Why do the British prefer cheap food to rich farmers?

by Gary J
Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 11:39:24 AM EST

The reason why the British do not like the CAP, whatever benefits it may bring to the 2% or so of the UK population involved in farming, has deep roots in British history.
Political power was once concentrated in the land owning aristocracy. Together with their relatives and dependents in the House of Commons, the peers normally made sure their interests were well protected.
The Napoleonic Wars were a boom time for the British nobility. The war guaranteed high grain prices. The rents the aristocrats could extract from their tenant farmers were correspondingly high.
The poor, who paid the high prices for bread, had no political power. Parliament, dominated by the aristocracy and the gentry, saw no need to intervene.
After the war, with a depression reducing bread prices, landowners were in trouble. They used their political power to pass the Corn Law.  This placed a floor on prices. The nobility benefited but the general public were forced to pay more than the market price.
Continued after the fold.


The decade after 1815 was an uneasy time in Britain. Tory governments responded to popular agitation for reform by coercive measures.
By 1830 the Whigs returned to power for the first time in decades. The Whigs themselves were a close knit group of very wealthy landowners but they had a traditional if uneasy alliance with urban middle class Radicals.
The Whig government embarked on a great struggle for Parliamentary reform. This resulted in the Great Reform Act of 1832. The middle classes were enfranchised and the first systematic redistribution of Parliamentary seats in British history (apart from some abortive experiments by Cromwell in the 17th century) eliminated the worst abuses of the ancien regime.
 The reformed political system was more responsive to the general public and urban interests than the old system had been.
By the 1840's the agitation of the Anti Corn Law League and a growing belief in Free Trade, had major effects on politics. The Conservative Prime Minister, Sir Robert Peel, became convinced that it was right to repeal the Corn Law, despite the opposition of most of his own supporters. The Prime Minister was able to carry repeal but at the cost of breaking up his own party.
The Whigs and Radicals had come to be referred to as Liberals. The followers of Peel, almost everyone in the Tory ranks who had experience of government, came to be called Liberal Conservatives.
Eventually, after Peel's death, the remaining Peelite Liberal Conservatives, joined with the Whigs and Radicals, to formally establish the Liberal Party. W.E. Gladstone, in effect Peel's political heir, came to play a leading role in the new party for the second half of the 19th century.
One of the major tenets of Liberalism was support for Free Trade. During the 1850's the protectionist forces in the Conservative Party lost out. Free Trade became Victorian political orthodoxy.
The popular appeal of cheap food was increased by the gradual decline in the power and wealth of the landowners as the 19th and 20th centuries progressed. Technological changes, with improved ships and the introduction of refrigeration, made it cheaper to import food than to grow it at home. The political importance of agricultural interests continued to decline.
In the early 20th Century a new Tariff Reform controversy broke out in the ranks of the Conservatives and their Liberal Unionist allies. The Tory leader of the day, A.J. Balfour, was not a protectionist by conviction. However he did not want to split his party as badly as Peel had done, so he compromised. Tory free traders were silenced or driven out of the party. Winston Churchill was the most notable example of the latter group.
In 1923 Stanley Baldwin called an election seeking a mandate to introduce Tariff Reform. The Liberal Party reunited for its last great campaign in defence of free trade. The threat of more expensive food played a major part in the campaign. The Conservatives lost the 1923 election and free trade continued until the Great Depression struck.
In 1932 the Conservative dominated National Coalition government entered into the Ottawa Accords, which marked the end of Free Trade as British national policy. The Liberal ministers in the government resigned in protest.
It was no accident that it was also the National government which began to introduce programs to subsidise farmers.
Despite the change in official policy the general public continued to prefer cheap, imported food (mostly from the British Empire) to more highly subsidised domestic production.
When it was proposed that the UK join the European Economic Community, I do not believe that any prominent British leader regarded the CAP as a good thing. The pro-Europeans were prepared to tolerate it, as part of the price of joining, but were always anxious to promote reforms. The anti-Europeans always regarded the CAP and dearer food, as one of the strongest arguments against joining.
The position today remains unchanged and arguments that British farmers get more benefit from the CAP than French ones will have no impact on the urban dominated British public and political class. The bottom line is we want the cheapest possible food and we do not care who supplies it to us.
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The harm done to poor countries by the CAP well outweighs any benefit to European farmers.  The CAP should be dismantled entirely, and Europe should import food from Africa rather than leaving it dependent on "aid".
by tyronen on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 12:57:08 PM EST
Britain (especially England) is also one of the most densely populated countries in Europe. or other countries in Europe it makes sense to subsidize agriculture in order to 1) avoid further depopulation of rural areas; 2) maintain a strategic ability to produce food domstically; 3) prevent rural land from being developed for industrial or residential uses.

The question is how these domestic policy objectives can be pursued (by those countries who choose to) without distorting the international market price of food.

In the long term we simply cannot afford to fly food around the world.

The UK never attempted land reform and instead went the route of international trade (first colonial, then "free").

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 01:22:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Just where do you think CAP money goes?  Subsidized European produce is exported to poor countries and drives farmers there out of business.

The average cow in Europe receives more subsidies than the entire per capita income of most poor countries.  There is no way they can compete.

"In the long term we simply cannot afford" to grow sugar from sugar beet when sugar cane has a much higher yield.

by tyronen on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 01:37:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This is just an argument against free trade in agriculture. In particular, against forcing poor countries to open their markets to first-world produce as a precondition to getting help from the IMF or World Bank.

As for subsidizing cows... Long-life (UHT) milk is nasty, and pasteurized milk only lasts 3 or 4 days before spoiling. Dairy farmers more than 3 or 4 days away by boat from Europe should not be affected by the subsidies, except if subsidized UHT milk from Europe floods the local milk market in a poor country, which would be solved by allowing the poor countries to erect protectionistic barriers...

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 01:44:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
tyronen, as was covered several times at ET, Europe imports a lot from Africa (under preferential treatment treaties!), and destroying the CAP wouldn't help the Africans a bit - it would help industrial producers (who are usually big landlords) in countries like Argentine, Brazil and Australia.

Most of what you can read in the Anglo-Saxon press on the CAP is spin.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 02:17:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Please stop using that phrase.  There is a world of difference, culturally and politically, between the UK, the US, Canada, Australia, Ireland, and New Zealand.

It's not even historically accurate - Britons today are as much descended from the Norman-French as from the Angles and Saxons of medieval times.

To me it is every bit as offensive as "frog" would be to a French person.

by tyronen on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 01:39:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
43,000 google hits in English for "Anglo-Saxon model". Top 10 hits:

  • The Anglo-Saxon model of capitalism - The Adam Smith Institute
  • When we look over the attributes of the Anglo-Saxon model of capitalism...
  • Detestation of the ultraliberal Anglo-Saxon model is thought largely to explain...
  • If the Anglo-Saxon model today appears to be doing very well on a world scale...
  • Value Based Management Forum: Dutch study confirms Anglo-Saxon Anglo-Saxon model is best for economy
  • Anglo-Saxon model offers better jobs and incomes deal
  • THE ANGLO-SAXON VERSUS THE CONTINENTAL EUROPEAN CORPORATE ...
  • Is the American Model Miss World? Choosing between the Anglo-Saxon model and a European-style alternative.
  • Anglo-Saxon model
  • The anglo-saxon model: a critical view


By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 01:56:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Google hits do not make the term any more accurate.

There is no "Anglo-Saxon model".  You can speak of an "American model" or a "British model", but the two are very different.  The UK has universal public health care, reasonable public transportation, and paid parental leave, none of which exist in the US.  In fact, the UK is much closer to continental Europe than it is to the US.

by tyronen on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 02:18:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The term does exist, and it is used by the English language press in exactly the way DoDo did.

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 05:11:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yup, and we've said that repeatedly around here as well: the Anglo-Saxon model is the bullshit free-trade model pushed by the rhetoric in the US and Britain and by the English-language business press. It's all nonsense: neither country actually implements free-trade at all. The phrase is a bit silly, but we sure as hell didn't originate it - complain to the FT if you like.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Dec 9th, 2005 at 03:09:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And 1,780,000 hits for "Anglo Saxon Press" which is the term DoDo used.

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 01:59:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Indeed. I could have said "the English-language press of English-speaking countries", but the shorter term already exists and is in use throughout the world.

(And if tyronen wants to do genetics, let's not forget the Brit-Celtic, Roman and early Viking lineages assimilated by the Angles, Friesians and Saxons; and of course much more Saxon genes are around in Germany.)

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Fri Dec 9th, 2005 at 04:55:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
To me [using Anglo-Saxon to refer to former British Colonies] is every bit as offensive as "frog" would be to a French person.
Are you saying "Gaul" is as offensive as "frog" when referring to the French? Get a grip.

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Dec 9th, 2005 at 05:45:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Excuse me, could you please stop including Ireland in your reading of the phrase Anglo-Saxon? It's very offensive.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Dec 9th, 2005 at 06:23:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The World Bank recently brought out a study, Agricultural Trade Reform and the Doha Agenda (big pdf). The WB can hardly be suspected of sympathy for agricultural support systems. In fact, this study was brought out to argue for free trade in agricultural goods and other goods and services, in time for the ministerial talks in Hong Kong.

Yet the report says this (p 17):

Poverty could be reduced under Doha.
Under the full merchandise trade liberalization
scenario, extreme poverty--those earning no more than $1 a day--would drop by 32 million in developing countries in 2015 relative to the baseline level of 622 million, a reduction of 5 percent. The majority of the poor by 2015 are projected to be in Sub-Saharan Africa, where the reduction would be 6 percent.

Note: the full merchandise trade liberalization scenario. This means total dismantling of all agricultural tariffs, aids, export subsidies plus total free trade in other merchandise and some services. It would, according to the WB, only reduce Sub-Saharan African poverty by a small percentage.

(p 19) If only agriculture was reformed (Doha scenario 1), there would be much less poverty
alleviation globally and none at all in Sub-Saharan Africa. This shows the importance for poverty of including manufactured products in the Doha negotiations.

Total free trade in agricultural goods will not alleviate poverty in Sub-Saharan Africa. This is from the World Bank, in a report the main intent of which is to support the idea of free trade.

I'm not in favour of dumping agricultural surplusses on the world market. I'm all in favour of real, sustainable development for Africa. But the notion that all we have to do is dismantle rich countries' agricultural support systems (I'm assuming you included that of the US too, when you said "dismantle the CAP"), for Africa to produce all the food we need, is so over-simplified it's laughable. It takes no account of climatic differences (can Africa produce the same food we now produce?), or, as Migeru points out, of the externalities involved in shifting the huge tonnage of foodstuffs needed by Europe and North America around the world.

Above all, it doesn't take into account the fact that Africa is unfortunately not geared up at all to take advantage of agricultural free trade. It is countries like Brazil, Argentina, Thailand, India, and other Cairns Group countries that will.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 02:39:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Try telling those thirty-two million people it's ok if they stay in poverty because they're only a "small percentage".

The actual number (and percentage) is even greater because it is relative to the 2005 population, not the 2015.  If you want "small", try the percentage of the European (and American, and Japanese) that actually works in agriculture and compare it to the corresponding percentage in Africa.

The "Doha scenario 1" you cite refers to a one-third cut in subsidies - see the table at the bottom of page 14.  None of the eight Doha scenarios envisage the complete elimination of subsidies; that is an additional one outlined by the research team.

Did you miss the table on page 12 of the report?  It showed that 63 percent of gains to developing countries from trade liberalization are from agriculture.  Right below that, you can't miss it, it says flatly, "Agriculture is where cuts are needed most".

There seems to be an attitude here that CAP reform is some kind of right-wing plot by so-called "Anglo-Saxon" countries.  This is nonsense.  The US and Canada have resisted cutting subsidies every bit as much as the EU and Japan have.

On this issue, the EU is on the same side as the Bush administration - the wrong one.  Virtually all NGOs working in the Third World have called for subsidy reform - see Oxfam, for example.  The Trade Justice Movement calls for the EU to abolish export subsidies.  So have African governments - see this article.  The Guardian, the UK's only liberal broadsheet, maintains a blog on the subject.

As to the myth that subsidized exports from the EU benefit food-importing countries, see Devinder Sharma's rebuttal here.

by tyronen on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 02:12:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm sorry if I appeared insensitive in speaking of a "small percentage". My point was simply to show that the gains from sweeping free trade reform were far slighter -- for those the most in need -- than some rhetoric on the subject implies. Your own comment at the top of the thread, to which I was replying, was extremely sweeping and simplistic, and most certainly implied that the total dismantling of the CAP would solve a great many of Africa's problems. May I ask you if you really believe that liberalization is the way to bring about progress for the poor in Africa and other continents? You really think free trade is the answer?

On the World Bank report: I don't want to be tedious, but there are a couple of things I'd like to rectify or nuance in what you say.

  • The "32 million" you quote are in all developing countries, not just Sub-Saharan Africa. Quote: "The majority of the poor by 2015 are projected to be in Sub-Saharan Africa, where the reduction [in poverty] would be 6 percent".

  • The "Doha scenario 1" implies elimination of agricultural export subsidies plus (for the CAP) a reduction of 18% in domestic farm and industry aid (already programmed) plus "the applied global average tariff on agricultural products is cut by roughly one-third, with larger cuts in developing economies, smaller in developing economies, and zero in least developed countries". In other words, one-third is an average, but the EU would be required to lower its tariffs by considerably more.

  • The table on p12 speaks of all developing countries, not just the poorest. Your comment above spoke of Africa. There is a middling rank of emerging agricultural exporting countries that stands to gain from liberalization, as I pointed out above.

  • "Agriculture is where cuts are needed most" same comment. What was most important was where the report dealt with the poorest, not with a lumped-in "developing countries" category.

My main point, anyway, was to say that even the World Bank was not very affirmative about alleviating African poverty even in the most favourable to free trade of its scenarios.

I then have a job understanding what the rest of your remarks have to do with anything I said. If the remark

There seems to be an attitude here that CAP reform is some kind of right-wing plot by so-called "Anglo-Saxon" countries.

is meant to apply to me, I'm at a loss. People here have repeatedly said (and I'm among them) that we want to see CAP reform. I want to see phasing out of export subsidies and of subsidies to the agri-food industry, and capping of direct farm subsidies with redistribution in favour of small farms. I'm pretty sure most people who comment here would agree.

As for "there seems to be an attitude", permit me to say that, if there seems to be an attitude anywhere, it's in the hectoring tone of your comments. As for "Anglo-Saxon", it's a term I avoid because it's inexact, but trying to make out it's as pejorative as "Frog" seems to me to be stretching it more than a bit.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 04:42:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thanks for delivering this spot-on and measured reply to him/her. I didn't have the nerve yesterday to reply to this stuff that as you say has not much to do with anything we said, yet was delivered in such a hectoring tone.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.
by DoDo on Fri Dec 9th, 2005 at 04:49:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You give a good survey of the historical decline of the agricultural interest in British society and politics (though I'd have wanted to start with the Enclosures and the uprooting of the small peasantry which moved to industrial jobs in the towns). In my view, that's the main reason (ie diminished importance of the agri interest)for Britain's lack of enthusiasm for the CAP.

I'm a bit less convinced by what you say about dearer and cheaper food. For example:

The anti-Europeans always regarded the CAP and dearer food, as one of the strongest arguments against joining

What dearer food exactly? Did food prices jump sharply in Britain between 1973 (date of entry) and say, '75 or '76 (stripping out oil shock-induced inflation)? (I admit I have no data on this, but don't recall anything from my own experience of that time). Don't forget that Britain negotiated, on entry, the right to go on importing foodstuffs from Commonwealth countries.

Another point is that, since the 1950s, the proportion of household budgets spent on food has been greatly reduced. Of course, it's relative, because incomes have risen -- but food prices have also fallen, and agricultural prices go on falling. You may fairly argue that, if Britain had been free to choose whatever it wanted on world markets, food would have been cheaper still. But Britain had argued the Commonwealth preference at the time of entry, saying it had a historical duty and a long-standing moral contract with suppliers like New Zealand -- would that have been thrown overboard to buy stuff from Brazil? Are the British quite as obsessed with cheap food as you say?

I'm quite sure you're right that Britain (England in particular) is urban-based and doesn't give much of a damn about rural matters. I'm not sure there's a flat-out consensus in favour of cheap food from anywhere, and never mind self-sufficiency or quality. A lot of people are willing to eat junk food, but junk food is not cheap (in terms of nutritive value). There are significant groups (middle class no doubt) who want organic, or traditional, or high-quality foodstuffs.

A query: how many British families, would you say, prefer cheaper New Zealand lamb to dearer British lamb?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 01:27:06 PM EST
I was thinking in political terms rather than economic ones. The question I was trying to answer was why the British did not like the CAP. I make no claims about whether that attitude is based on reality rather than false ideas or that it is a sensible basis for making public policy.

Thinking about the question led me to consider the historical factors I set out in this diary.

There is no doubt that rural, agricultural interests have less political influence in modern Britain than in most countries.

There is also no doubt that the British, on the whole, prefer cheap food. The success of supermarkets in squeezing producer profit margins is well known.

Of couese not everyone in Britain believes in cheap food at any cost.

As to political attitudes to the CAP, I cannot think of any British politician over the past 35 years who has publicly said the policy was a positively good one. They may have done so, but if they did I did not notice.

by Gary J on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 02:26:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It is a testament to the lasting political influence of the landed class that Britain never attempted land refrom, unlike most of continental Europe. Then again, more blood has been spilled over land reform than over any other issue (except possibly the death of Franz Ferdinand and the Nazi invasion of Poland), so maybe Britain was the smarter country after all.

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 02:41:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
There was some rural radicalism in 19th and 20th century Britain, mostly associated with the American Henry George and the unrelated David Lloyd George before and after he was Prime Minister. As leader of a coalition government, mostly supported by Conservatives, Lloyd George kept quiet about his land reform ideas when he was in power.

The Glee Club, which holds a song event at Liberal Democrat conferences, still sings the Land Song. This is very radical indeed revolutionary in outlook. I can only say I am politicaly uneasy about its sentiments.

I have found a comment by someone called Robert Clancy, taken from the Kenry George News of September 1957.

"In its hey-day the Liberal party saw Cobden and Bright bring free trade to England. John Stuart Mill was one of its spokesmen. And in the days of Gladstone, when Henry George visited England, it is said that his land reform ideas were in almost daily discussion in Parliament.

A little later and land value taxation was a national issue. In the memorable year 1909 there was Liberal government with as brilliant a constellation of stars as was ever assembled -- Lord Asquith, Campbell-Bannerman, Lloyd George, Winston Churchill, James Bryce, John Morley, Edward Grey and a host of others. Across the country they campaigned for a national land valuation and sang the Land Song".

Alas! A series of calamities doomed the effort. The implacable opposition of vested interests, the exigencies of politics and coalitions, a disastrous world war, the rising tide of socialism -- all left the Liberal party and its issues on the sidelines by the 1920's".

by Gary J on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 08:35:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I have found the lyrics of The Land Song.

The Land
(Marching Thro' Georgia)

Sound the call for freedom boys, and sound it far and wide,
March along to victory for God is on our side,
While the voice of Nature thunders o'er the rising tide,
'God gave the land to the people!'

Chorus:
The land, the land, 'twas God who made the land,
The land, the land, the ground on which we stand,
Why should we be beggars with the ballot in our hand?
God made the land for the people.

Hark the sound is spreading from the East and from the West,
Why should we work hard and let the landlords take the best?
Make them pay their taxes on the land just like the rest,
The land was meant for the people

Chorus

Clear the way for liberty, the land must all be free,
Liberals will not falter from the fight, tho' stern it be,
'Til the flag we love so well will fly from sea to sea
O'er the land that is free for the people

Chorus

The army now is marching on, the battle to begin.
The standard now is raised on high to face the battle din,
We'll never cease from fighting 'til victory we win,
And the land is free for the people

Chorus

by Gary J on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 08:43:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, I understood you were talking more about perceptions than underlying facts. I'm just not sure the general British outlook is any more favourable to cheap food than anyone else's. (No one likes paying through the nose ;))

For example, it's ironic that France, pro-CAP par excellence, is a country which has seen massive super and hypermarket development since the 1970s, to a point where large distribution centres are probably more important than in the UK...

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 02:46:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
i doubt that the money europeans pay africa for food goes where it should, if united fruit and dole's actions in s. america are any guide.

with the internet many of the disparities between city and country will equalise; many would prefer to live in the country, but are still caged in cubicles.

many country people would like their children to study some in cities, so as to have a more balanced education, returning to ponder lofty concepts in their lofty minds as they till and plow.

cities will always be net energy-consumers (and information producers), and when oil becomes properly valued, the country's immediate energy-providing capacity (food, biomass, solar and wind exposure) will return to the obvious visibility it had before the industrial revolution and cheap travel obscured our vision of common cause and effect.

the future equivalent of CAP will be the payments from city to country for the stuff of life...vittles.

as the cities gradually empty out, the gardens, sproutfarms etc will move in to take the place of the unsanitary, overcrowded confusion of today.

cities' populations will return to those sustainable without preposterously cheap fuel.

paying for it in blood and civil liberties compounds the problem and furthers no immediate benefit or solution, except for the offence industries and the parasitic mass media.

"Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do." Jim Hightower

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 08:28:19 PM EST
are going nuts (heh) for organic food; they can't grow enough of it, its rise has been phenomenal there.

ta, charlie!


"Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do." Jim Hightower

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Wed Dec 7th, 2005 at 08:32:05 PM EST
It will be interesting to see what effect the expected climate change will have on European agricultural policy. Changes to the Gulf Stream may make the UK much more Wintery. This happened before during the "little ice age" about four hundred years ago.

Energy policy can be expected to need a change as well. Just another example of how seeking short-term political gain works against sustainable solutions.
 

Policies not Politics
---- Daily Landscape

by rdf (robert.feinman@gmail.com) on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 11:26:02 AM EST
TIf the climate get cooler Europe might have to resort to using more greenhouses. Interestingly, in Spanish those are called invernaderos or "winter houses".

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Dec 8th, 2005 at 11:47:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Wintergarden in German, jardin d'hiver in French, giardino d'inverno in Italian
by Hansvon on Fri Dec 9th, 2005 at 03:16:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]


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