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OECD says 29.4% (41.9% for France).I found the tax cheating shocking when I was there, I am surprised by the 29.4%, could it be that a large part of GDP is not in the statistics because of black ??
by fredouil (fredouil@gmailgmailgmail.com) on Sun Feb 12th, 2012 at 02:50:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Are those aggregate? Do they include social contributions?

Here's Eurostat: http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/portal/page/portal/government_finance_statistics/introduction

Click on the following:

  1. Database
  2. Annual Government Finance Statistics
  3. Government Revenue
  4. Under the INDIC scroll menu, click on Total Government Revenue

Something is wrong about that OECD grid because almost all of the European countries hover around 40-45%.

Greece was at 39.5% for 2010, and hovered around 40% for the last decade.

Are you seriously judging how people are handling their money during a total economic meltdown when capital has fled the country? Seriously? It's very hard to believe.

Greece right now has a primary surplus for the gov't budget. the interest on debt is well above 10% GDP. Are you saying that the Greeks should pay an amount well over and above that primary surplus in order to pay the bankers?

As I said, they collect enough in tax revenue now for gov't expenditures. They don't collect enough for debt--and they never will. It is impossible.

by Upstate NY on Sun Feb 12th, 2012 at 03:04:10 PM EST
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Tax relative to GDP is notoriously easy to make whatever you want it to be, by netting or not netting out taxes on government salaries, social protection, etc.

If Eurostat says one thing and the OECD/IMF/World Bank says another thing, then Eurostat is more likely to be right.

- Jake

Austerity can only be implemented in the shadow of a concentration camp.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Feb 12th, 2012 at 03:08:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
you know better but what s the solution, debt forgiveness (and bankruptcy) by bank like Jerome's employer ;-)

What ever works but yes things are going to change now.

by fredouil (fredouil@gmailgmailgmail.com) on Sun Feb 12th, 2012 at 03:12:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
We're far beyond discussions of whether there should be debt forgiveness.

2 years ago, the Greeks were at 115% debt to GDP, but they were overspending by $30 billion. A quick adjustment of the budget deficit down to 5% (or $20 billion) would have turned them around in one fell swoop and those could have coupled with 5% cuts as in Portugal. Instead, they have cut by 19% or $56 billion and are now looking at 2% more cut in GDP (an additional $6 billion). And the bailout money paid out so far is around $80 billion. Do the math, it doesn't add up.

And now you know precisely why the troika wants an escrow account to funnel money directly to the banks in Greece's name. Greeks won't own that debt that's in an escrow account. Essentially, the troika has underscored to the Greek people that this money is not for Greece, but for the banks. The natural reply of the citizens is: "in that case...."

by Upstate NY on Sun Feb 12th, 2012 at 03:28:50 PM EST
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