European Tribune - Community, Politics & Progress.

Euro Trends: Music (Week 1)

by Metatone
Sat May 10th, 2008 at 02:46:45 PM EST

In the meta thread, Ephemera said:

Things I would like to see are diaries about social/cultural/political trends that are occuring not just in one country, but across Europe. Diaries about the emerging 'European space', as it were, above the national, but below the global.

linca said:

Is there knowledge about EU-wide trends in sociology/culture ? I read a bit of sociology, but pretty much all of it is France-centered. There are EU-wide stats, but stats don't make political and social analysis all by themselves.
The advantage of ET is that each could bring knowledge about his own country ; and that sometimes happen in some diaries. But is that enough to identify EU-wide trends ?

Now in serious questions of sociology and culture we don't have many resources. But if ET is a building block of a future European public sphere then popular culture is important too.

Now there is an existing "Eurochart" of popular music:

Eurochart Hot 100 Singles - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The first Eurochart began as the "Europarade", which was started in early 1976 by TROS Radio in the Netherlands. The chart consisted of only six countries (the UK, France, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium and Spain). The compilers collected the top 15 records from each country and then awarded corresponding points, depending which positions between 1 and 15 each record stood at. Italy and Denmark wered added in 1979 and during 1980, Austria and Switzerland were included. Ireland was added as the 11th country in October 1983.
In March 1984, Music & Media in Amsterdam started their own Eurochart, "The Eurochart Hot 100", which they published as a Euro Tip sheet for the first two years. This chart was accumulated by taking the chart positions in each country combined with the national sales percentage of records in that particular country. In 1986-87, the official Eurochart also became a music TV show on Music Box with Dutch presenter. Erik de Zwart.
The Eurochart quickly gained momentum, as it started to include more countries and Music & Media became a Billboard publication in January 1986. From 1982 to 1986 the "Europarade", as published in Music Week and the Dutch magazine Hitkrant, was used.
Since November 1986, the Music & Media's Eurochart Top 100 was used as source, as Billboard started publishing European Hot 100 Singles chart until today.

My issue with the aggregation is that it destroys the diversity:

Europe Music Charts - Top Singles

PLTitle / Artist
1 - "4 Minutes" Madonna feat. Justin Timberlake

2 - "Mercy" Duffy

3 - "American Boy" Estelle feat. Kayne West

4 - "Tired Of Being Sorry" Enrique Iglesias

5 - "Black & Gold" Sam Sparro

6 - "Bleeding Love" Leona Lewis

7 - "Low" Flo Rida feat. T-Pain

8 - "Valerie" Mark Ronson feat. Amy Winehouse

9 - "Wearing My Rolex" Wiley

10 - "C'est Chelou" Zaho

So my idea is that every week we could make a thread where we post the top 10 from the countries we know. I don't know if it will show us something more than the Billboard chart, but I hope so.

Another idea is that along with the text of the chart, you could embed a Youtube link to one song that you like or find interesting. It would be nice if it was one from the Top 10, but other notable current songs are eligible too. I'd ask you to keep it to one per country, else the thread will be very hard to load for some. I chose the singles chart because often the album charts are less interesting to follow week by week.

So what do people think? I guess we'll find out by participation.

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Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) | 50 comments (50 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

UK Top 10 (4.00 / 4)

UK Music Charts | The Official UK Top 75 Singles: Week of Mon 05 May - Yahoo! Music UK

THIS
WEEK
LAST
WEEK
ARTIST
SONG
SHOPPING
1
1
MADONNA FT JUSTIN TIMBERLAKE
4 MINUTES
2
2
SAM SPARRO
BLACK & GOLD
3
4
WILEY
WEARING MY ROLEX
4
7
USHER FT YOUNG JEEZY
LOVE IN THIS CLUB
5
3
ESTELLE FT KANYE WEST
AMERICAN BOY
6
5
SEPTEMBER
CRY FOR YOU
7
6
FLO RIDA FT T-PAIN
LOW
8
8
WILL I AM FT CHERYL COLE
HEARTBREAKER
9
16
PENDULUM
PROPANE NIGHTMARES
10
10
SCOUTING FOR GIRLS
HEARTBEAT

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 02:48:48 PM EST

Re: UK Top 10 (4.00 / 2)

I know the top American R&B/Hip-hop stars and the chart leaders (whatta crap run-of-the-mill return from the now and then great Madonna, IMO), and Scouting For Girls - anything you find notable from among the rest?

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:12:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: UK Top 10 (none / 1)

I'm hugely out of touch with the charts!

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:26:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Wishlist (none / 1)

Don't know if this made it on the UK chart:

The Duke Spirit: The Step And The Walk (03:22):

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:25:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: UK Top 10 (none / 1)

Almost forgot about that new pendulum album.

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:17:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Top 10 Hungary (4.00 / 3)

Well, nothing much spectacular here...

mahasz.hu - Slágerlisták

No. M H CS Előadó - Dal címe Kiadó
1 1 4 1 ÁKOS
Negyven
M, O Fehér Sólyom/Warner
2 2 58 1 ÁKOS
Minden most kezdődik el
F, M Fehér Sólyom/Warner
3 re 11 3 ERICK MORILLO feat. P. DIDDY
Dance I Said
F, M lightmedia
4 6 5 4 JOSH ÉS JUTTA
Olyan más most az éj
M Josh Music/Private Moon/EMI
5 5 13 3 CRYSTAL
Elmegyek
M, O EMI
6 új 1 6 KOVÁCS KATI
Úgy szeretném meghálálni
O Hungaroton
7 4 20 2 SHANE 54 & DJ JUNIOR feat. MICHELLE WILD
69
M Laptop DJ
8 8 4 8 KASZA TIBOR
Akarod-e mondd
M, O EMI
9 9 9 4 GROOVEHOUSE
Mit ér neked?
M, O Private Moon/EMI
10 3 17 1 JOSH ÉS JUTTA
Zakatol a szívem
M, O Josh Music/Private Moon/EMI

M - last week's placement
H - weeks in total
CS - highest position on list

F - single can be bought in physical form
O - single can be downloaded

Ákos is the one who can be half-way called an artist: he started out with a Hungarian copy of Depeche Mode, then went solo and went in commercialised-mystic directions. But I don't think highly of his voice especially.

Kati Kovács is an oldie, she's a singer from the sixties.

Michelle Wild is a Hungarian porn star.

The rest are either imports or test tube babies (& boys) of the worst variety; they are trying to appear like Western test tube babies of the music industry.

So nothing much play-able here. I note that the numbers singles can be sold reduced drastically, to a level at which producers can easily manipulate charts... and I do suspect that whatever my low opinion of present-day Budapest &environs mainstream youth musical taste (techno-dance-talent show pop and a bit of hip-hop), these charts don't even reflect that.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:08:13 PM EST

Re: Top 10 Hungary (none / 1)

Who are Private Moon?

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:30:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Top 10 Hungary (none / 1)

Sorry for not translating the column headers - it's a record label.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:49:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Top 10 Hungary (none / 1)

Any relation to these people?

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:56:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Top 10 Hungary (4.00 / 2)

No; the full name is Private Moon Records (in apparent New Hungarian). It was founded by one of these neo-pop clones, late nineties sortiment, who actually had a recognizable voice.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:17:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Top 10 Hungary (none / 1)

I thought long what to compensate the above with, but my prime candidate is very much language-based. The busic of hip-hop band Bëlga is nothing special, but their lyrics are kick-ass. Here is the only song where some of the band's attitude comes across even if you don't speak Hungarian - which also happens one of their only two political songs, being a brutal spoof on the far-right. (Their normal work usually tries the outer reaches of what doesn't pass the print - or it is modernised tales for children, rather strange combination aint' it.)

Bëlga: Magyar Nemzeti Hip-Hop-ot! ( = let there be Hungarian national hip-hop!) (05:12):

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:49:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 5)

YLE chart - largely meaningless. a) this weeks position. b) last week's position. c) weeks on chart. Meaningless because there are so many alternative metrics now: most listened to, most bought, most played. most downloaded etc

1 1 5 "4 Minutes" Madonna Feat Justin Timberlake

2 2 7 "Unstoppable" Mariko

3 5 8 "Mercy" Duffy

4 6 17 "Mun Koti Ei Oo Täällä" Chisu

5 4 8 "Work" Kelly Rowland

6 7 9 "Missä Miehet Ratsastaa" Teräsbetoni

7 14 5 "Crushcrushcrush" Paramore

8 10 4 "Break The Ice" Britney Spears

9 12 27 "Pauhaava Sydän" Lauri TÄhkÄ & Elonkerjuu

10 8 5 "Scream" Timbaland Fet. Keri Hilson & Nicole Scherzinger

11 - 1 "Lion Tamer Vs Tigers" Echo Is Your Love

12 19 2 "Mutta Mä Rakastan Sua" Tiktak

13 RE 4 "Homecoming" Kanye West

14 20 2 "Better In Time" Leona Lewis

15 - 1 "You Got The Light" Beats And Styles Feat. Elastinen
16 - 1 "Liekeissä" Cheek

17 15 16 "Piece Of Me" Britney Spears

18 - 1 "Hero" Charlotte Perrelli

19 - 1 "Too Fortunate To Cry" Matthau Mikojan

20 RE 3 "Korkokengät" Stella

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 03:39:41 PM EST

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 1)

I like it, I think it is a great idea - especially if people can give opinions on the charts or once we get into it, to discuss the contrasts.

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:25:15 PM EST

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 5)

Hmm, Scouting for Girls and Amy Winehouse are probably the only ones of those which I could imagine myself listening to. Many of the rest seem to be RnB clones, and most sung in English. Looking through the Billboard chart, you can see some French and German songs, but they tend to appear further down. Of course, all of the music is 'commercial' in the broadest sense, but a lot is very obviously commercial in the way that even the consumers (typically young) would be able to identify it as such.*

Peculiar problems with the European chart would seem to be that: a) for a song to appear it has to sell well in more than one state, or heavily in a large state, b) only the largest media companies can afford and manage the simultaneous promotion and distribution that needs, not to mention the costs if it fails, and c) other than English, what language will be accepted by non-native speakers? I notice the Finnish chart has lots of English songs, but the Hungarian chart does not, can you guess which songs also might show up in Greece and Spain and Denmark? You can bet it ain't Akos. (PS I think Lombroso would have had something to say about those men on the Crystal website.)

With a genre like dance music though, you can get around the language problem, and also somewhat the distribution problem too. I know that there is a far greater sharing and mixture of music in that area, with a greater sense of a pan-European 'scene'. My brother lives in Leeds, but visits Barcelona and Berlin for music, yet he doesn't expect to hear anything radically different to what he already knows! I also understand that in the US, the other half of the 'Western' media market, this kind of music is thought of as specifically European.

*The often repeated idea that popular music today is manufactured is true, but probably no less true than it has been for some decades, the difference now is that there is little or no attempt to dissemble.

Member of the Anti-Fabulousness League since 1987.

by Ephemera on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 04:44:07 PM EST

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 1)

My brother lives in Leeds, but visits Barcelona and Berlin for music, yet he doesn't expect to hear anything radically different to what he already knows!

There's a way that the different centres play the same music--and then there's the way that many different flavours can have that underlying 'dance' beat that makes them--easy to dance to and so--maybe--it's easier to enjoy all the different sounds over the top.

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 05:27:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 1)

True. Techno/Dance music is definitely the most pan-European (and it is very European, the one modern music definitely not US-inspired). Only, so rarely do I like some of it... (but, interestringly, if yes, it's almost always British or French - so there are strill local schools.)

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sat May 10th, 2008 at 06:11:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

DoDo:

True. Techno/Dance music is definitely the most pan-European (and it is very European, the one modern music definitely not US-inspired). Only, so rarely do I like some of it... (but, interestringly, if yes, it's almost always British or French - so there are strill local schools.)

It started in Detroit!

What you seem to be thinking of is this?

Though even that has its American influences:

Eurodance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

History
Original Eurodance is a fusion of several styles of dance music, primarily house and rap with the Hi-NRG variant of disco music.
Hi-NRG and Italo-Disco
Hi-NRG started in the United States as an underground, faster form of disco after disco had lost mainstream popularity. In the late 1980s it became associated with British record producers Stock, Aitken and Waterman, and by the early 1990s bands such as Masterboy were producing a Continental version of Hi-NRG.
Eurodance shows a strong Hi-NRG influence, such as the high BPM and the strong use of female vocals. The influence of Masterboy is readily seen in Eurodance music that does not feature a duet, such as It's My Life by Dr. Alban and What Is Love by Haddaway. Eurodance can also be seen as a more technologically advanced form of Euro disco, just as Hi-NRG is the more technologically advanced form of Disco.
Italo Disco and its later evolution, Eurobeat, are sometimes thought to be sub-genres of Eurodance, but rather they are offshoots of Hi-NRG. Italo was influential on the production of Eurodance in general, while Italian-produced Eurodance artists, such as Alexia, Cappella, CO.RO, and Double You, tended to preserve features such as operatic female vocals. Later artists such as Eiffel 65 adopted a sort of "marching" beat in their productions. The term "Eurobeat" appears to be more common in Japan, where this style of music is featured in the video game Dance Dance Revolution, as well as in some Anime soundtracks, for example the street racing scenes in Initial D.
House music
House music, also an underground genre in the United States, had come to the UK and continental Europe with the rise of acid house and "rave" techno in the late 1980s. By the early 1990s, with the rise of the Belgian New Beat, house then became associated with Belgium and the Netherlands.
Some of the first songs with elements of what would later be called Eurodance are house music. For example, Strike It Up by Black Box (1990) and Rhythm is a Dancer by Snap! (1992) both have the duet characteristic of Eurodance, and Everybody's Free (To Feel Good) by Rozalla (1991) has the characteristic synthesizer riff.
Of course, not all European house music was absorbed into the Eurodance genre. By the early 2000s, it remained a style distinct from Eurodance with harder synth and a slower tempo, for example Satisfaction by Benny Benassi (2003).

Hi-NRG in turn is influenced mostly by Giorgio Moroder, so there's a transatlantic cross-pollenisation. There's still Hi-NRGish stuff being made in the USA, lately a lot by RnB artists ('Please Don't Stop the Music' by Rihanna, 'Yeah' by Usher, 'Lose My Breath' by Destiny's Child, 'The Way I Are' by Timbaland).

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 07:58:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 1)

It's symbolic of the cross-pollinisation that Rihanna is from London, did ok here, but absolutely found fame over in the US scene.

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 08:49:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

It started in Detroit!

Hmmmm... lots of cross-pollination there, but from the German Techno - Wikipedia article:

In Europa wurde der Begriff ,,Techno" zum ersten mal im Jahre 1982 von Andreas Tomalla (alias Talla 2XLC) verwendet. Der Frankfurter Musikliebhaber arbeitete Anfang der 1980er in einem Plattenladen unter dem Frankfurter Hauptbahnhof. Dort sortierte er Schallplatten mit elektronisch produzierter Musik in eine eigenständige Kategorie und benannte diese mit ,,Techno".
Die damit entstandene Sammelbezeichnung umfasste anfangs Strömungen wie die deutsche Avantgarde (Kraftwerk), Elektronische Popmusik (Depeche Mode), EBM (Front 242, Nitzer Ebb), Industrial (Cabaret Voltaire, Clock DVA, Throbbing Gristle) und generell elektronisch arrangierte Spielarten der New Wave-Epoche (siehe Electro Wave), aber auch den Detroit Techno (A Number Of Names, Cybotron), der stark durch europäische Musikrichtungen geprägt wurde. In dieser Form konnte sich ,,Techno" als Dachbegriff für elektronische Musik international - und vorzugsweise im deutschen Sprachraum - bis in den Beginn der 1990er Jahre weiträumig etablieren.

I submit that there was back-pollination from Detroit Techno - as well as House/Acid House, which I find was developed in Chicago; and which arrived in Frankfurt when I was ending my second schoolyear there.

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:12:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 4)

Techno is an urban remix of Kraftwerk having sex with New Order while Georgio Moroder takes abstract photos.

House would be the style that's more indigenous to the US. Europe never quite got the funk vibe which seems to be the backdrop of most US pop.

One offshoot of Eurobeat eventually turned into Trance, which - I think - has very much more of a Euro feel than a US one.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:28:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 0)

Now that you mention Trance, to nanne: I used "techno/dance" as a broad umbrella term for electronic music with strong beats (I include everyone from Paul van Dyk, Scooter, Robet Miles, Underworld, Loona to ), whose fans use these and a variety of other names - with techno zene = "techno music" being the most widespread umbrella term in Hungarian, but I was less sure about elsewhere, sayh there's this:

Dance - Wikipedia

Meist wird mit Dance insbesondere im kontinentaleuropäischen Raum eine massentaugliche und kommerzielle Variante von Techno und House bezeichnet. Stilprägend ist eine eindeutige und einprägende Melodie, die von einem bassbetonten Beat im Viervierteltakt begleitet wird.

Thus Eurodance as described and as shown by your example is only part of it. (Also according to the above article.)

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:47:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

With dance music, the sub-genre breakdowns can get just a little extreme.

About the only thing you can say about is that there are probably synthesizers, and there are probably beats.

The rest just depends.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:59:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 1)

That's true, you get this language confusion. When Dutch people used to talk about 'house' back in the 90s they meant stuff like Capella and 2Unlimited. Which caused endless net discussions :-)

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 01:07:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 0)

2Unlimited

Whatever happened to them?

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 01:15:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 1)

They stopped making music! Jean-Paul DeCoster seems to have retired with his millions, Phil Wilde is still driving other dance acts (notably, Kate Ryan).

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 01:25:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

For wat it's worth... (none / 0)

The number one techno musician in Hungary seems to be one DJ Sterbinszky. Those who like techno decide if he's any worth - I myself get enough of any of his work after four beats...

DJ Sterbinszky: Just My Kind (04:13):

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 05:21:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

For the heck of it (none / 0)

Giorgio Moroder - Chase

Music starts at 01:34.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 03:41:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

as well as House/Acid House, which I find was developed in Chicago; and which arrived in Frankfurt

...from Britain (hence my assumed origin)

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:29:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

I have a question for everyone - how representative is Eurovision of popular music in your country - do the songs picked by the public align with the type of music that people are listening to in the charts?

Say over the last 2 or 3 years or so?

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 03:56:13 AM EST

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

Well that is part of what got me thinking about doing this diary.

For example, in recent years if the Eurovision process was still connected to UK popular music then, for example, the Arctic Monkeys or Kaiser Chiefs would have at least featured in the selection process.

Some countries have a much closer relationship between their local industry and the Eurovision stuff. The Swedish entry this year is a fairly established star trying to make a comeback.

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 04:26:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (none / 1)

There seems to be this unwritten rule that good bands and popular musicians in the UK aren't eligible for Eurovision. Just wannabes and has-beens end up in the selection process.

If they had a potentially record breaking song making them millions, why would they want to give that up for Eurovision? Who owns royalties etc from songs performed on Eurovision?

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 04:38:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 4)

In my understanding, traditionally, Eurovision has been representative of no real locally popular musical trend anywhere: music for Eurovision was special "festival music", produced just for the occasion. (In West Germany, there are some famous producers/composers who specialised in producing Eurovision pieces and discovering the appropiate one-hit-wonder for it.) Even establisheed stars would adapt to it with competition pieces, and the others would disappeare quickly even if they won the competition. ABBA being the one and only exception. This changed somewhat in recent years:

with the appearance of competitors trying to win attention with a different genre (and pulling youth of their genres to discover Eurovision as a party),
with the Eastward expansion of Eurovision, where locally established pop stars with more ambitious performances were put in the race (albeit still often with for-Eurovision 'festival music' songs),
with the spread of talent shows, whose style began to approach Eurovision at national levels.

I also see Britain and the Eurovision as an interesting special cultural phenomenon. IMO in no participating country is there more obsession with it. But that in a very schizophrenic way. It's the tension between looking down on the Continent and wanting to win. As (still) the dominant country in youth music, Britain would 'deserve' to win, even a craptacular second-class singer should be a hands-down best, ergo if s/he doesn't, the Continentals have no taste. So let's pretend to not take it seriously.

Still, lots of Britons will obsess about what would please the Eurovision viewer voting public. But when it's candidate selection time, the two attitudes collide, and out comes a third-rate singer who doesn't play any current British but an imagined Eurovision style. Then comes the competition, and everyone jokes around venomously with the lead of Terry Wogan, but secretly (or not so secretly) still cheers for the British candidate, will construct elaborate conspiracy theories about political voting (though by last year, I had to notice this spreading out East of Britain) and is immensely hurt by zero points.

I observed this process every year when I had BBC on cable television, and then saw the public/media reaction on news sites and discussion fora. Say, life will stop on the Guardian forums and dozens of users will state how much they don't care about the show, but Sweden ten points. It's funny (unlike Wogan when watched for a longer time, so I preferred the inanity of the German and Hungarian TV commenators), and a paradox reason I think Britain is very much part of Europe.

(On all the same topics, also see my 2006 and 2007 Eurovision diaries.)

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 05:42:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

I won't deny that people go crazy over Eurovision here, with parties and non stop discussion... but recently we keep picking SHIT entries. Really bloody awful ones. Groups who can't sing, stupid crappy songs, terrible personalities and styles, urgh. And everybody I know then goes around complaining about the chattering classes who waste their money voting on these things and pick the worst entry for us.

Frankly we aren't surprised when we don't get points because we were truly awful and deserved that. we do however comment on the political voting of some countries, who seem to have an alliance with their neighbours and of course after Blair and Iraq and all of that, no wonder Britain gets nil points, even with a shit song.

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 10:28:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 4)

You sound like you desperately want to win Eurovision at some point.

Member of the Anti-Fabulousness League since 1987.

by Ephemera on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 11:03:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

I just want us to have a semi decent song, that's all!
Is it too much to ask??!!

Ad astra per aspera

by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 11:07:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

I think that the rubbish songs the UK puts up, along with the measly collection of points is becoming a tradition. It was 2002 since we finished in a respectable position, and long before then when the songs were good. Actually, I can't ever remember the songs being good.

Member of the Anti-Fabulousness League since 1987.

by Ephemera on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 11:21:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

When I was on holiday last year, doing some very rare TV watching in my hotel room, there was a best-of summary of every Eurovision winner ever, in between acts competing for the Spanish entry.

Oooooh boy. I don't think it's gotten any worse over the years. But it doesn't seem to have gotten any better either.

Has the UK won since:

these people? (Who still seem to be going, more or less.)

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:41:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

Yup, Katrina and the Waves won it for the UK many years ago.

Member of the Anti-Fabulousness League since 1987.

by Ephemera on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:46:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

I vaguely remember that now.

I may have been confused by the fact that they were a proper band before they entered.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 01:00:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

but recently we keep picking SHIT entries

Then you proceed to give the explanation:

everybody I know then goes around complaining about the chattering classes who waste their money voting on these things and pick the worst entry for us.

That's a strange voting/not-voting behaviour, aint' it.

we do however comment on the political voting of some countries, who seem to have an alliance with their neighbours

I know. But that comes from taking "Song Contest" too seriously. The explanations are that (1) this is not a serious musical contest (it is more a family get-together and a party), (2) there are regionally popular tastes in music, (3) some competitors market themselves in other, culturally close countries (especially if language is shared) already before the Final, (4) some countries have large minorities connected to a neighouring one, representing an enhanced 'market' in the prior senses. (I find it notable that apparently, the British candidates aren't pre-marketed even in Ireland.)

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:25:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 3)

In Wales:

I have a question for everyone - how representative is Eurovision of popular music in your country - do the songs picked by the public align with the type of music that people are listening to in the charts?

No - not in the least. Eurovision is retro-pop.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 06:27:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 4)

The charts are largely determined by people in the 12-18 age segment. Eurovision in the Netherlands is big among middle-aged people and in the gay community. The disconnect is near-complete.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 06:30:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Heh (4.00 / 3)

I watched charts for a living once. Before and after that I had a kind of anti-chart attitude. But I'll try to get a diary up.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 06:36:37 AM EST

Re: Heh (4.00 / 2)

Well:

a) A diary would be cool, but just posting a chart in the thread would be cool too if it fits your schedule better.

b) I'm pretty anti-chart by nature, but it's easy information and so something we can maybe keep going over time. We have sporadic diaries and OTs about "what are you listening to" but in terms noticing any kind of European trends, this was the best I could come up with.

I'm very open to other suggestions!

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 08:53:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heh (none / 1)

Ah, you will put this up weekly?

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 10:37:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Heh (none / 1)

That was the basic idea.
I'm too busy to create decent content for the site, so I resort to "user participation theory."

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 11:23:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) (4.00 / 2)

I am not much into the music charts, but looked up the Hitparade for Switzerland.

It looks very much like the others except for nr. 8. I found a song by Gölä on you tube, though not the one on the chart. Well, if you want to hear what Swiss German sound like - this is it. :-)

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 11:51:49 AM EST

NL Top 10 (4.00 / 3)

In the Netherlands there are three different singles charts, the Top 40, the Top 50 and the Top 100. Aside of the length of the chart, the difference lies in how they sample and weigh their sales and airplay. The Top 100 does not include airplay, but does include downloads, which I think is fairest. So here's the current list:

1 1 2 Marco Borsato - Wit licht
2 2 6 Madonna & Justin - 4 Minutes
3 3 6 Amy MacDonald - This Is The Life
4 6 3 Gerard Joling - 24 uur verliefd
5 5 10 Duffy - Mercy
6 7 12 Ida Engberg - Disco Volante
7 4 4 Kane - Shot Of A Gun
8 10 4 Estelle feat. Kanye West - American Boy
9 8 9 Nick & Simon - Rosanne
10 NEW 1 Anouk - Modern World

Marco Borsato is probably one of the most popular Dutch artists of the last two decades (in the Netherlands). His schtick is to intone emotional urgency in otherwise bland lyrics. Singing-wise the song Wit Licht reminds me a bit of Toto's 'Stop Loving You'. I actually like Toto! But Borsato is more a hate object.

Amy MacDonald is a sweet Scottish girl singing a sweet, slightly melancholic pop song. It does get a bit repetative even in the three and a half minutes it takes.

Gerard Joling is a Dutch Schlager singer - with some camp appeal. The song pretty much consists of singing "oooah! I am 24 hour a day in love with you". He actually went to the Eurovison in 1988 with the song 'Shangri-La' and had something of a European hit with 'No More Bolero's'

Ida Engberg is a Swedish minimal techno DJ. The track is quite heavy on synth strings. Kind of how you'd expect minimal to sound if Tiësto had a go at it, which I guess is why Dutch people are buying (can't be that they're suddenly into minimal!?). It's still cool, though.

Kane is a Dutch version of Bush. Although by now they've gone to sounding like a Dutch version of 3 Doors Down.

Nick & Simon also make Schlager music. The song has a bit more text that the Gerard Joling one, but it's on the level of "Rosanne, I know that there are so many men -- every time another and it hurts me again". That's a near-literal translation.

Anouk is a Dutch version of Alannis Morissette. She's had some real European success, with her 1997 single 'Nobody's Wife'. This is her new song -- boring IMO but the 'make up your mind about your tits, girls' line brings some redemption:

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 12:07:37 PM EST

Re: NL Top 10 (none / 0)

Kane is a Dutch version of Bush. Although by now they've gone to sounding like a Dutch version of 3 Doors Down.

You mean this? I thought they're American...

*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.

by DoDo on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 01:14:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: NL Top 10 (none / 0)

The Netherlands often gets imitations of foreign styles marketed domestically. Makes (business) sense. Kane, for that matter, is definitely not worse than, say, Creed.

Creed sucks

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Sun May 11th, 2008 at 01:32:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Euro Trends: Music (Week 1) | 50 comments (50 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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