European Tribune - Community, Politics & Progress.

Job. Dig it, wage slaves.

by MarketTrustee
Mon Oct 15th, 2007 at 09:05:04 PM EST

MPAA-rated "G" at Docudharma. MPAA-rated "R" at PFF. NB. author's content versioning policy

About a million years ago I satisfied a b-school homework assignment by writing on this very subject, Job wrestling Gabriel to create "value" from a [non-performing, sackoshit] operation. That would be you, multiplied. The text is reproduced below. Go on, suck up a portion of my tuition, valued at $95K (2002 USD excluding room and board), entitled "Leading Strategic Transformation." The purpose of the elective was to identify C-class mechanisms of crisis management and their instrumentality in engineering corporate "turn-around" scenarios and option calls.

That means [corporate managers] playing the odds and the capital, including you [fuckers] who are oblivious to your [financial and intellectual] debts to corporate acculturation.

The seminar was entertaining, as I recall. I just left the desk to retrieve the syllabus from my closet; can you imagine I'd trash any remnant of $125K worth of premium um education? Case study included interpretation of Jobean characters such as Gerstner, Ichon, Al "Chainsaw" Dunlap, Ken Lay and Jeff Skilling, Nevin, Mustafa, and empirical positivism published by other b-schools' academics. Students were also encouraged to ponder "soft" investment risk factors in "management style at the group centre" such as ignorance, ego, competititive stimuli, and aesthetic through "background" readings such as works by Frost, Marlowe, Homer, Pascale, Frankl and Fukuyama.

The meaning of the seminar for me however culminated in the screening of 12 O'clock High, wherein Pericles' rhetorical genius for persuading [others, sacksoshit] to commit suicide, reliably, for the "homeland" penetrates the situational detritus of the ages. Our lecturer invited students to role play ensemble "positions transforming self and transforming the world as a highly risky and arduous endeavor" silently, that is, in mime.

Pretty damn funny in retrospect.

Is crisis the threshold to corporate transformation? Apparently, it is. The Old Testament lays out the sequence of creative destruction that individuals and organizations have faced for over 3,000 years.

Jacob is the twin of Esau. Esau is the elder brother and heir of the patriarchal blessing. In order to steal that birthright, Jacob assumes Esau's identity. Antipathy between the brothers divides their family until Jacob's fear of retribution and guilt compel him to seek Esau's forgiveness. Near the end of his journey, Jacob strikes camp by a river. He is alone, having sent ahead his family and gifts for Esau. A stranger appears during the night and draws Jacob into mortal combat. The stranger delivers a numbing blow to Jacob's hip but cannot overpower him. Finally, the man says, "Let me go, for the day has dawned; but [Jacob] said, I will not let thee go, except thou bless me." The stranger renames him: "Thy name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel shall be thy name; for thou hast prevailed with God, and shalt be mighty with men." [32:29] Then the stranger disappears from the text as mysteriously as he arrived. Jacob realizes he has confronted God. Though "halted upon his thigh," he goes eagerly to meet Esau, saying "Receive my blessings, which I have brought thee, because God has had mercy on me, and I have all things."

Killing off failing practices to make room for new developments initially poses ethical and philosophical dilemmas for top management. It is very hard to renounce the sense of continuity conveyed by organizational culture. Sometimes we don't realize how valuable relationships are to us until we must choose between them. The overwhelming dread, or perhaps remorse, at the onset of Jacob's transformation into a leader signals a condition of readiness to part with the past.

As the transformation progresses, executives must strive to maintain a balance of loosening control without losing control of organizational changes. Creative and destructive forces within the firm are competing for attention. Jacob wrestles violently with the man at the river; he draws from deep emotional reserves to reverse his plight from one of a captive to that of master. In the corporate world, managers heading up change need extraordinary focus and personal endurance to articulate a vision of the organization's objectives during turbulent times.

Transformation culminates in a crisis of identity, because crisis brings us in direct acquaintance with belief systems that either do not describe or cannot explain the circumstances in which we find ourselves. The story of Jacob's life as the next patriarch begins dramatically with a new name, one that affirms the integrity and courage with which he resolved great conflict. In the modern world, corporate transformation is triggered as often by merger and acquisition activity as economic conditions that are beyond our control. Vital integration and rationalization within organizations doesn't quite keep pace with rapidly changing environment. In such cases, the trial of Job more accurately depicts transformation as an abrupt, even despicable interruption of a just and orderly world.

Job is about a prosperous and devout man. In a heavenly council, satan meets with God, alleging that Job's love of God is hypocritical. (Exhibit 2) Job's devotion is contingent on his material wealth not God's grace. If Job did not have God's blessing - riches, family, and friends - he would hate God. The two agree to test Job's piety. God allows satan to subject Job to any adversity, save death, in order to prove his claim. Laments, hymns, proverbs, and speeches describe the series of catastrophic events devised by satan. Job loses his wealth. His herds are stolen. His servants are murdered in a fire. His ten children are killed when his house collapses on them. Job himself is afflicted with boils. His friends condemn him, reasoning that since God's justice is inviolate, then Job must the cause of his own suffering. So, implausible is this indictment that God intervenes once more in the affairs of men to fully restore Job's fortune, family, and health.

Job's seeming unassailable sense of security captures the likely state of an organization that has achieved considerable market power through ever bigger and more competitive efficiencies. In this context, the purpose of transformation contradicts our beliefs. We are confused by Job's condition and his identity. But his reactions to the reign of chaos over his life range from grief to abject humility. His resolute self-defense raises questions of confidence within ourselves and also in the authenticity of leadership in crisis.

For me, the relationship between ethics and religious literature is in the development of moral sensibilities, understanding, intuitions, or beliefs that help each of us adapt to right or wrong, good or bad, governing behavior. Creativity and destruction are complex passages between personal and economic growth. Simple though these stories may be, they have enduring value as guides to the major issues that transformational leaders face and their chances of success.

[Thus, I deem myself thoroughly informed to judge claims of "transformational" leadership among POTUS candidates. How about you?]
Do you struggle daily through ethical dilemmas posed by professional performance measures or evident social crisis?

. Home
. About
. Contact
. New User Guide
. FAQ
. Search
. Search (Google)
. Archives (Wiki)
Art, Economics, Energy, Environment, EU Politics, Mech & Tech, By Country

Username:
Password:

. Make a new account
. Reset password

Job. Dig it, wage slaves. | 46 comments (46 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Inspiration (4.00 / 2)

I don't enjoy posting "essays." I prefer to comment within the wwwbody. However, this essay "Ron Paul and Isaiah's Job provoked me to deposit another point of view, the one absent a celebrity cue.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Mon Oct 15th, 2007 at 09:13:04 PM EST

Re: Inspiration (4.00 / 2)

Thanks for that, Market Trustee.

Nock's 1936 essay is as valid today as it was then, which, since it deals with human nature, is not surprising.

"The Remnant" have many names, I think. Gladwell's "Mavens" are among the Remnant, they are what I have heard called "Divergents" - as opposed to the 95% of "Convergents".

They are unbiddable, and to all intents and purposes unemployable.

They are the "Groucho Club" - ie they wouldn't join a Club that would have them as a member.

The Remnant, on the other hand, want only the best you have, whatever that may be. Give them that, and they are satisfied; you have nothing more to worry about.
The prophet of the American masses must aim consciously at the lowest common denominator of intellect, taste and character among 120,000,000 people; and this is a distressing task.

The Remnant are interested only in "excellence". What Pirsig refers to as "Quality". So anyone peddling policies must have "the best".

I think that one of the problems there is that by no means all of "the Remnant" are altruistic, and may be interested primarily in the best for them, as opposed to the best for Society, including the masses.

It follows that the optimal best policies must be those that combine the best for the individual with the best for Society - and no-one has managed that yet.

The other certainty which the prophet of the Remnant may always have is that the Remnant will find him. He may rely on that with absolute assurance. They will find him without his doing anything about it; in fact, if he tries to do anything about it, he is pretty sure to put them off.

This is why I am optimistic, ET itself is evidence of it.

ET - and other Internet sites in their own way - is successfully bringing together, or attracting, "the Remnant".

Now, I'm a bit of a maven or prophet in my own way. I bang on about "Open Corporates", and partnership-based structures - because I see in these emerging tools the basis of a new society.

Will it make a difference. I don't know, and I don't really care (well, actually I do...). The people who matter will read it and understand, or not, or even

If, for example, you are a writer or a speaker or a preacher, you put forth an idea which lodges in the Unbewußtsein of a casual member of the Remnant and sticks fast there.
For some time it is inert; then it begins to fret and fester until presently it invades the man's conscious mind and, as one might say, corrupts it.
Meanwhile, he has quite forgotten how he came by the idea in the first instance, and even perhaps thinks he has invented it; and in those circumstances, the most interesting thing of all is that you never know what the pressure of that idea will make him do.

as in this passage, assimilate it unconsciously.

The others will, if I am right, wake up one day, once the concepts or ideas have been spread by the mavens/ Remnant and say

"Well, of course, it's f...g obvious isn't it?"

Or not.

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 06:21:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Inspiration (none / 0)

Yes.

"...I was a Flower of the mountain yes when I put the rose in my hair like the Andalusian girls used or shall I wear a red yes and how he kissed me under the Moorish wall and I thought well as well him as another and then I asked him with my eyes to ask again yes and then he asked me would I yes to say yes my mountain flower and first I put my arms around him yes and drew him down to me so he could feel my breasts all perfume yes and his heart was going like mad and yes I said yes I will Yes. "

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 10:20:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 1)

I enjoyed your essay, but I wonder if I have misunderstood, or just read it a whole different way.

Here's my take:

STORY 1

--Jacob rips off Esau (business elite or whoever stands to make mucho mooka rips off e.g. workers)
--Jacob wrestles with someone (that horrible conscience--so many laid off and you ripped them off for your own gain!)
--Jacob beats his conscience and his conscience effectively says, "Okay, you're alright mate. Here's a new name and yes, you are entitled to all that stuff you ripped of."

Message: You ARE the chosen people, and though you do wrong, your God (Money? Mammon? The Anti-Leviathon?--hmmm...) will support you: yes! Your ideology is correct, and though you maybe, oh, destroyed some other people's futures, issa all okay!

STORY 2

--Job is the worker
--Satan is the Evil Capitalist
--God is the owner

Look, says Satan, your workers only work for you because you give them all those perks
No, says God, they work for me because they love and believe in my goodness.
So, says Satan, if you take away all their perks, reduce their salaries, sack them, remove their benefits, and generally destitute them...well, I just can't see it. They won't love you then, will they?
Of course they will, says God, and proceeds to do all the above.
And the poor worker? He or she still believeth!
Lo, a miracle!
Job's friends would be those cynical left-wing types.

And God's final question to Job: Where were you when we started producing goods for the market? What knoweth you of the ways of Capital?

I can't remember if Job ended up getting his stuff back, and I humbly suggest that in the same way court martial becomes courts martial, sackoshit in the plural should be sacksoshit?

Heh! I think I misunderstood everything!

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 06:47:27 AM EST

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 1)

He does get his stuff back. Thinks he gets new children too. All is well that ends well, right?

by A swedish kind of death on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 08:02:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (4.00 / 2)

Bravo! What a fascinating reading (dig) and great suggestion! (Now that I've found the edit button, I'll correct "sacksoshit." Truth to tell, I'm embarrassed to find this dated um material is on a "recommended" list. I was in a foul mood when I copied it out of my archive and began publishing/spamming/bombing last night.)

Both interpretations are reasonable, I think, given the correspondence you've constructed for this place, in this time. I particularly enjoy your Story 2 riff.

But what would you believe if I were to insist that you affirm, "I am simultaneously Job, job, Satan, and God"?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 09:38:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (4.00 / 2)

I was in a foul mood when I copied it out of my archive and began publishing/spamming/bombing last night.)

Heh! I thought it had that evil-browed strangeness. I wasn't sure I understood it, but I loved the idea that the Enron bosses and other assorted "fire 'em" managers were, in fact, justified if one followed the ethics of zer God of the Old Testament.

So, to be God and Satan would mean "being a boss", I think, so maybe you mean a middle manager, who is Job (with a job) compared to the Gods and Satans above, but is God and Satan to the Jobs with jobs below?

I would then insist, as I think God should have to Jacob, that he hand back (at least in some way) what he had stolen; that he resign his post (no, you are NOT the chosen son!);

...hold on, I'm mixing my biblical metaphors. The middle manager should see that acting "as God" has no value when the REAL Gods--the ones living in paradise a.k.a The Elites, with their many houses, their many passports--the dolphins who swim free, as Hunter Thomspon called them--will LAUGH at the middle-managers' presumptions of autonomy.

Or: Lose your Gods and find your fellow humans!

I really did enjoy the bent aspect of the diary; so...you really had to write a paper about how Jacob/Job related to managers having to close down unprofitable/declining divisions?

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 10:06:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (4.00 / 5)

Jehovah is tetchy and irrational. He likes torturing people. He likes blowing shit up. He believes he owns everything and everyone. He gets mad - really mad - when people don't do as he says.

Taking down a loyal minion is all in a day's work, and proves to the other loyal minions that next time it could be them. So they should pratice devoted minionhood harder and harder, because it might save them - although probably not all of them, because a few always have to be turned into an example to encourage the others.

More details in my forthcoming bestseller 'The Biblical CEO - maximise your profit the Abrahamic way.'

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 10:30:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I am *still* giggling... (4.00 / 2)

I'll have you know, I'm copying that last line all OVER the web. Too funny ...

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 09:01:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

"mixing my biblical metaphors" (none / 1)

O the irony! My chosen name is "MarketTrustee." My given name is Mary Catherine. Lo, these forty-three years as it was in the thirty-fifth. O the irony!

"Lose your Gods and find your fellow humans!"

The course grading requirement consisted of two written assignments of no more than 1,000 words each. The prompt for the first was given thus:

Telling the Transformational Story. Choose one or more accounts of transformation from beyond the business world: i.e. from history, philosophy, myth, religion, movies, art or literature. This should be a story that particularly engages or inspires you. It could come from any source, including our assigned readings and other students' contributions on the LBS forum [intranet]. In your paper, you should summarise the story, tell us what is that you find most striking about it (and why), and then suggest principles that can be drawn from your story that might be inspirational or practical use to the transformational leader in business or those being led.

Ha ha ha. Really, I chose Job.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 11:04:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "mixing my biblical metaphors" (none / 1)

Now I wonder if I've read everything backwards twice!

An interesting example of transformation would be Krishnamurti, who "de-godded" himself.

I mean, were you taking the michael with your essay, or have I read it all wrong?

I particularly liked the line:

The overwhelming dread, or perhaps remorse, at the onset of Jacob's transformation into a leader signals a condition of readiness to part with the past.

I was sure he was ready to part with the past, especially all that hassle with Esau going on and on...and Jacob drew a line in the stand and said, "Now is not the time for looking backward, we must look forward! And I am your leader!"

And Esau said, "No you're bloody not! No matter how many times you say it, you STILL ripped me off, you git!"

And lo, Jacob was brought low, but God said, "Nah mate, you're okay. That trickery was pre-ordained by me, or ya know, it's a pig for Esau but that's the way the holy cookie crumbles."

Now it came to pass, when Isaac was old and his eyes were so dim that he could not see, that he called Esau his older son and said to him, "My son." And he answered him, "Here I am." Then he said, "Behold now, I am old. I do not know the day of my death. Now therefore, please take your weapons, your quiver and your bow, and go out to the field and hunt game for me. And make me savory food, such as I love, and bring it to me that I may eat, that my soul may bless you before I die."

Now Rebekah was listening when Isaac spoke to Esau his son. And Esau went to the field to hunt game and to bring it. So Rebekah spoke to Jacob her son, saying, "Indeed I heard your father speak to Esau your brother, saying, Bring me game and make savory food for me, that I may eat it and bless you in the presence of the Lord before my death.' Now therefore, my son, obey my voice according to what I command you. Go now to the flock and bring me from there two choice kids of the goats, and I will make savory food from them for your father, such as he loves. Then you shall take it to your father, that he may eat it, and that he may bless you before his death."

So we'll need a subtext about leaders being manipulated by their mothers...

And Jacob said to Rebekah his mother, "Look, Esau my brother is a hairy man, and I am a smooth-skinned man. Perhaps my father will feel me, and I shall seem to be a deceiver to him; and I shall bring a curse on myself and not a blessing." But his mother said to him, "Let your curse be on me, my son; only obey my voice, and go, get them for me." And he went and got them and brought them to his mother, and his mother made savory food, such as his father loved. Then Rebekah took the choice clothes of her elder son Esau, which were with her in the house, and put them on Jacob her younger son. And she put the skins of the kids of the goats on his hands and on the smooth part of his neck. Then she gave the savory food and the bread, which she had prepared, into the hand of her son Jacob.

...add in how family members (substitute "managers" or "depts.") plot against each other, with factions of power sabotaging the other--deliberately--for their political gain--in order to become "leaders"

So he went to his father and said, "My father.' And he said, "Here I am. Who are you, my son?" Jacob said to his father, "I am Esau your firstborn; I have done just as you told me; please arise, sit and eat of my game, that your soul may bless me." But Isaac said to his son, "How is it that you have found it so quickly, my son?" And he said, "Because the Lord your God brought it to me." Then Isaac said to Jacob, "Please come near, that I may feel you, my son, whether you are really my son Esau or not." So Jacob went near to Isaac his father, and he felt him and said, "The voice is Jacob's voice, but the hands are the hands of Esau." And he did not recognize him, because his hands were hairy like his brother Esau's hands; so he blessed him. Then he said, "Are you really my son Esau?" He said, "I am." He said, "Bring it near to me, and I will eat of my son's game, so that my soul may bless you." So he brought it near to him, and he ate; and he brought him wine, and he drank. Then his father Isaac said to him, "Come near now and kiss me, my son." And he came near and kissed him; and he smelled the smell of his clothing,

Justify your actions by saying "It happened because GOD helped me"--use religious authority to justify your own actions...tell bare-faced lies...

And blessed him and said: "Surely, the smell of my son is like the smell of a field which the Lord has blessed. Therefore may God give you of the dew of heaven, of the fatness of the earth, and plenty of grain and wine. Let peoples serve you, and nations bow down to you. Be master over your brethren, and let your mother's sons bow down to you. Cursed be everyone who curses you, and blessed be those who bless you!"

Add in the idea of forcing the letter of the law (the value of Isaac's blessing and curse) against the spirit of the law (turn it 180 degrees! To your advantage always! Let "good" equal "what I do"...

Now it happened, as soon as Isaac had finished blessing Jacob, and Jacob had scarcely gone out from the presence of Isaac his father, that Esau his brother came in from his hunting. He also had made savory food, and brought it to his father, and said to his father, "Let my father arise and eat of his son's game, that your soul may bless me." And his father Isaac said to him, "Who are you?" So he said, "I am your son, your firstborn, Esau." Then Isaac trembled exceedingly, and said, "Who? Where is the one who hunted game and brought it to me? I ate all of it before you came, and I have blessed him; and indeed he shall be blessed." When Esau heard the words of his father, he cried with an exceedingly great and bitter cry, and said to his father, "Bless me; me also, O my father!" But he said, "Your brother came with deceit and has taken away your blessing." And Esau said, "Is he not rightly named Jacob? For he has supplanted me these two times. He took away my birthright, and now look, he has taken away my blessing!" And he said, "Have you not reserved a blessing for me?" Then Isaac answered and said to Esau, "Indeed I have made him your master, and all his brethren I have given to him as servants; with grain and wine I have sustained him. What shall I do now for you, my son?" And Esau said to his father, "Have you only one blessing, my father? Bless me; me also, O my father!" And Esau lifted up his voice and wept.

That'll be the subsection about how the "good guys" are always defeating themselves by obeying the rules even as those rules shoot them in the face.

Then Isaac his father answered and said to him: "Behold, your dwelling shall be of the fatness of the earth, and of the dew of heaven from above. By your sword you shall live, and you shall serve your brother; and it shall come to pass, when you become restless, that you shall break his yoke from your neck."

So...the old managers offer the gift of a possible future class war to the losers!

So Esau hated Jacob because of the blessing with which his father blessed him, and Esau said in his heart, "The days of mourning for my father are at hand; then I will kill my brother Jacob." And the words of Esau her older son were told to Rebekah. So she sent and called Jacob her younger son, and said to him, "Surely your brother Esau comforts himself concerning you by intending to kill you. Now therefore, my son, obey my voice: arise, flee to my brother Laban in Haran. And stay with him a few days, until your brother's fury turns away, until your brother's anger turns away from you, and he forgets what you have done to him; then I will send and bring you from there. Why should I be bereaved also of you both in one day?" And Rebekah said to Isaac, "I am weary of my life because of the daughters of Heth; if Jacob takes a wife of the daughters of Heth, like these who are the daughters of the land, what good will my life be to me?"

Take the money and run!

Oh my word!

MarketTrustee, now I am too confused for thought!

(Sudden shiver as I realise that 6,000 year old history is repeating itself endlessly--and we already know how the story ends...and it ain't with "the coming of the Kingdom of God to Earth")

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 11:44:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "to confused for thought" (none / 1)

Well, that's 2B of us.

What does "taking the michael" mean?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 12:39:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "to confused for thought" (4.00 / 2)

taking the michael = taking the mick = taking the P = taking the, er, mickey = er...

I read the essay as a sort of parody wrapped in a strange truth: that managers would use the example of Jacob to explain to themselves the emotional processes they were undergoing when, say, downsizing a dept., closing a research section or a product line...

I saw the logic as self-serving (any answer is good as long as the manager can come out feeling that they didn't do bad, that what they did was necessary or unavoidable etc. and anyway, the company needed this job done and 'twas better for the company and the company thanks them, maybe), and I saw Jacob's tale as self-serving in that maybe he did wrong, but in the end it was what God wanted, and his struggle to...ach...

and hey! Another parable could be made by the outcome, where the leaders then re-distribute their wealth to the losers, who are after all their brothers who they ripped off, closing the circle and spreading the bounty (=the profits made by the various redundancies etc.) back to those who lost out.

Genesis 33 - The Meeting of Jacob and Esau

Then Esau said, "What do you mean by all this company which I met?" And he said, "These are to find favor in the sight of my lord." But Esau said, "I have enough, my brother; keep what you have for yourself." And Jacob said, "No, please, if I have now found favor in your sight, then receive my present from my hand, inasmuch as I have seen your face as though I had seen the face of God, and you were pleased with me. Please, take my blessing that is brought to you, because God has dealt graciously with me, and because I have enough." So he urged him, and he took it.

So the family is back together, and Jacob is still the leader, but Esau bears no enmity...heh hey!

So we can expect management schools to teach that after grabbing (in various underhand ways) the profits, a sudden offering of their goods by the winners (=those who made a profit) to those who they have removed from the processes of production (=made poorer by their scheming lo these many years) will be necessary; that there will be reconciliation as the stolen wealth is redistributed (the managers only did what had to be done, they had no ulterior motives), and communities reconcile...

Genesis 33 - The Meeting of Jacob and Esau

Then he crossed over before them and bowed himself to the ground seven times, until he came near to his brother.

a. He crossed over before them: The best thing about Jacob is now, after being conquered by God, he leads the procession coming to meet Esau.

b. Bowed himself to the ground: Jacob already sent over gifts and showed he didn't want to take anything materially from Esau. But by bowing down, he showed he is submitted to his brother and wanted no social power over him.
(my italics)

History suggests it didn't and doesn't happen that way (the reconciliation part--the giving up of stolen privilege), but...

Too strange for thought!

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 04:07:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "taking the michael" (none / 1)

to slip s.o. a mickey = to poison; to swallow poison hidden in or disguised by ingestible substrata.

Very nice, fascinating intuition, as is the Gauguin illustration or free association of yon state of mind from my essay, and partially accurate. (Some of us do know how Gauguin ended.)

Ahhhh, but really, demonstrating how deductive reasoning is inferior to inductive reasoning in detecting the significance of (uncontrolled) factors in our analyses and inferrences, for example, MarketTrustee is a b-school graduate, and assumptions, e.g. MarketTrustee is a free market capitalist, that typically justify judgement.

Who the hell are Mary and Catherine?

Really, I am an African American (AA) female. Oddly enough, I have always been AA and always will be associated, really and conversely, figuratively, within the prevailing or dominating cultural history and language of the US (or "Anglo Disease"). That is, I have experiences that you do not (I assume) despite our common cultural inculcation (e.g. Biblical authority). You of course could not know that fact from my "MarketTrustee" wwwpersona, claim on "elite" status, or poor and authentic typing skill :) Blogging is Art.

Really, I applied to b-school, expecting only to secure "venture" capitalization for a specific project. That expectation was dashed within the first two weeks of my experience in that "community of practice." And that story is a series of diaries ...

Really, I have given a great deal of thought before this ET post of "dated material" to the reasons why I, one of 65, might have been and was accepted into that institution.

Really, I paid cash (I am debt-free by one measure) and am, as Chris intimates above, an unemployable "remnant." I can get with that, really, for now or cleaning toilets for a wage, later.

Really, for a number of other and related reasons, I exploited the "free" counseling services offered by the administration during my tenure (UK health policy is really ironic.) until I escaped. To Bush world. (Sometimes I miss the sympathetic Argentine emigree who suffered my dispair.)

Really, talk therapy is a good thing, a far better thing than narcotics and pharmacology. And that is all I have to say about Freud, Geroski, and my online M.O. for now.

Our exchange has been a pleasure. That last bit "crossed over before them" resonates, personally and politically, in a noisy kinda way.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 05:59:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "taking the michael" (none / 1)

Who the hell are Mary and Catherine?

I never worked that part out.

Hey, MarketTrustee! "Taking the michael" means "not being serious"--I wondered if there was some strong irony in your examples.

As I said in another comment, I find the Old Testament bizarre...amazing what people can read into these old stories written from a small group of people's perspective (and prejudice as usual) as to what happened and what it all meant.

I'm worried that I might have seemed to imply things that I wasn't implying, I was just running with the story of Jacob, turning it round, and I was taken by the idea of a company being like "God"--no matter how badly it treats you, it is still "God" and therefore to be obeyed...and if the company is eaten by another company then "God" becomes the system of eat eat eat; and the managers trying to justify their aiding and abetting of "eat eat eat"...heh...I think I probably misunderstood everything!

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 06:24:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "Mary and Catherine" (none / 1)

Hey, rg! That's the best part of the joke, if I do say so myself, being as how my Irish and catholic antecedents are, really, otherwise invisible.

Oh, here: Mary and Catherine.

New Testament.

Really, I'm sure you understand everything you need to know ;) baci e abbracci

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:15:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "Mary and Catherine" (none / 0)

Baci e abbracci!

I give you this.

Historians believe that Catherine ('the pure one') may not have existed and that she was more an ideal exemplary figure than a historical one.[6] She did certainly form an exemplary counterpart to the pagan philosopher Hypatia of Alexandria in the medieval mindset; and it has been suggested that she was invented specifically for that purpose. Like Hypatia, she is said to have been highly learned (in philosophy and theology), very beautiful, sexually pure, and to have been brutally murdered for publicly stating her beliefs; 105 years before Hypatia's death (although first records mentioning her, or one of her variants, date much later).

and this.

Hypatia of Alexandria - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Hypatia was the daughter of Theon, who was her teacher and the last fellow of the Musaeum of Alexandria. Hypatia did not teach in the Musaeum, but received her pupils in her own home. Hypatia became head of the Platonist school at Alexandria in about 400. There she taught on mathematics and philosophy, and counted many prominent Christians among her students. No images of her exist, but nineteenth-century writers and artists envisioned her as an Athene-like beauty.
In 391, Theophilus, the patriarch of Alexandria, ordered the destruction of some of the native Roman pagan temples in the city, which may have included the Musaeum and certainly included the Serapeum (a temple for the worship of Serapis and "daughter library" to the Great Library). In the same year Emperor Theodosius I had published an edict prohibiting various aspects of pagan worship, whereupon (although this was part of a wider phenomenon) Christians throughout the Roman Empire embarked upon a thorough campaign to destroy or christianize pagan places of worship.
Hypatia lived during a conflict between pagans and Christians, who were demanding the final destruction of paganism as an imperial institution. Hypatia, herself a pagan, was respected by many Christians, and was even exalted by a few later Christian authors as a symbol of virtue, often being portrayed by them as a virgin until her death. The Suda is one such source, which also tells the story of her rebuffing a suitor by throwing sanitary napkins at him, to show him that sexual love was carnal rather than spiritual.^[5] These later portrayals are not entirely reliable, as they often contradict one another. It is generally agreed that she never officially married, but lifelong virginity is hard to prove.
Her contemporary, the Christian historiographer Socrates Scholasticus in his Ecclesiastical History portrays her as follows:
There was a woman at Alexandria named Hypatia, daughter of the philosopher Theon, who made such attainments in literature and science, as to far surpass all the philosophers of her own time. Having succeeded to the school of Plato and Plotinus, she explained the principles of philosophy to her auditors, many of whom came from a distance to receive her instructions. On account of the self-possession and ease of manner, which she had acquired in consequence of the cultivation of her mind, she not unfrequently appeared in public in presence of the magistrates. Neither did she feel abashed in going to an assembly of men. For all men on account of her extraordinary dignity and virtue admired her the more.

(I am a fan of someone's copy HTML feature--all those lovely links!)

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:43:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "Mary and Catherine" (4.00 / 2)

What a read! How about this for topical comment.

Hypatia of Alexandria - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yet even she fell a victim to the political jealousy which at that time prevailed. For as she had frequent interviews with Orestes, it was calumniously reported among the Christian populace, that it was she who prevented Orestes from being reconciled to the bishop. Some of them therefore, hurried away by a fierce and bigoted zeal, whose ringleader was a reader named Peter, waylaid her returning home, and dragging her from her carriage, they took her to the church called Caesareum, where they completely stripped her, and then murdered her with tiles. After tearing her body in pieces, they took her mangled limbs to a place called Cinaron, and there burnt them. This affair brought not the least opprobrium, not only upon Cyril, but also upon the whole Alexandrian church. And surely nothing can be farther from the spirit of Christianity than the allowance of massacres, fights, and transactions of that sort. This happened in the month of March during Lent, in the fourth year of Cyril's episcopate, under the tenth consulate of Honorius, and the sixth of Theodosius [AD 415].

What is maybe strange, is that the only believers I know are buddhists--and what do they believe in? Who knows? Exercise. Meditation. Healthy body. They have obstruse scriptures which you can read if you want to, and no doubt there are some strange parts.

But....Christians? It's SO anachronistic (sez me, heh ;), I mean, if you want to go into ancient myths, find some really ancient ones, study them, learn all the old old myths (kcurie knows so many! and so varied!)...by the time of christianity it was all going wrong, everywhere. Only the roman gods were bringing joy and plenty to their followers, and their chiefs probably didn't believe god was anything more than the statue the idiots smiled at....heh heh! Sez me tonite!

For modern myths we this negative one based on religion, so it doesn't count, and lots of other ones based on life as lived, as kcurie says in his diary: hunger is down (900 million), unsanitary conditions are up. 2 billion people without sanitation.

Well, I've typed enuff!

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 08:33:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 1)

I must say that your mythology and narratives sound very far away from my myths... clearly different breeding.. different cultures almost :)

In any case... always great to hear about them..

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 03:09:49 PM EST

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (4.00 / 2)

Then there's rg, taking the myth as usual....

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 04:57:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (4.00 / 2)

What are your basic myths?

(I have to say, reading the Old Testament stories...explains a lot of "right wing" thinking, all the violence, backstabbing, evil intent--God chief among the violent, backstabbing, and intender of evil--endlessly followed by some form of atonement and the chosen people staying "chosen"; their misdeeds (and God's misdeeds) endlessly forgiven--by God and by them--a circular story--inward-looking, a race myth that made its way, via christianity, to far-flung places. That's my re-reading, anyway.)

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 05:47:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 1)

I write "race" but I should write "tribe" and then that becomes "factions of the tribe", endlessly "us" (the chosen members of the faction in a faction) acting--good or bad--and "us" (not them) having God's attention.

Reminds me of rememberinggiap's comments over at moonofalabama about U.S. films of Vietnam, where the attention is always "What happened to us?", good, bad, the attention always on the U.S. and not on those who were the recipients of U.S. behaviour--I mean...the only position outside of self-referentiality (no stepping into other people's shoes!) is the objectivity offered by God, who in turn is endlessly concentrated on their deeds.

A metaphor for how humans are acting on the planet: are we causing climate change? Are we guilty? Have we done wrong? And the poor polar bears...are "other"; and we don't watch the films about how we appear in their eyes...of course...ach...I no makea ze sense!

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 05:53:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 1)

well I ahve bunch of them it is a network... but if I wold have to put a source .. the source of them.. I would say three origins.

First and ofremost , schooling.. and teachers in Spain n the 80's .. that's an stuyle of teaching, of education, of.. well everything...

the second origin was a God is love catholiticism very common in spain in the 80's.. a mixture of lvoe philosophy with jesus as some kind of friend. You know all that stuff about loving the otherspecially if it is a foreigner and weird....

The thrid one of course.. my TV..a cutally migeru's and mine.. (we had teh sam TV so we recognize ourselves in our narratives and description).. basically our own Espinete.. and soem comfamous comics..and the old star trek.. also La clave and other p discussion-like cult programs where discussing was abut intelligent people talking intelligent things surrounded by a lot of smoke..

If someon is from the US I would say the more similar mythology you can get is if you take the star Trek New Genrations or Voyager mythology and you take out all the "Marine" stuff".

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 04:15:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

Thanks.

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 04:23:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (4.00 / 2)

I explained a little bit further down in another comment how thsoe myths were regardign those in the diary....je jej e just in case you want to know.. but Migeru knows exactly what I am talkign about... He might have a differetn 1.. but he certainly knows about 2.. and we know for certain that "WE HAD THE SAME TV" (this is the sentence we say each other every time we meet!!)

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 04:30:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

We had the same TV (4.00 / 2)

you take full credit for that one!

We have met the enemy, and it is us — Pogo

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 04:52:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Please elaborate (none / 0)

Here is my myth, given my "breeding":

For me, the relationship between ethics and religious literature is in the development of moral sensibilities, understanding, intuitions, or beliefs that help each of us adapt to right or wrong, good or bad, governing behavior. Creativity and destruction are complex passages between personal and economic growth. Simple though these stories may be, they have enduring value as guides to the major issues that transformational leaders face and their chances of success.

which ought not be confuse with others' myths.

You operate under some other set of assumptions, really?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:44:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Please elaborate (none / 1)

Ya!

Creativity and destruction are complex passages

yes!

between personal

yes!

and

And?

economic growth.

Huh? That's a wiiiiiiide use of the word economic, or it means that the two poles aren't self <--> society, rather they are self <--> business

and business is busyness is busy busy, no time to stop (all that past chasing me!)

how about "...between personal and...public"?

"and cosmic"

"and...'other(s)'"

Please use this space if you wish to state what the other(s) may be.

Oink!

So Bush's public role is fully negative, no matter how much an individual's economy might grow.

What is a transformational leader?

My first answer: a person who has transformed themselves OUT of the very idea of wanting to be "a leader" as opposed to simply leading where necessary and jollying along with everyone else for the rest of the day.

Of course some poor souls (noble souls!) are forced by circumstance and intelligence and through a basic empathy with all other living beings to keep leading in dangerous directions--the ANTI Bush: Martin Luther King, who was shot.

He may have been a trasformational leader, but it was the CONTENT that counted. I suppose it is quite possible (maybe simple) to lead a person through a transformation TO SOMETHING WORSE!

Beware!

;)

I'm still looking forward to kcurie's diary on magic.

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 08:19:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Good night, rg n/t (none / 0)

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 08:52:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Please elaborate (none / 1)

Oh yeah.. they sound very alien to me. this does not mean, of course, that I do not understand what you are saying or that I do not agree with it.. it is just that it is not the way I would put it.. or how I frame it...

Where/when I was born there was no concept of creativity.. nor destruction.. I encontered this narrative much mroe later and in other cultures.. so I was grown up without this american (among others) idea of such a thing as creativity... believe me.. Michelangelo and all that people were not creators.. they were weird people painting stuff.

The same goes for destruction.. even when a hurricane stroke.. it was not destructive.. it was just the hurricane happening.

The same goes with personal growth.. I must say some peopel around tried to put me into the "you have to grow to become a better person".... but closest family worked with other rules, since most of my family started working when they were 7-14 and adolescence did not exist, they expected me to behave properly or not-properly on the spot...thsi stuff of growing and becoming a better person was for... "rich stupid guys".. you are you now... that make me later realize all the mythology surrounding the "you should grow and in your growht you will dominate sex and make it worthwhile" given that sex was a completley different issue whch you did had to dominate but with a rithual not by growing.. thanks to this disconenction between two myths I was able to realize this narrative without comapring with other cultures (I am smart je je je).

The same goes for transformational leader.. nothing more alien to TV I was raised in.. ask Migeru for that...Espinete, la Bruja averia, Marco., Baner y Flappy .. there was not a single transformation leader among them... I only saw that in star Trek.. years later due to the Marine captain stuff... and it always seemed weird to me.. ( we used to think.. those crazy americans!!!)

But of course I do love hearing about your narratives.. really.

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 04:27:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (4.00 / 2)

This makes no sense to me at all. Maybe I have to read it when I'm fresh and not after midnight.

We have met the enemy, and it is us — Pogo

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:09:58 PM EST

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

didn't make any senseto me just after i'd woken up this morning ;-)

Life should consist in at least fifty percent pure waste of time, and the rest doing what you please.

by ceebs (bunchofwankers (at) gmail (dot) com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:12:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

We should exchange notes.

We have met the enemy, and it is us — Pogo

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:18:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

ceebs: didn't make any senseto me just after i'd woken up this morning ;-)
Migeru: We should exchange notes.

Better to write something that does make sense - at least it would save rg pouring out eager speculation about what it MIGHT mean :-)

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice. Blog - Nice Experience

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 05:04:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

There is a clash of frames/narratives/myths as kcurie points out. MarketTrustee and rg clearly understand each other's frames even if they are different. Mine and ceebs' are sufficiently different from MarketTrustee's that we can't make heads or tails of it. I do understand rg's top-level comment and, whether or not it's actually germane to the diary (MT seems to think it is) it is an interesting take on the issue.

So, sure, I'll try to understand the narrative behind the diary before it drops out of my 50-most-recent-diaries box.

We have met the enemy, and it is us — Pogo

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 05:13:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

MarketTrustee and rg clearly understand each other's frames even if they are different.

! i don't really understand anything. What I enjoy is a well turned sentence and an intriguing thought, and I'm aware of the "right wing" story from having to read about it so much (US/Israel--their behaviours and effects.) Re-reading the bible I'm usually thinking of it through the frame of an egyptian friend of mine--and it's not that I read the bible often; just that when there is a big surge in religious fervour I like to check out the originating texts--and always there is this strange parallel--which I tried to pull out in my other comments. It is, I think, a whole different myth world to those around the mediterranean, which I don't really know--my myths...I'm gonnae ponder them, maybe get a diary up--

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 05:25:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

well turned

Maybe I should say "interestingly bent".

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 05:30:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

It is, I think, a whole different myth world to those around the mediterranean

What I mean is (sheeessshhhhhhh......us!): my myth-world--from my past--is different to those around the mediterranean

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 05:33:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 1)

Well, it's your time - I think this frames of reference stuff can too easily lead to unproductive relativism. Maybe you should take seriously this rather more coherent statement by the writer:

Truth to tell, I'm embarrassed to find this dated um material is on a "recommended" list. I was in a foul mood when I copied it out of my archive and began publishing/spamming/bombing last night.)

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice. Blog - Nice Experience

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 04:44:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

Well, the 1936 essay by Nock which was cited I found interesting, but I lost the plot somewhere in the rg - Market Trustee dialogue....

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:20:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

I lost the plot in the very first section, where there was a cite to something that was a comment about bias at the BBC that seemed to have no relevance to the title or the words in italic (but it was late, I'm sure.) I was enjoying the read and out came these biblical allusions, all part of some paid-for MBA or somesuch, and there were these sacksothit and they were us! because these managers are churning us over, like the machine stormy present linked to a while ago, the machine rolling relentlessly on, crushing trees as it moves forward...

...but not tonite! Not here or down any of the roads...

I find the following to be educational and am currently reading it afore ze bed. As to its veracity, I ask the kind help of knowledgeable people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypatia_of_Alexandria

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 07:31:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 1)

it appears well referenced, I'll check it against paper versions in the morning.

Life should consist in at least fifty percent pure waste of time, and the rest doing what you please.

by ceebs (bunchofwankers (at) gmail (dot) com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 08:24:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: hermeneutic (none / 0)

wiki.

My assignment reproduced here is a demonstration. Now, some readers are shocked or incredulous that I'd submit such an interpretation of normative crisis management strategy to "peer" review -- as if nothing in "breeding" could have prepared a writer for such a task then, much less now, to cultivate an "ability to understand things from somebody else's point of view, and to appreciate the cultural and social forces that may have influenced their outlook."

Readers' responses to the (versioned) preface and religious references, rather than explicit corporate governance prescribed by the text, indicate as much. For only a few thus far are willing to recognize an "outlook" or perspective which situates current events and personal agency in an environment of authentic, social crisis, e.g. "Anglo Disease" whose pathological economic and institutional legitimacy ought to be self-evident.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 08:43:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: hermeneutic (none / 1)

For only a few...of those working in business in the West?

;)

(I'd imagine if you don't have sanitation you're living an authentic social crisis, ditto food supply or rather HUNGER--that'll make the few at least 2 billion.

But oh, I'm reading you sideways!

Who are these shocked and incredulous readers?

(That's the sound of a bed calling me.)

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 08:58:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Good night, rg n/t (none / 1)

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by MarketTrustee (pbing@estudioinc.com) on Tue Oct 16th, 2007 at 11:58:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Job. Dig it, wage slaves. (none / 0)

Don't be so open-minded that your brain falls out :-)

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice. Blog - Nice Experience

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Wed Oct 17th, 2007 at 04:56:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Job. Dig it, wage slaves. | 46 comments (46 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Go to: [ European Tribune Homepage : Top of page : Top of comments ]