called by its own name, but by the name of something intimately associated with that thing or concept. For instance, "Westminster" is used as a metonym (an instance of metonymy) for the Parliament of the United Kingdom, because it is located there.

Economics is politics by other means

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:46:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

So the FTD may be physically located in ... (none / 0)

... Hamburg, but its heart is in Frankfort?

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Wed Apr 13th, 2011 at 01:59:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I may have missed it... (none / 1)

but was the FTD as bad as the FAZ in the crisis-mongering?

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Wed Apr 13th, 2011 at 05:12:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Don't know, don't regularly read either ... (none / 0)

... Financial Times.

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Wed Apr 13th, 2011 at 07:00:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 0)

I apologize by the way if I sound offensive. I personally have nothing against Ireland. Nevertheless, I actually think that there is some bias in the english speaking world against Europe in a general point of view, and in particular against the south of Europe. German bankers also have this bias, and I think it's cultural, transmitted through the university, and the feeling these people may have that they belong to an elite.

I'll had that you may find quite easily this kind of behaviour in France too.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 06:42:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (4.00 / 2)

f it's a bunch of white aryan guys who get dunced first, then it would mitigate this view.

The first to get dunced were white aryans - Iceland....

The best would be the fall of Britain bank's. I'm counting on Cameron on this issue.

I'm with you there. But don't forget to give Clegg some credit as well.

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 04:16:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 0)

Protestant, too. However, there is no narrative of irresponsible people living off welfare having caused the disaster.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 05:32:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 0)

Iceland did not get screwed up. They just refused to pay, and sent their creditors out with a thanks.

I'm not believing that they are doing badly.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 06:38:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Disclosure (none / 1)

I agree with you that Iceland is doing the right thing (by now). But they get away with it because they are northern Protestants. If the Greeks did exactly the same thing, they'd be attacked by the media using all the usual stereotypes. Ireland will or will not be treated like the Greeks depending on which stereotype of Ireland the media believes in.

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Apr 12th, 2011 at 06:49:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Three months that will test the Eurozone | 223 comments (223 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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