European Tribune - Community, Politics & Progress.

New Mock Layout for ET

by Colman
Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 05:11:26 PM EST

For discussion ...

The theory is that the RSS boxes are drawn from various bits of our affiliated blogs - a top ten headlines from all of them, a random box that highlights, well, random ones and a user selected set of feeds, with the default set to something sensible.

I hate that space beside the logo. What could we put there? Links to the headline below maybe?

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New Mock Layout for ET | 50 comments (50 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

Inside stories we'd lose the first column of RSS feeds, so that you'd have lots of space for comments and wider graphs and things.

The second column would stay on pages like "recent comments" and so on.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 05:17:40 PM EST

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 1)

Why not put the RSS feeds on the right side, or outside the other boxes?

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 06:06:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (4.00 / 2)

That's my question too.

From a 'sales' perspective don't we want people to hang around here?

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 06:10:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

To the first, because I want to keep a consistent right hand side across the site with the diaries and some basic links. Basic navigation is then on the top and on the right and it never changes.

I don't understand the "outside" bit.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 06:36:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (4.00 / 2)

I mean on the right of both the Navigation box on top and the second column of boxes, so that the "ET stuff" would look like a closed whole and the RSS stuff is 'outside'. I feel the commercial column at dKos is 'pushed into my face' by placing it to the left of the other column.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 08:26:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

For the space (4.00 / 8)

Put the European Salon there. Since it aims to be open all day, it should not be shunted down page by subsequent front-page articles.

by det on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 05:23:25 PM EST

Re: For the space (4.00 / 2)

That's not a bad idea.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 05:24:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Another idea (4.00 / 5)

would be to have a welcome message of sorts:

"European Tribune is a community information magazine and welcomes input from everybody. You are free to post your own stories and to comment on stories by others. We write a lot about energy and European politics (usually, but not always, from a left-of-center point of view) but we enjoy all sorts of topics and all are welcome, so jump in!. For more, read < here >"

or something like this.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 05:38:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Another idea (none / 1)

Or we could use it as a sort of internal banner ad and swap several things through there ...

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 05:41:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Another idea (none / 0)

That I think is an excellent idea. I was just going to suggest something like it myself.

by A swedish kind of death on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 06:33:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Another idea (none / 0)

Why de no tput the definition we worked out with COlman about our general ideology....maybe with a link...

Plus I think that putting a Salon iamge and link will also be a good idea!!

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 08:03:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Alla dat (none / 1)

Three square boxes ... the start of the statement of definition, as a link to the full definition ... the Salon image ... and a teaser on the most recent salon, as a link to the full entry.

Utsukushii kereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 01:19:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: For the space (none / 0)

Good idea, and one that could be implemented "annoying space" or not...

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 05:37:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

For that space, some artwork would be nice (if some here have the inspiration, talent and taste to make it), something like the European cityscapes/landscapes over at A Fistful Of Euros, but in a way that the right end of it is hidden under the columns if the screen is small?

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 06:04:23 PM EST

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

I'm not sure nice artwork does much to draw people in. There are too many blogs with a swish arty header and poorly-presented text beneath. Prominent, clearly-presented writing will get people's attention faster than artwork, imo.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 05:51:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

Better if you do the artwork to link to the Salon. This would be both full of content and attrative..

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 08:04:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 1)

You must be tele-influencing my thoughts across the Pyrenees. I was wondering about a permanent arty Salon header...

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 10:11:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

I would strongly suppor it.... :)

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 10:54:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 1)

I agree. A clean, sharp layout with prominent, interesting content will draw more people -- at least, more of the sort of people we'd like to stay. If the goal were merely to increase traffic then we'd best become something else and attract a more... numerous spectrum of persons.

Words and ideas I offer here may be used freely and without attribution.

by technopolitical on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 03:08:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

I took a while to get used to, but now I kind of like having some of the boxes on the right under the logo. Is there a particular reason you want to move all the boxes to the left side?

Will "Menu" and "Hotlist" be removed?

And I think the rss-boxes should be outside the eruotrib-boxes.

by A swedish kind of death on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 06:40:26 PM EST

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

"outside" as in "to the right of". I see you already answered that one...

by A swedish kind of death on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 06:49:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (4.00 / 2)

I still think the RSS feeds would be better off at the left. Four reasons:

You get less information at the top of each diary, because of the Annoying Space.
From a graphic design POV, it makes the main content look like it's huddled up against the left margin. It also means that bilingual diaries have two big and two small columns next to each other, which isn't very easy on the eye.
There are two adjacent lists to navigate, and they're out of sync. Single linear lists are much easier to read through and navigate than paired but unrelated lists.
Balancing the links across both sides also solves the I Hate This Space problem, because it's not hanging around being annoying any more.

Photoshop says:

Example 1

Example 2

(I haven't stretched the top right in Ex 2 so the top isn't aligned, but it shows more or less what the 2 column option looks like.)

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 07:33:40 PM EST

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

Note that I Hate This Place re-appears when you enter a diary and the RSS feed column disappears (to make way for long comment threads).

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 08:32:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

Regarding 2 and 3, what are your comments about dKos's current design?

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat Jan 20th, 2007 at 08:33:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 1)

I use adblocks, so all I see of dKos is the central diary and the right hand diary list. The ad list disappears, which is a good thing, because when it's there it annoys me no end.

I don't much like the unstretched centre-justified design, because it wastes a lot of space.

But that's more a problem with the narrow dKos version than with a centre justified design in general.

Centre justification otherwise is fine. It's where your eyes naturally spend most of their time when you're looking at a monitor, which is another reason I think it makes sense to put the bulk of the information there.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 11:59:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (4.00 / 4)

My concern re the "front" page is that it's the home page and particularly the welcome page by which newcomers and undecided lurkers are likely to arrive at the site. We want them to be drawn in and to get the hang of the place asap. If you're not a habitué of DKos or another Scoop site, (and we're out to reach towards Europeans who may well not be, and also for whom English is non-native), it's not obvious how the place works. Nor what is even meant by "recommended diaries". Along these lines, I think help and information need a more prominent place than in the current lay-out or this mock-up.

Since Scoop offers a basic screen to the non-logged-in (as soon as you log in you get your user menu), could that basic screen be better tweaked towards drawing newcomers in? Example, have a big New User heading with links to a good guide? And/or have mouse-over info bubbles? Other suggestions, anyone?

As to the RSS feeds, I tend to agree with those who feel this mock-up centres them too much, while placing ET community stuff at the edge. The ET community should be the core, interacting with the affiliates. For the moment, I don't see the advantage of having the stories to the left and all the links (except top bar) to the right.

Following others, I'd say have the RSS feeds under the logo on the left, with the blogroll under them. Stories central, no more hateful space.

Another thought: scrap the logo and make a (slim) banner of it across the top with key navigation links appended beneath.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 06:36:11 AM EST

Drawing in newcomers (4.00 / 3)

Good ideas.

One should also consider that many newcomers will arrive directly in a diary, from a link at some other site. Getting those to not feel confused and lost in the structure is important.

Something that I found confusing was the name "diaries". I still fail to see the point of that name, unless one wants to have only diaries in the traditional sense, that is people writing about something that has happened to them recently.

I think "articles" is a word that better describes what we have here. "Article" to me includes the more personal stuff (which I love, do not get me wrong) while also being a much better description for stuff about energy, economics, politics, ideas and such.

Another thing that bounced me of DailyKos a number of times was that I did not get how to read more by the same author. I think I even at some point guessed right and clicked the name, but when I came to "user pages for YY:" I figured it was the wrong place. And then I got annoyed and went somewhere else. Maybe it could just say "YY:" instead of "user pages for YY:". Better yet, maybe there could be an automatic link at the bottom of diaries that goes to that users diaries, and the link would be called "More articles by same author".

And what is "Stories" by the way? It shows up in the user pages...

by A swedish kind of death on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 07:29:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 1)

Since Colman was asking about lay-out, I didn't get into the Scoop "newspaper" analogy by which the welcome or main page is called the front page, and what goes on it are front-page stories. User posts are called "diaries" which I have always found inappropriate. I don't think it helps anyone to understand what's going on, and I think we could see if we shouldn't change the terminology (if Scoop permits?).

"Articles" is clearer, though we're still in the newspaper business there. I don't see why we should ape the press, even by this kind of distant and loose language. We should do some brainstorming around this.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 07:54:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (4.00 / 2)

I completely agree.. I do not like diaries at all.

I prefer articles much more....

But we could certianly try to find a better term.
Brainstroming...

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 08:06:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Brainstorming (4.00 / 2)

I have a limited vocubulary in english, but here we go:

posts

texts

stories

contributions

by A swedish kind of death on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 09:36:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Brainstorming (none / 1)

I like contributions....yes indeed...

I would not have any problem with contribution, discussion or articles.

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 10:52:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 0)

I think "diary" is intended to refer to a user's "personal blog", that is, to the collection of all the "diary entries" which we actually call "diaries". If you go to a user's pages and click on the "diary" tab, you see a personal blog. I myself use the link to /user/migeru/diary as my "blog address" or "homepage" when I post comments on other blogs of the MovableType variety.

"Stories" are supposed to be articles for the front-page, going through a user-moderation queue [I suggest reading the description of scoop in wikipedia]. We have inherited from DKos a particular "two-tier" philosophy in which users cannot write "Stories", but front-pagers' stories do not have to go through moderation.

It seems that the possible configurations are quite varied, and originally (for kuro5hin, I guess) the distinction between the 'community magazine' and the 'user blogs' was sharper.

"It's the statue, man, The Statue."

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 09:49:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 0)

I was also confused by the term "diaries": it made me overlook the main content of dKos for a time, a couple of elections ago. I suggest that we first decide whether to replace it (my vote: Yes!), and then choose a replacement. I would prefer any one of several suggestions above.

----------
di·a·ry

a daily record, usually private, esp. of the writer's own experiences, observations, feelings, attitudes, etc.
a book for keeping such a record.
a book or pad containing pages marked and arranged in calendar order, in which to note appointments and the like.

----------

...So how did the term "diary" get applied to what clearly aren't diaries, or even diary entries?

Words and ideas I offer here may be used freely and without attribution.

by technopolitical on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 03:02:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 0)

Because originally (on kuro5hin) users could write both stories and diary entries. DKos configured scoop in such a way that ordinary users could only write diary entries, but they end up being the most important content. So, the name is unappropriate because the current configuration has changed with respect to the original design, for which the name was appropiate.

Personally, starting with the ET configuration, I would abolish merge diaries and stories into a single category (call it 'article' for argument's sake), and I would make the front page list the top-10 recommended articles list instead of top-10 recent stories.

There would still be a need for a separate category of content, the Open Thread, whose RSS feed and most recent instance would appear in the "hated space".

"It's the statue, man, The Statue."

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 06:17:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (4.00 / 4)

For me, whatever the configuration, diary is a poorly-chosen term because it is not immediately clear to a neophyte what it refers to (and a non-native English-speaker will get no help from a dictionary). So I'm for looking for a different name.

Scoop certainly provides for the rec list being automatically the content of the "front page". It also then provides for a fuller rating system for "diaries", including negative ratings. Even if the rating system were kept binary (recommend/do nothing) as now, your suggestion would change the way we look at diaries and recommend them. It would incite diarists to write "for the front page", and raters to think principally of that when rating. It would introduce a much greater notion of competition, and, imo, would do nothing for feelings of harmony and cooperation here. Neither is it obvious that it would provide a better front page than the current system, where an editorial choice is made of rec'd diaries that seem appropriate to the page that is, in a sense, the outer face of ET. Take the rec list I see now, for instance: three out of ten are unlikely front-page articles (however good they may be), the mock layout for ET (internal business), the Easter Barcelona meet (internal business), and Nonpartisan's excellent and gratefully-received image links (useful info for bloggers). Of the remaining seven, one (techno's) is on the front page, I've just put up Sven's hooch-from-trees piece, and possibly another will go over too. A point in favour of moderation is also that the rec list doesn't automatically reflect the quality of discussion threads (it may do so marginally, but recs are generally given on the basis of the diary itself, and early in its life).

Your solution for the Open Thread forgets the Salon, and also the fact that at least a day back, both of these continue to attract comments and should be visible. I see them in HTML which allows us to punctuate the front page with attractive graphics, rather than an RSS feed.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 04:21:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 0)

What do you way of allowing all users to write diaries and stories? I don't think any of the three recommended diaries which you rightly say are not FP material would have been written as stories. I don't intend to see the Barcelona meetup on the front page, but some of the other "serious" articles I write fall in a different category. Apparently the original scoop configuration included a "moderation queue" for stories, the best of which then made it to the front page.

So, it might be worth considering making the "diary" section more explicitly a "user blogs" section by a change of name, and re-introducing the story moderation queue.

Scoop was originally developed for use on Kuro5hin and was designed to allow user submissions of content much like Slash, another somewhat similar CMS. But where Slash and its flagship site, Slashdot, relied on a small group of editors to decide what content was actually published, Kuro5hin and Scoop aimed to allow moderation by the users themselves. Scoop's solution was to introduce a "moderation queue" where submitted stories would be visible to registered users, and where users could vote on whether a story should be published; a story which garners enough positive votes to cross a (configurable) "posting threshold" will become publicly visible, and a story which collects too many negative votes will be deleted.
...
While one of Scoop's main strengths is its innovative story- and comment-moderation system, a host of other features are available. For users, Scoop offers a number of conveniences:
* Individual weblogs or "diaries" which bypass story moderation and post to a separate section of the site.

I consider the Salon an Open Thread, neither diary nor story. And you're right the ability to be creative in the Open thread/Salon header is a plus. But maybe the front page could just display the last two Open Threads (one Salon and one Evening open thread, in either order) and 8 front-page stories.

"It's the statue, man, The Statue."

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 04:34:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 1)

Well, I don't think the way Scoop was organised at first for Kuro5hin is really a criterion. That type of organisation (to speak to the substance) would add complexity and more stuff on screen for not much discernible advantage. Apart from tech/internal community questions and maybe personal requests for info etc, why would members write to the diaries list rather than to the stories?

Of course, you may disagree with me that the front page presents the outer face of ET to newcomers and those who are checking the place out one way or another, but I think that's its main function, and I think that function is better served by an editorial group rather than by automatic posting from a rec list. My objection, also, on the grounds of an increase in competitive spirit in the community, still appears important to me.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 11:41:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 0)

Also, there has to be a way for diaries to be promoteable to debates. The Mock layout (internal business) could be there, and we have regular requests for "can this diary be moved to the debate box?" which can't happen because only stories, can become debates.

"It's the statue, man, The Statue."

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 04:36:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (none / 1)

That we can fix when we have control of the code, which should be soon now.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 04:41:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (4.00 / 4)

I'm not enamoured of the user-voted front-page. I've never seen one I didn't hate. I think an editorial board has a useful function of providing shape to the site, but that's a philosophical difference between us.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 04:44:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Drawing in newcomers (4.00 / 2)

Can I just repeat my suggestion that if the editorial role becomes (at any point) contentious, that any editors are prohibited from posting direct to the frontpage.

Ya know, I enjoy watching Jerome's posts fight (and usually win) their way to the top of the recommended diaries list.

But I do understand there is sometimes a need to post direct (for e.g. Jerome as the site is his until the UberDoop .eu ET LLP gets writ)...so I'm in agreement with editorial boards...but would shackle them slightly by not letting them post direct (though they can post diaries and via recommends become promoted by their friends through a simple nepotistic system I am hoping to take advantage of for free rail travel through Eur....did I type that out loud?)

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 08:10:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

How about a new approach to newcomers and infrequent visitors? One that will lure them in and then seduce them to become ET-junkies, of course! Let's call it the 'gate way' face of ET ;)

I'm thinking something like an 'ET-weekly' approach. A process that would allow especially good 'articles' from the week prior exposure to new users. My first thought is a new editorial process of sorts, a second 'recommend diary' button to support the promotion of the article to 'ET-weekly' exposure. This button would be a responsibility of the users (trusted users?), to steer content to this hypothetical audience. For example, this particular diary, though important to the ET community, would probably not be a good candidate for the 'weekly' since it is perhaps not of extreme interest to a newcomer. One would ask users to think not about "what is important to you?", but "what do you think would be good to show off to a newcomer?" It also allows for a category of "infrequent reader" who can interact with the cream of ET that has deliciously floated to the top during the past week.

This would work very well with if we make Scoop display for each user a page with "responses to your comments" and some organisation by whether that user has read the response or responded to it, as suggested by MillMan in the "Random site redesign thoughts" diary.

by someone (s0me1smail(a)gmail(d)com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 08:45:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

Let's take a serious look ar what we want the front page to achieve, and once we have figured that one out we can look at other "views" like the diary list, the single-diary view, the user's diary page, etc.

To be clear, the front page displays the top 10 (is this configurable?) "stories", or "promoted" user "diary entries", but diary entry promotion does not turn it into a story (as only stories can go into the debate box, and promoted diaries can not).

I suppose someone should take a look at the scoop "class hierarchy" and try to explain it for the layman ET user so that it can be tweaked. As I say upthread, we have inherite a particular tweaked version of the (allegedly very configurable) scoop hierarchy, used by Kos for DKos.

"It's the statue, man, The Statue."

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 09:58:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

I should think the number of front page posts is easily configurable (trade-off between depth of choice and speed of page loading), as would be the potential passage of "diaries" into the debate box.

BTW, I think the grandaddy is MyDD, not DKos.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 04:37:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

YOu're right, MyDD looks a lot like ET.

"It's the statue, man, The Statue."

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 04:43:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 1)

'I hate this space' is there because of the logo, and the logo must be present, right ? Would it then be acceptable to have to logo as a transparent background of some space in the head of the page ?
Is it technically possible to have a different layout for logged vs for anonymous users ? It is kind of tiresome to always watch the same 'newbie' stuff. I believe that if the browser sends the login cookie, a regular user would reach directly the members-only layout.

by balbuz on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 11:30:46 AM EST

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

Is something broken that needs fixing here? Or is this just a desire to rearrange the furniture?

Personally, I like the way it is now. Though if you really want to add the RSS feeds, don't make them front and center. People come here to read the writing and participate in the debates here, not to see what's going on on other blogs.

Me? I'd keep the current user tools column-main blog column-diaries column FP format we have now (and replicate it in the diary screens too) and put the RSS doodads under the user tools boxes.

But that's just me. A symmmetry freak.

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 04:01:14 PM EST

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 1)

A point I clearly didn't make clearly is that the RSS feeds are not, necessarily, for other blogs. They might be related to other bits of ET - Sven's suggestion for a multimedia feed for instance, other language sections or subblogs, or perhaps some collaborative writing projects. Which means I should probably detail how I imagine that sort of thing working ...

Almost anything can produce an RSS feed .. our wiki produces several for instance.

And is a Spanish language "section" of ET a separate blog or not?

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 04:23:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 0)

In the forum software I'm working with now, everything does produce a feed which is then user configurable - ie you choose, and can constantly edit, which feeds you aggregate.

Colman - did you see the link I gave: http://www.dicole.fi/download/Dicole_Knowledge_Work_Environment-Product_Description.pdf ?

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sun Jan 21st, 2007 at 04:56:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: New Mock Layout for ET (none / 1)

I'm sure this is too late to be of any use, and it might be a software limitation, but I really like this layout. It appears more collaborative, effective integrates some convergence at the front and top, organizes topics more or less and so forth.

imho, the current and proposed layouts look very me-too with respect to kos, and also set up and potentially re-ineforce the same sort of weaknesses of kos (authoritarianism, top-down editorial approach, rigorous party-line enforcement via accreditation of views at the front page and so forth) which I know not to be the case here.

Content drives eyeballs, eyeballs drive influence (or ad $, depending on the model) and, well, the next question is who is the audience, which drive tone and content. In my view, you want a general, hopefully underserved audience, as broad as possible. Shoot for mass eyeballs, try to break out of the niche. Community and then beyond community.

Anyway, that's my media analyst's two cents. I confess to not following internet much in my present role and never have covered this part of it, but I am from the "content is king" style and in a multilingual environment, where no one knows all the languages, content creation needs to be distributed rather than centralized.

Freiheit ist immer Freiheit der Andersdenkenden

by redstar on Mon Jan 22nd, 2007 at 08:00:37 AM EST

New Mock Layout for ET | 50 comments (50 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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