European Tribune - Community, Politics & Progress.

Heart

by deviousdiva
Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 03:55:24 PM EST

Originally posted at This is not my country

Some things are really hard to explain to someone who has not experienced them. Take racism. How do you really explain what racism FEELS like as opposed to what it is ?

Yesterday, I went with the love of my life to look at a potential new house for us. We had been to a housing agency to see what was on offer and to register with them so they could do the looking for us. The only suitable house they had on their books was one where the owners had said that they didn't want foreigners. My heart thumped. A loud single violent thump.

I didn't mention it for a while afterwards because I didn't want to sound like I was being paranoid. We talked about it briefly later. "No. It won't be a problem. People like us. We are good people. We are not the type of foreigners that people don't like". I felt bad even to be saying these things.

A few days went by but it was on my mind. An annoying worry that I kept pushing down. I kept saying to myself "Don't worry, things have changed here. Not everyone is racist. We've managed to get along with people. We have had mostly good experiences here"

So yesterday, love of my life called and said there was a house for us to look at in the evening. "Shall we go ? Yes, great, that was quick, sounds ideal". So we pop over to the office to get details and head on up to see the place. Just as we reached the door my heart thumped again.

The door opened and the landlady hesitated. Just for a second. As we were making our introductions, her eyes kept flitting over to me. I knew what she was thinking in those first few moments. She showed us into the hall and the little looks continued. She didn't stare. She didn't look disgusted or frightened. Just hesitant. As if, perhaps, her mind was thinking through other thoughts apart from showing us the house ? We looked at the two bedrooms and moved into the kitchen. I was trying to concentrate on looking around but it was as though I was holding my breath the whole time. Waiting.

After probably less than the two minutes that she and the love of my life had been making small talk, there was a tiny pause. My heart thumped. And then she said it. "I was expecting you to be Greek".

She didn't say "I don't want to rent to foreigners" or anything like that. After all she could have said that at the door and not shown us in if that was how she felt. No. She had been surprised that we were foreign but she was showing us her house anyway. It was a relief. The air was clear to continue. I stopped holding my breath.

Now, I am NOT saying that she was racist. What I am trying to explain is what racism FEELS like. It's that awareness of hesitations when people meet you for the first time. It is that fleeting look. It is that waiting until the fact of your differentness is mentioned. It is that hoping that you are "the right kind of foreign". It is that thinking about it even when you don't want to. It is that pushing away of those thoughts because you don't want to seem paranoid or to "have a chip on your shoulder". It is in that slight withdrawal when you approach. It is the fact that you know, even if no-one else does.

It is in that loud single violent thump of your heart.

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Heart | 24 comments (24 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

The only suitable house they had on their books was one where the owners had said that they didn't want foreigners.

Er, are there no fair housing laws in Greece then? WTF?

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:10:28 PM EST

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

The only suitable house they had on their books was one where the owners had said that they didn't want foreigners.

They said what?

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:13:15 PM EST

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

Sounds like Greece has a long way to go before it'll be ready to join the EU.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:15:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

Fair Housing laws? In Greece? Are you joking?

But seriously...Short of actually putting signs in the windows saying "No Blacks. No Gypsies" the landlords can say and do whatever they want. And people are quite sympathetic towards them not wanting to rent to foreigners. We don't have too much of a problem because we are the "right kind of foreign" ie not Albanian, Turkish or Roma but still...

The only thing necessary for the persistence of evil is for enough good people to do nothing

by deviousdiva (thedeviousdiva@gmail.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:24:13 PM EST

Re: Heart (none / 1)

No I wasn't joking. From Colman's comment, I take it that EU membership does require fair housing laws. Why does it seem I would be joking if expecting Greece to have them?

I know there are many thing Europeans look at America and see as appalling. Well, a lot of Americans see them as appalling too. But even though housing discrimination persists, it is certainly not legal, and no one would actually come right out and say they were discriminating, especially to the party looking to buy/rent, unless they wanted a lawsuit.

This is the reason Americans like me tend to be incredulous when we are told the racism/immigration problems throughout in Europe are overblown by the press.

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:36:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 4)

This is the reason Americans like me tend to be incredulous when we are told the racism/immigration problems throughout in Europe are overblown by the press.

Well, that might be because people like me haven't actually been turned down by a landlord for being brown in Europe so far (although I haven't tried in Greece) but I have been in the US, twice. ;-)

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:43:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (none / 1)

As poemless says, it is illegal. And not really difficult to bring legal action. did you sue?

Also I'm curious what part of the country it was. I spend most of my time in California and Chicago, though I travel as well. But my feeling is that would be quite a rare event in those two places. I'm surrounded by Asians, Hispanics, Blacks, whites, Indians, etc. And I certainly find it more open in the US than the UK,,,,where they don't even like the French and Germans (only a partial snark).

by wchurchill on Fri Feb 23rd, 2007 at 02:36:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (none / 1)

Just as an FYI, it is NOT illegal in the United States in most cases to refuse to rent to someone unconditionally.

In my city, it all depends on the nature of the house/apartment. If there's a 2 or 3 family home, the owner can deny unconditionally.

This applies for any abode that is advertised publically.

by Upstate NY on Sat Feb 24th, 2007 at 11:48:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 2)

Oh no, I just meant they at least had to learn to be hypocritical about it. Actually making it clear in advance that they're racist shits really isn't in the spirit of the thing.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:47:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (none / 0)

"Oh no" meaning there are not fair housing laws in Europe???

As for being hypocritical about it, you've hit the nail on the head with that...

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:51:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

I believe that in much of the EU, like in the US, it'd be asking for some sort of legal action to explicitly say you didn't want to let to foreigners. I also believe that in much of the EU, like in the US, there exist many people who would find their property inexplicably unavailable if the prospective tenants were foreigners, the wrong colour, the wrong religion or whatever.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:54:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (none / 1)

The classic, is, of course, the reputed signs on boarding houses and flats in '50s England: "No dogs, no blacks, no Irish."

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 04:56:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

Yeah, we had those too. Very strange to think today about Irish being the objects of racism... I guess it shows you just how subjective the concept of "race" is...

I have a confession to make. There was recently a story in the Tribune about condo owners being forced to give up their pets. Their original contracts said "no pets" but there was an "understanding" that it would not be enforced. For whatever reason, they changed their minds and are now making pet owners get rid of their pets (mostly cats) or move. So there is this outrage and the new fair housing issue is pets. That it should be illegal to discriminate against pet owners. (I think this movement got a huge boost from Katrina, when the world watched as people were not allowed to evacuate with their pets, resulting in who knows how many devoted pet owners trapped in the flood and innumerable perished animals...)

So I've been all up in arms about this, but yeah, we're tearing down public housing and putting hundreds of poor, mostly black people on the streets at the same time. And I'm sad about the old people and their cats...

Say, I did read somewhere that there is either an EU-wide or perhaps within some EU-member nations a law declaring housing a civil right. I don't know what kind of measures there are to guarantee this right is protected (that housing is ensured) but I thought it was a nice sentiment. Hypocritical, perhaps, but a refreshing change from the American talking point that the homeless are just bums unwilling to work who have chosen to live this way, like unclean and unsafe conditions are a lifestyle choice, not an injustice...

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 05:31:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 4)

a law declaring housing a civil right.

It is a recent French law (in fact, voted today!)

"Ne te courbe que pour aimer..." René Char

by Melanchthon on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 06:26:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

Yes, that's happened to me. I've spoken on the phone to a perspective landlord and then turned up twenty minutes later to find that the place had been "rented" already.

The only thing necessary for the persistence of evil is for enough good people to do nothing

by deviousdiva (thedeviousdiva@gmail.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 05:23:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 2)

Sorry, I was attempting wit! Obviously it failed. It is a well-known fact that Greece doesn't abide by many European laws. People just raise their eyebrows and say something like "you're in Greece now" It doesn't translate too well into English. But it's a kind of sarcastic witty retort when someone points out the wrongs of this place.

I'm sorry you misunderstood what I meant, poemless.

The only thing necessary for the persistence of evil is for enough good people to do nothing

by deviousdiva (thedeviousdiva@gmail.com) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 05:18:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

To turn all of this perversely on its head... here, in the "better" neighborhoods especially, one often finds landlords who will only rent to foreigners. The apartments are advertised that way: two bedroom flat, new law, for rent to foreigners.

Of course, they don't mean all foreigners. Sudanese need not apply. And Iraqis used to be "ok," but not so much anymore.

Seriously. I have friends who have been unable to find apartments in certain neighborhoods. This is their country, and yet it's not....

by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 05:20:42 PM EST

Re: Heart (4.00 / 5)

At the end of the day I think it comes down to "I only want to rent to clean people with money who will pay their rent and wont drag their criminal element friends into the area" and then resorting to stereotypes to figure out who fits that description.

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 05:34:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (none / 1)

Strength to you! to get through this process. Remember you are dealing with ignorant shits and use creative contract re-writing skills, negotiation and well crafted clauses to get a good end result. Your humor may be an invaluable skill now!

In Spain, I will never use a housing agency again because they are unregulated and proudly "represent" and charge both sides of the same deal.

Good luck.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. --Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 07:49:10 PM EST

Re: Heart (none / 1)

Well...let's face it. There will be always some kind of racism everywhere you look. I am white (or as they call us "white-olive" just to make distinction between them who are "white -white" and us , I suppose) and I experienced a lot of racism my self, here "over - seas" in societies that are made of immigrants of all sorts ...and that looks absurd...
When we first came to NZ we did not even know about public housing (the way it is in a capitalist country) and we obviously had to rent place to live straight away before we found jobs. So we headed to a real estate agency asking for private properties to rent. Later when we found out what it is "public housing" we of course decided we wouldn't put our children through that kind of experience even if we had to go back on Balkan and put them in the middle of the battle in Balkan wars (metaphorically speaking).When we decided what house we would rent ( and I was desperate cause this was so much worse then where we lived in Belgrade) agent came to me with " Landlord is not willing to rent to you cause he is afraid how you are going to pay rent being on the DOL (welfare)". Well I said to her: "It's not his business how we are going to pay, we are adults and responsible people and it's totally our business". Landlord decided to try us and never regretted. Not only that he had no any problems with us but for almost 4 years he was a free of any worries about property. Never paid a cent for it and it was cared like it was our own. They used to invite us for dinner to their home very often to say "thank you". In 1994 to 1996 there were a lot of people from Serbia that came to NZ (and also a lot of them went to Canada being second country that opened door a little bit for us). Do not make mistake we were NOT refugees and we had to go through "skilled people" point category. There was no shortage of skilled people from Serbia applying but the biggest obstacle was English language. New Zealand and Canada decided to turn blind eye a little bit and that's how we end up there. Europe was practically closed for us and even those (mostly younger) Serbs that managed to reach Europe were destined to "wash dishes" no matter how educated they were. It wasn't good enough for us because we were mostly close to our 40 and mostly family people with children.
As more and more people were coming to NZ I have been helping them to settle, find property to rent, find schools for their children etc. I did it NOT for money or anything but simply cause I had a little bit more time on my hands and wanted to help knowing how hard it is when you land in a foreign country with huge luggage and kids, not knowing anything about life there and what to expect and no one is waiting for you on airport. To make long story short after awhile when some landlord would ask property agent on the phone: " I am worrying, those Serbs what they are like as tenants?"
I witnessed many times when agent would answer "You don't have to worry a bit! They are perfect tenants". Later when ever Serbs were leaving cause they all bought their own properties as they started to work , landlords would ask them if they know someone from their community that needs to rent and asked them to recommend their property ". So it's all about experiences.
Looking at this society around me now I would say that lately at least here racism (if you want to call this discrimination racism) is not that much about color of the skin. It is much more about wealth! You can see rich people of all sorts of skin color, living happily next to each other, playing golf etc in their properties with security gates and guard. They may not love each other but they'll rather have someone "colored" having similar to their wealth and life style close to them then some "white trash" near them. And who can blame them?
I don't feel comfortable in the society that is so sharply divided (even territorially) because in Serbia all though we always had classes (as contrary as one may assume because of the communism) but it was not that visible. But I am learning and "assimilating" here, ha-ha. So now I am homeowner and landlord too (not that I was not both when was living in Serbia). When I had to rent my apartment I found my self discriminating against all sorts of people (of all sorts of skin and life circumstances).I was in a position to chose between many and it's incredible how it was easy to discriminate...In the end I chose black guy, Indian and for almost a year did not regret it. Some of those that I had to reject (single mothers with no job or some casual job, people in the middle of divorce with visiting children teenagers and mad spouses, very white boys with tattoos all over their bodies and friends that look like drug dealers etc)and that would quite possible often bring police on the door of my apartment, well those people may cursed me after I rejected them saying: " That discriminatory bitch...bla bla bla"...But I have to think of my interest first.
It's just like that all over the world ...get over it! Do not take it personally. This world is not perfect. In NZ being openly discriminatory is an offence as I understand but it will not stop people cover it in sugar.
Talking about racism...Now when I think of it 25 years ago it was enough not to be blonde in Sweden and to be called "bloody foreigner"...I am not sure where Sweden stands today with next generation of Turks, Greeks , Italian , ex YUs...Is it still that blond? I'll check again in 2008 or 2009 when I plan to visit Sweden again.
USA is an interesting experiment nowadays ...I can see practically "new races" there that are nothing of what we know scientifically...

by vbo on Thu Feb 22nd, 2007 at 10:00:55 PM EST

Re: Heart (none / 1)

Now, I am NOT saying that she was racist. What I am trying to explain is what racism FEELS like. It's that awareness of hesitations when people meet you for the first time.

But from what you describe, you experienced the slight hesitation of someone who, outside the world she knows, has to go by other rules to judge you - which she must do anyway if she is to rent you her property.

Those other rules, she'll have to find them in real time, while you are there, and that can't be easy.

Am I a racist if I say it's a lot easier for me to judge someone who was raised/educated in the same environment as me, rather than someone who comes from another world, with a set of values, rules of behavior, I dont know about ?
Let's not be too naive. I understand that loud single violent thump of your heart. And I understand the little lady.

by balbuz on Fri Feb 23rd, 2007 at 04:01:08 AM EST

Re: Heart (4.00 / 3)

I understand what you are saying, balbuz. It cannot be easy to rent your house out to strangers and that people make judgements in those situations based on appearance.

What I was trying to get across is a feeling that people of colour experience ALL the time. Not just in house-seeking but in social circles, in the supermarket, on the bus, at work, at school etc. Everyday. It's a lifetime of those hesitations that is the feeling of racism rather than what racism is by definition. I am not sure if I put that feeling across successfully but I was interested by the stark contrast between those who recognised it instantly (generally people of colour) and those that didn't.

I say this respectfully because it is impossible to really feel what someone else feels. I just feel that many discussions (not here necessarily) focus on whether someone is racist or not and not on the lives and feelings of those who live it.

Maybe this is another series for me?!

The only thing necessary for the persistence of evil is for enough good people to do nothing

by deviousdiva (thedeviousdiva@gmail.com) on Fri Feb 23rd, 2007 at 06:15:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (none / 0)

I have been at various times in strange places, where people would stare at me, appraising me, head to feet, obviously without a clue as to who was this unusual person in front of them. I was outside their frame of reference, and they were trying to figure out who, what, how.
It never put me ill at ease, I'd just let them take their time and would try to engage them.

As to experiencing racism, I have, and I am white...

by balbuz on Fri Feb 23rd, 2007 at 08:35:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heart (none / 1)

I know it's not actually funny but it's not always that bad. I remember some of our men while working as taxi drivers in NZ ( being mostly doctors trying to verify their diplomas , or pilots , mostly military pilots , or people who had trouble with English etc) facing situation where some crook or criminal wouldn't pay for drive ,they came to an idea to introduce themselves as " Bosnian Serbs". Never had any problem with payments after that, ha-ha. Even bad reputation can be of some help sometimes...

by vbo on Fri Feb 23rd, 2007 at 07:23:48 AM EST

Heart | 24 comments (24 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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