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The ECB like the court is appointed by the national governments. That is a considerable power.

And of course in any legal conflict about the powers of the ECB the court would decide. Don't know if you can call it oversight in a strict sense.

by IM on Mon Aug 15th, 2011 at 08:41:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"National governments" is not "the Council."

And the ECBuBa isn't subject to any meaningful oversight from any court of law. Central bank "independence," remember? Will you at least concede that this is a stupid doctrine that needs to be killed dead and exorcised with garlic and holy water?

Sure, if Trichet commits embezzlement or rapes his secretary, he might be prosecuted (or maybe not - bankers have done worse and walked away in recent times). That does not mean that the courts can in any meaningful way provide oversight and policy direction to the ECBuBa (nor should they - that should be Parliament's job, through the Commission).

- Jake

Austerity can only be implemented in the shadow of a concentration camp.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon Aug 15th, 2011 at 09:03:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"National governments" is not "the Council.

Of course they are. Who do you think constitutes the council?

But you got me there: The executive board is indeed appointed by the council, not the governments. They even use qualified majority voting.
(I was thinking of the way the commission and court are appointed)

The rest of the governing council is indeed appointed by national governments, namely the heads of the central banks.

And who can determine the personal of another institution has power over that institution.

And if the ECB is ever in a legal dispute, the European Court of Justice will decide. The court is probably the most powerful european institution and if you don't even know this, you have no business commenting on the EU.

by IM on Mon Aug 15th, 2011 at 09:33:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The ECBuBa can never get into any meaningful legal dispute, because its mandate explicitly includes protection from all democratic oversight. Central bank independence, remember?

Again: Will you at least grant that central bank independence is an idiotic doctrine and that the bank should be directly subservient to the Commission, just like every other EU civil service?

- Jake

Austerity can only be implemented in the shadow of a concentration camp.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon Aug 15th, 2011 at 09:37:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
a) will you at least grant that the court is more powerful

b) will you at least grant that the ECB is the ECB and not the Bundesbank?

c) will you at least admit that the national governments and the council determine the composition of the governing council of the ECB? Giving the federal republic about as much influence as larger german state had on the Bundesbank?

by IM on Mon Aug 15th, 2011 at 09:47:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
a) will you at least grant that the court is more powerful

In most policy areas, yes. In economic policy, which is, after all, the area presently under discussion, no. There is no substantial judicial review of ECB policy decisions.

b) will you at least grant that the ECB is the ECB and not the Bundesbank?

De jure, certainly. De facto, I cannot point to a single material difference in policy before the past few days.

c) will you at least admit that the national governments and the council determine the composition of the governing council of the ECB?

Obviously, yes.

Giving the federal republic about as much influence as larger german state had on the Bundesbank?

a) That does not follow from the composition of the board.

b) The BuBa always was a state-within-the-state in Germany, so pointing out that the German government fails to control the BuBa representatives to the ECB board hardly proves that the BuBa is not still a cancerous state-within-the-state.

Now, do you or do you not believe that inflation targeting and central bank independence are moronic policies? Do you or do you not believe that states should be forced to pay interest on their own currency? I'd really like to know if we're even speaking the same language here.

- Jake

Austerity can only be implemented in the shadow of a concentration camp.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon Aug 15th, 2011 at 10:15:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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