Wulff gone | 138 comments (138 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

There will be a CDU/FDP/SPD/Grüne common candidate.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 08:55:40 AM EST

It narrows the comedy options considerably.

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:10:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's a shame (none / 0)

Only if they will agree on a candidate; they could fail after all.

But I think there will be agreement and in less then thirty days there will be a new president.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:14:02 AM EST
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Re: That's a shame (none / 0)

those 30 days should be enough time to get Seehofer indicted.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:24:17 AM EST
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Re: That's a shame (none / 0)

But fathering bastards is not a crime anymore.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:26:00 AM EST
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Re: That's a shame (none / 0)

Are you sure he has never been bribed? After all he does hold an office. We should look into it.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:28:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's a shame (4.00 / 5)

You just want to discriminate against the bavarian culture. Bavarian politicians are obligated to have affairs and to be involved in (financial) affairs.

So no cultural imperialism, please!

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:37:13 AM EST
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Re: That's a shame (4.00 / 5)

When we make colonies out of Greece and Portugal, because they can no longer be trusted to vote, we mustn't forget Bavaria: they could never be trusted to vote.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:53:02 AM EST
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Re: That's a shame (none / 0)

At least they pay for Bremen.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:56:29 AM EST
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Re: That's a shame (4.00 / 3)

After being on the receiving end of Länderfinanzausgleich for 32 years, remember. These lazy Bavarians exploited the north and industrialised themselves and now they've got to pay. Unfortunately we didn't demand they dismantle their late-feudal system in exchange for our money.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:04:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's a shame (none / 0)

It seems contempt for idleness runs north to south in Europe (I certainly noticed it when I live in Germany.). Are the folks in Svalbard the ones who ultimately get to pee on the rest of the continent on this issue?

by rifek on Tue Feb 21st, 2012 at 04:20:10 PM EST
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Re: That's a shame (4.00 / 2)

If they are idle, the polarbears eat them. Or so I have heard.

A vote for PES is a vote for EPP! A vote for EPP is a vote for PES! Support the coalition, vote EPP-PES!

by A swedish kind of death on Wed Feb 22nd, 2012 at 04:24:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's a shame (4.00 / 3)

And being one never has been.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:28:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's a shame (none / 1)

I say Joschka Fischer.

tens of millions of people stand to see their lives ruined because the bureaucrats at the ECB don't understand introductory economics -- Dean Baker

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:06:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

That (none / 1)

was my first thought too, but for some reason he doesn't seem to be in the running.

Th stern, for example has a list:

http://www.stern.de/politik/deutschland/kandidaten-fuer-die-wulff-nachfolge-wer-soll-bundespraesiden t-werden-1788056.html

1. Gauck
2.Lammert

Schäuble
von der Leyen
Klaus Töpfer

and so on. Of course that is just guessing too.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:10:33 AM EST
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Re: That (none / 0)

Just personally, Schäuble's my best guess; Lammert never occurred to me, but he's plausible too.

OTOH, Merkel's probably still pissed off over the Gauck nomination last time, von der Leyen still has a political future and everyone's forgotten who Klaus Töpfer was.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:33:47 AM EST
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Re: That (none / 1)

Disagree about Töpfer. The idea is to have someone who is uncontroversial because they are not deep in party politics. Töpfer could probably manage that.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:38:22 AM EST
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Re: That (none / 0)

Actually I think Töpfer is quite plausible and he would have done it last time, if Merkel had agreed. He is the oldest of the candidates under discussion, though.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:40:51 AM EST
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Re: That (none / 0)

Better to have your appointee die in office than to have to resign due to scandal. Merkel could have a parade of octogenarians putting in final acts, if she could find ones that wouldn't embarrass.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 09:56:34 PM EST
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Re: That (none / 0)

What about de Maizière? He was in the game a month ago.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 11:46:06 AM EST
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Re: That (none / 0)

Still in the game.

As things develop, we will have results on sunday or so.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 11:52:53 AM EST
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Re: That's a shame (none / 0)

The SPD wouldn't like that. It would be a signal saying the next coalition is black/green...

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:10:36 AM EST
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If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

then it's an exceedingly poor way to select a head of state.

But we already knew that...

Schaüble for fuck's sake?? Or is this another Schaüble I don't know about?

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:13:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 1)

No, that Schäuble, he was already serious in the running once. On the other hand Merkel needs him as minister.

"If it's all about party politics
then it's an exceedingly poor way to select a head of state."

Yes. Could never happen in other countries.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:17:07 AM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

In most countries (I'm open to counter-examples) a president is expected to be above the fray of party politics. If picking a sitting minister is a serious possibility, then it's clearly not a consideration in Germany.

And I have no idea why the SPD or Grünen would contribute to electing a CDU partisan.

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:38:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (4.00 / 3)

In most countries (I'm open to counter-examples) a president is expected to be above the fray of party politics. If picking a sitting minister is a serious possibility, then it's clearly not a consideration in Germany

We would expect them to switch to presidential mode the moment they are elected. If they don't manage that, we could try to force them to resign. By the way, all our presidents with only one exception were catastrophes.

And I have no idea why the SPD or Grünen would contribute to electing a CDU partisan

Because they can't dream of a majority without Die Linke. And a coalition with Die Linke is impossible because all members of that party are dirty and stink, and are stalinists, and eat babies for breakfast. So, Greens OR SPD can form a coalition with the CDU but not with each other.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:46:28 AM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (4.00 / 2)

By the way, all our presidents with only one exception were catastrophes.

That would be Heinemann?

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:50:06 AM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

Sure.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 11:06:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 1)

What about Richard von Weizsäcker?

Wind power

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 11:33:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (4.00 / 4)

Weizsäcker is a typical representative of his generation that never knew anything, for instance what his regiment did in Russia. He didn't know. Later he didn't know that the US made Agent Orange from the chemicals he sold them.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 12:21:13 PM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

Like his father, Nazi, Reich Foreign Secretary before becoming ambassador to the Vatican, who said at his trial he didn't know Jews were being killed at Auschwitz. Richard von W, then a law student, was assistant counsel to his father at that trial.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 01:00:49 PM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (4.00 / 2)

Well, I don't blame anyone for what their parents did, and I don't blame defence counsels for doing their job.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 01:24:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

Except that Richard von W was defending his own father and associating with him in the supposed ignorance of what happened to Jews deported to the East.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 01:29:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (4.00 / 2)

He was a law student and defending his own father. Nothing wrong with that. He associated with his father in regard to the father's guilt. Well, it was his father. This did not make the son guilty (though probably naïve). I blame Richard v.W. for his intentional amnesia concerning his own role in the holocaust and the cruelties against Russians.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 01:54:16 PM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

Well, I see it as also associated with his father's amnesia. Not that it changes the case.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 01:57:25 PM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

Don't you see a difference between not wishing to believe in the guilt of a loved one and shirking responsibility for own deeds?

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 02:39:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 1)

I can understand the difference, but in this case I suggest there might be a link.

On the other hand, I have no idea if the amnesia of both father and son was a deliberate ploy, or a shared state of denial.

When I say it makes no difference to the case, I meant the case whether Richard von W should be president again. He shouldn't (quite apart from his advanced age).

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 02:49:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If it's all about party politics (4.00 / 2)

"In most countries (I'm open to counter-examples) a president is expected to be above the fray of party politics. "

In most countries a president is picked put of a number of party politicians with a long political career. It is true that the politician is then supposed to be able to rise about party politics.

"If picking a sitting minister is a serious possibility, then it's clearly not a consideration in Germany."

Mostly partisan alingment and fitness to act as above parties are both taken into consideration. Scheel did go directly from minister to president, Weizsäcker from state prime minister to president. Others like Rau had some time without office, but that is not considered as necessary.

"And I have no idea why the SPD or Grünen would contribute to electing a CDU partisan."

Because they have no majority of their own in the assembly electing the president.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:48:36 AM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 0)

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:18:27 AM EST
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Re: If it's all about party politics (none / 1)

Schäuble or von der Leyen can do much less damage as president than as ministers.

by Katrin on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:18:55 AM EST
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And (none / 0)

at least von der Leyen can still dream of make it to chancellor.

by IM on Fri Feb 17th, 2012 at 10:26:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: And (none / 0)