Saturday Open Thread

by In Wales
Sat May 10th, 2008 at 12:19:50 PM EST

Here it is!


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Has meta reached any conclusions ?

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 12:45:18 PM EST
Still chewing on different things.

Ad astra per aspera
by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 01:26:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Was I supposed to?  Nobody told me... I´m working on it anyway.

_Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. --Charu Saxena._
by metavision on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:48:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
... meta TALKTION


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:39:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Damned hot, but I was up late after dragging Metatone around some disappointingly crap pubs. My excuse is that it was Friday night which is a bad time to be out drinking in london. But I was distraught that my fallback pub that I could rely upon on a friday to be reasonable had obviously changed hands and had been changed, and not for the better {sigh}.

Still it gave me a chance to show M the shrine to Jean chalres de Menezes at Stockwell tube, still getting a lot of flowers.

But I've now got a headache from being out in the sun (and background hangover) so I may have a kip soon.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 12:48:55 PM EST
Only Saturday.  Still one day off to go.

Where's your motherf*%&ing flag pin?
by Drew J Jones (blahblahblah@blahblahblah.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 12:50:26 PM EST
Does anyone know of a Scoop-friendly WYSIWYG word processor with an integrated Modeling or flowchart graphics package?   If that first was oriented toward either Fuzzy Cognitive Maps or Neural Nets all the better.

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.
by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 01:55:37 PM EST
I know of an agriculture topic in the Debates Box and a probably incomplete Agri-TOC in the Occasional Series box, click on over and WYS will be WYG ;)

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:51:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I know.  WIS is a WBOCTIWLTRTWWAGW¹

I write very s. l. o. w. l. y. and it would be nice, since a chart is worth 1,000 words, to post a chart to quicken the process.

¹ Whole Bunch Of Comments I Would Like To Respond To Without Writing A Gazillion Words.

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:06:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
:-)

Only Scoop-friendly way I know is make an image of the chart and post as jpeg, but I could be wrong!

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:13:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I can get from Word to HTML perfectly fine.  Going from HTML to Scoop is impossible.

Or, at least, I haven't figured-out/discovered the right dongles.

(In the interest of maintaining ET as a Family Blog profanity has been elided.)

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:23:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
HTML to Scoop is a nightmare. Though first (need I say? surely not) you need to be sure HTML Formatted is turned on. Even then...

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:35:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I got to HTML just fine.  When I tried to upload it to Scoop it rewarded me with about 26 error messages.  One half saying Scoop didn't understand and the other half saying I needed to put in an ending tag for what it didn't understand.

(g-----n Scoop)

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:03:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yep, that's the problem when you feed Scoop HTML generated elsewhere.

However, Scoop accepts comments without too much hassle. Just a handful of them in that debate, pretty please?

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 03:02:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, we can give you the subset of allowed HTML, or expand it as needed.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:07:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The thing has achieved the status of more time required than time available.  (I'm supposed to be working on a critique of Cantor's Diagonal Argument - ick.  On the other hand, Avoidance is a Fine Art & one needs to practice. :)  'Fraid the whole thing has got to go on the back-burner for a couple of weeks.

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.
by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:26:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What are you trying to do?

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:59:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Attempting to construct a 'Scoop-able' Cognitive Map with Neural-Net flow & decision points.

The idea is to collapse 30,000 words into something comprehensible.  (Thus avoiding, "Transient response in a Axon-Hillock circuit leads to asymmetrical arrival of parallel and model-equal inputs resulting in ..." &  etc.)  

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:19:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Another empty OT.

Question : Does anyone know if male or female feet have different shapes ? I have real problems with wearing women's shoes, they don't fit properly, unless it's strapped on, they fall off. Slingbacks don't stay on.

Very frustrating. And the blisters......I am a martyr to them.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:05:03 PM EST
It seems that they do. GENDER DIFFERENCES IN FOOT SHAPE from Germany has some details.
The findings of this study demonstrate differences between gender regarding important anatomical measurements of the  foot. Women have narrower feet in the heel and forefoot region and their instep height is also lower than in men. For these  measures, lasts for women's shoes cannot only be a downscaled version of those for men's shoes. For the same given shoe  size, women need narrower shoes with a smaller instep height in comparison to men.
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:49:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Another empty OT.

Cor blimey, the Ghost of OT Past!

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:05:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Always the same on Saturdays.
by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:10:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]
All the cool kids are hanging out at other places than computerscreens, doing infinitesimal more interesting things.

Like, scrabble. And we won again, go team!

Sigh.

"What did you do during your time in Johannesburg?"
"Play scrabble and boast about it on-line."

And I'm supposed to be the old one in this house... What is it with these young dogs? I feel like DoDo now.

I'm going to stick my rubber ducks to the ceiling again. They came off.

Oh woe.

</talking to myself>

The core of evil is a lack of empathy

by Nomad on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 07:58:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Meh, we're the cool kids.  Everybody else is just jealous.

Where's your motherf*%&ing flag pin?
by Drew J Jones (blahblahblah@blahblahblah.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 08:36:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
i wondered when ET was going to get a euro equivalent of chingchongchinaman's 'saturday night losers' club' on dkos!

There are no blank spots on the map any more, anywhere on earth. You want a blank spot on the map, you gotta leave the map behind. Jon Krakauer
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 09:40:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What I'd bet on is that even if they are supposed to be similar, growing up wearing boy or girl shoes - which are probably of different shapes - will differentially impact the feet. Feet are quite malleable (see the extreme small feet of some Chinese women a few centuries ago), and if you adapted them to what is considered a "male" shape by shoemakers, it's going to be hard to change them to a "female" shape.

Auferre, trucidare, rapere, falsis nominibus imperium; atque, ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 08:30:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
i think it would be a lot easier the other way round, not that that helps helen much...

you'll have to start a new chick fashion for 'sensible brogues' or something. (don't we have special regular diaries for this here?

helen i bet massage would help. or maybe bovver boots. maybe they're not in style for women any more...they sure were last time i was blighty-side.

my poor mother had amazingly deformed feet from high heels and shoes with winkle-picker front-ends.

they're coming back in italy, murderous looking things they are too.

There are no blank spots on the map any more, anywhere on earth. You want a blank spot on the map, you gotta leave the map behind. Jon Krakauer

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 09:46:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's raining!!!!!!

it's raining!!!!!

at long last... water in Barcelona!!!

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:37:53 PM EST
Hmmh, I generally don't feel that way about rain, but then I've spent my entire life in wet climates, and my current city also has a water system with a large amount of excess capacity (back in the last serious regional drought at the turn of the century - a couple years with way below average rain - those suburbs not hooked up to NYC's water system were in serious trouble; NYC authorities - if this continues for another couple years we'll be in serious trouble)
by MarekNYC on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:45:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Oh marek.. the reason I am happy it is because we have water restrictions right now in Barcelona.. and we were going to get water from ships and special convoys in the next weeks trying to avoid restriction in drinking water. They will be unavoidable in six months if it does not start raining a lot.

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:44:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Heh, three drops (as they say round here) fell this morning on this side of the Pirineos, but what a big wind from off the sea! Stormy weather forecast for later, that might bring you some more rain, but I'm not sure of that (meaning that you will get rain from it).

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:55:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This blog-aggregator Stormy posted on Thursday led me to The Blacksmiths of Lebanon where I found:

News sources in Lebanon are reporting a statement issued by Army Command calling for the withdrawal of all armed elements from the street. The Army's statement also declared the establishment of an internal probe into the airport security affair, without the removal [as yet] of Brigadier General Wafik Shoukair as head of airport security; and the establishment of its own study into the Hizballah communication network, along lines that "would not harm the resistance's integrity and security".

Future Movement leader, Saad Hariri, and Walid Jumblatt, leader of the Progressive Socialist Party, have outlined their acceptance of the Army's statement in conjunction with their previous calls that the Army assume control of the capital and that it takeover the issues of airport security and Hizballah's communications network as brought up earlier this week by the government.

<snip>

Lebanon's Prime Minister, Fouad Siniora, addressed the nation earlier in the day and declared that the country had entered a new era in which the issue of Hizballah's weapons must lead the way as the topic of dialogue ahead of wider negotiations on the re-drafting of a new [or amended] political system. The PM declared that appropriate conditions must be established through a transitional period in which:

   1. The Army would take over all matters of national security - including the withdrawal of militants from the streets; the Army's assumption of duties pertaining to the issue of airport security and Hizballah's communications network;

   2. The immediate election of a consensus President and the subsequent formation of a national unity government "in which neither party can force its beliefs".

   3. The deliberation of a new Parliamentary electoral law - in Parliament!

   4. And a "gentlemen's agreement" to abide by a code of media ethics

After the above, a blogger on Gutter Poetry Arab Sphere posted earlier (time stamped 3:51 PM)

This morning I woke up feeling optimistic: It was a beautiful sunny day, there hadn't been any notable gunfire/rpgs for quite a while, and I saw people bustling about the streets.

but that changed as (time stamped 6:01 PM):

People have once more shut themselves indoors following a gun attack on mourners attending the funeral of a pro-government supporter killed in earlier violence.

From what I can gather, the crises was initiated by the Prime Minister attempting to close down Hizbullah's communication network(s).  Since that was one of, if not THE, major contributing factor to Hizbullah's victory in the last Israeli invasion they weren't about to give it up.  

And things spiraled downward into armed urban combat.

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:42:46 PM EST
Blog in a Blog at the Big Orange:
Burning the Midnight Oil for the Economics of Freedom

Midnight Thought excerpts:
Midnight Thought on the Economics of Freedom (9 May 08) (Docudharma)
Midnight Thought on the Economics of Freedom (9 May 08) (EENR)

And of course, always the star of the show:


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:46:14 PM EST
These kids thought I was a BBC correspondent.

Photobucket

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:47:46 PM EST
K and I were talking on the patio tonight (yes, wine and beer were part of the equation), and we decided we would have a C List party at home in the late summer/early autumn.

We know a few A's (none of whom we have really socialized with much), quite a lot of B's (with whom we have socialized plenty) and an embarrassing number of C's. D, E, F and G's are two a cent in Finland. Z's you can scrape up off the road. By A list, we mean people you have never heard of, but people who might in Finland be called ' Julkkis' or celebrities with nothing to celebrate.

We think it will succeed. The reason being that noone organizes parties for the over 30's. We've had a few and they have been great successes. Give youngish couples an excuse to dump the kids on the grandparents and they're ready to boogie. The owners of large local taxis are just begging us to organize more of these events. The owner of the karaoke taxi is even more enthused.

What we mostly discussed, of course, is how to sell the event. A list people like to slum it - if it is fun. B lists want to be where the A lists are. C Lists will naturally feel comfortable. Everyone below C would like to move up.

We would also invite the stringer for the West Newland local newspaper. We will have life support systems available - the shock could be life threatening.

The point is, of course, that all are human 100%. We'd like to break down the barriers...

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:52:56 PM EST
ET celebrities would be welcome ;-) And you all are celebrities.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:54:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I thought "celebrity" was an STD.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:57:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That's "life" you're thinking of.
by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:01:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That, too.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 04:47:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Not STD, LBD - Learned Behaviour Disorder or MTD - Mentally Transmitted Disease ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:49:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I was talking to my partner on the NLUS project and he agreed a move to Helsinki would be a possibility and a rather good idea, actually.

What status would political refugees achieve?  

:-)

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:07:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Welcome! I'll hook you up with VTT and a sauna, and you'll be quids in ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:40:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]
By the way..

I am going to Helsinki probably first week of August...

And could you explain what a C list party home is? Thi is culturally alien to me.. really...:)

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:47:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You will be most welcome. You are on no list - and that is your advantage. Don't tell the Man from Lyons, because he will be jealous, but I will arrange some mythological blondes to meet you at Seutala and transport you to a place nearby that will turn you into the opposite of whatever you are: ie from genius to idiot or vice versa.

A C list party, ostensibly, is a place for celebrities with nothing to celebrate. Or cerebrate,  if you will.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:57:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Seriously. I expect you to inform me as to your arrival and program. I look forward to introducing you to my friends as 'Manual' - He's from Barthelona'.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:01:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Sure.. if the trip is confirmed, for sure you will know.

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:13:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hey!  Wait a minute!

kcurie gets "mythological blondes" and all I get is a research institute and a sauna?

(Darn physicists get ALL the perks.)

Have epistemological model of Complex Information environments. Will Travel.

by ATinNM on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:15:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But the research institute and sauna are real. Isn't that what you're after?

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:58:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I would have no reason to be jealous: the Great Ventriloquist came in person to pick me up at the airport...

By the way, do you still plan to come to France this summer? If so, could you let me know when? I'll be delighted to welcome you and your daughters and make them meet mine...


"Ne te courbe que pour aimer..." René Char

by Melanchthon on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 10:00:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Mon ami, Frida has just been accepted to a term-long course in Aix-en-Provence starting in September. I shall be visiting at some point ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Thu May 15th, 2008 at 04:02:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Great! I was holding a conference in Aubagne today and I gather I'm going to work regularly in the Provence-Alpes-Côte d'Azur region in the following year.

BTW, my ex-companion was born in Aix-en-Provence, so my daughters have family there.

"Ne te courbe que pour aimer..." René Char

by Melanchthon on Thu May 15th, 2008 at 06:14:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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