All that's wrong with 'common wisdom' in one article

by Jerome a Paris
Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 05:56:45 AM EST

The article below is a wonderful example of pundit cluelessness and or wanton incompetence, and I'm going to rip it to shreds in detail below.


Gordon Brown landed North Sea oil in choppy water

The Treasury is enjoying a windfall as oil soars but taxation policy may have knock-on effects

The rest of us may have been too busy partying like it was 1999, but on the eve of the millennium Britain was quietly, unwittingly, selling off the family silver on the cheap.

Gordon Brown's choice of that year to start selling off Britain's gold reserves with the precious metal's price close to an unprecedented low is well documented. What is less well known is that 1999 marked the peak for North Sea oil production and - by an unfortunate twist of fate - the very nadir of the oil price.


Gordon Brown, who has been lauded for years (and in particular around 1999) as a great Chancellor of the Exchequer is now fair game and everything he has ever done must now be seen in light of his current meltdown. With that in mind, it is not surprising to see articles now popping up to pin blame on him then for oil prices now. The biggest story of the day must somehow be his fault too.

But given that oil and energy is a topic that touches upon quite a few ideological traps, he is of course going to be blamed for all the wrong things, in order for the story to fit with the narrative.

The last sentence of the above paragraph is testimony to how far our pundits are from any kind of informed commentary on the subject. Is it really a "unfortunate twist of fate" that oil prices were at their lowest when the highest volumes of oil under our control were extracted, or just a logical  consequence of supply and demand rules that they are usually so keen to credit for other favorable economic outcomes?

After the oil shocks of the 70s, the US and the UK were lucky to be able to exploit new oil reserves situated on their territory - in Alaska or the North Sea. These finds, the last major production areas found on the planet to date, flooded the market in the 80s and 90s, duly bringing prices down, and prompting the Economist to write, in March 1999: "The price of oil has fallen by half in the past two years, to just over $10 a barrel. It may fall further."

Commodities were seen as a relic of the past, as the dotcom age was promising us unprecedented wealth based on knowledge rather than heavy stuff. Gold was on a 20 year downwards trajectory and all central banks were wondering what to do with their bulky and useless stocks of the metal. Holding it was, then, seeing as silly, and oil was seen as an sideshow - cheap, plentiful and boring.

But hey, let's rewrite history with the benefit of hindsight, and blame Brown for actions which were then lauded as modern and proper.


Britain was pumping around 2.8m barrels of oil every day, but the price averaged a mere $18 and dropped at one stage into single figures. Fast-forward to today, and while the oil price has rocketed up to a record $135 a barrel, the UK is producing only 1.5m barrels a day.

The Prime Minister cannot be blamed for the fact that Britain's oil production peaked at precisely the wrong time, nor can he really do anything meaningful to the oil price - despite his pledges yesterday. However, the rising price has underlined just how fast the North Sea is declining, and raised questions over whether Mr Brown's policies have served to accelerate its demise.

Well, the Prime Minister can actually be blamed for not doing anything about the UK's oil production when he arrived at n°11 back in 1997. It was not fashionable then, and it certainly was not what his predecessors had done, but oil&gas production could have been curtailed and limited in order to last longer. This is what the Dutch did with their gas reserves - limiting by law the production of their giant Groningen gas field so as to husband the resource for longer. It's not as if information on the likely decline of production was not available then, and as if the government did not have the means to direct an immediate stabilisation of production so as to ensure a longer tail.

And even if you accept that if was not a priority topic by 1999, the real issue was not what he did or did not do then, but what he has not done since, as it became obvious that production was declining. The country has lost 1.4mb/d of production capacity in 10 years, has become a major importer of the stuff, and still has no energy policy beyond "the markets will provide" or "blame the evil Russians."

And as to "doing nothing about oil prices" - how about focusing on the one side of the supply-demand balance that we can actually do something about: our demand? There's lots that governments can do, from the mundane (fuel efficiency resquirements, construction standards), to the all encompassing (fuel taxes, speed limits, public transport investment) to the brutal (rationing, forbidding the sale of cars with low fuel efficiency, closing off highways).

But no, the common wisdom does not focus on that, it focuses on this:


However, the Government is culpable for its management of the tax regime. Some years ago Mr Brown switched the system to a more modern scheme, charging oil companies a supplement to corporation tax for their North Sea profits, but allowing them to offset the investment they poured in.

It was a sensible change, designed to encourage companies to spend more on finding new fields. However, in 2005, the Treasury suddenly and unexpectedly raised this supplementary tax rate.

Ah. Tax increases. that's the real problem. Of course. It is, as we know, the root of all evil.


All businesses are reluctant to invest in a region if they fear its tax policies will change suddenly and without warning - none more so than oil companies, which make their investment decisions on a 20 to 30-year horizon.

Tax instability (which happens only whan taxes go up, not down, of course) is the cause of the production decline. No matter than the tax was increased only in 2005, ie 6 years after production started declining, and that it was increased by a few % at a time when oil prices had already climbed up from $15 to $50 - it Just. Has. To. Be. The. Reason. Oil. Production. Declined.

As we are reminded again:


Even so, the speed of the North Sea's decline has taken almost all experts by surprise. According to Kevin Norrish, commodities analyst at Barclays Capital, since the turn of the millennium production has consistently disappointed expectations.

"With no major new projects on the horizon to make up for the accelerating decline rates in the UK's mature fields, the prospect of significantly arresting the established decline in output looks poor," he said. Likewise, the amount of investment injected into the region has been consistently lower than many had forecast.

"Experts" were surprised. Presumably the very same experts that were "surprised" when Iraqis did not welcome US and UK soldiers with flowers, or when oil prices went above $50, and above $60, and above $80, and above $100, etc...

The same experts that are still listened to today, and quoted widely.

But it all makes sense for them:


This is hardly surprising. Over the past decades the North Sea has become one of the Government's biggest corporate tax cows, generating more than £230bn in revenue since 1968. The Treasury is expecting to make around £10bn this year from oil revenues, though experts at Grant Thornton think this could rise as high as £16bn due to higher oil prices.

However, this windfall has come at a price. If, as thought, it is responsible for depressing production in recent years, it has helped make the UK a net oil importer two years earlier than expected.

It's government fault that production is declining, and more precisely, it's Gordon Brown's fault for increasing taxes at the wrong moment. The man cannot keep his hands of our hard earned money ("our?" you ask innocently - yes, "our" - aren't you a shareholder of BP, Shell et al? What a pity.)


Not only does this have serious implications for energy policy, it has pushed the current account deficit sharply higher and contributed to a weaker pound. It has meant that whereas a few years ago Britain was well positioned to benefit from a high oil price, the implications today are far more damaging for the economy.

We hit the jackpot! Brown's tax increases not only explain the oil crisis itself (killing incentives, despite today's prices, to invest in more North Sea production), but it also explains Britain's huge trade deficit (see, nothing to do with the financial sector's growth slowly killing the manufacturing sector, à la Anglo Disease) AND it suggests that there is a simple, successful energy policy round the corner (lower taxes on energy companies).


The Conservative and Labour governments since Thatcher have benefited immeasurably from the North Sea's constant stream of revenues in the past decades. Only now are the full implications of its decline sinking in.

Lady Thatcher, in her infinite wisdom, bestowed future governments with a golden goose, and now that damn evil, incompetent, (shall we dare say it - socialist) Brown has spoiled it all. Damn him.

Sigh...

While the last sentence touches one profound truth (British governments over the past 20 years have had it easy thanks to the North Sea bonanza), it also points that the real issues are not even on the radar yet. Oil production decline (in the case of the UK, but the logic is the same as regards global stagnation of production) is only caused by pesky governments interfering with private sector investment, and there is no problem that cannot be resolved by lower taxes or less regulation. Peak oil is not even on the radar screen, Demand-side policies are inexistent (beyond, occasionally, a token, throwaway mention) and, of course, irrelevant.

As usual, all that matters are supply-side policies. Maybe it's time to call it, as properly suggested long ago by George Bush Sr for their economic cousins, voodoo energy policies - it's all the more appropriate as it appears to mostly include the hope that production will somehow, magically, increase - or that an alternative solution will just as magically emerge painlessly.

Login
. Make a new account
. Reset password

Display:


In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 04:37:30 PM EST
No, I think it stands alone.


When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:00:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Man, this country's well and truly fucked.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:00:39 PM EST
No it's not. It's got tidal and wind energy coming out of its ears.

It's the financial system that is well and truly fucked.

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:03:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The financial system doesn't matter one iota when you have Whitehall.

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:05:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I've always regarded Whitehall as the protective membrane for the financial system.
by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:09:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
A mucous membrane, too.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:16:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
... assumes that tax policy can increase production irrespective of whether there are any supplies of the commodity available in the ground to produce have any claim on being called a "supply side policy".

If there is a demand side and a supply side, surely the tax policy approach to creating more oil in the ground is off on a third side somewhere?


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:10:03 PM EST
As I wrote on the dKos thread: They think that the 'laws' of economics supersede the laws of nature - if prices increase, supply of a resource will increase (even if it is not physically possible).

Admittedly, some of the smarter ones acknowledge that the demand-supply balance (a real law) will happen via demand destruction; in the past, that meant poor people far away doing without oil; today, it means poor people not far away enough (because they vote here) doing with less - so quick, they must be distracted. Hey, it's taxes! Hey, it's the evil Russians! Hey, it's evil Saudis! etc, etc...

So those blaming Chavez are slightly less clueless than those blaming Brown.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:15:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Just not the kind of economist who thinks that the rules of the game under any socially constructed institution supersedes the laws of nature.


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:17:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Must make you unsuitable for Wall Street.  Better get your priorities straight!  Well, maybe some contrarian hedge funds.

If sanity be culturally normative, then by the norms of this culture I claim insanity.
by ARGeezer (argeezer@yahoo.com) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 11:02:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
.. would I want to work on Wall Street? Indeed, what work is there to be had on Wall Street working out how low income nations can support more rapid agrarian development while economizing on scarce civil service support?

Don't confuse the 'economist' quoted in the business press with a normal economist ... they are mostly economic analysts working for someone peddling something who are allowing themselves to be quoted in return for getting their employer's name in the paper for free.


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 11:40:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I somehow suspected that you were none of the above.

If sanity be culturally normative, then by the norms of this culture I claim insanity.
by ARGeezer (argeezer@yahoo.com) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 12:48:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Off topic: are you still based in Australia, or in Ohio, or where?

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 05:30:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... at a community college, and resting up for a serious push into the job market this fall.

Utsukushii kereba sore de ii
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 01:09:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 06:24:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]
When the economy and social structure of a society goes into a decline we usually see one of two outcomes: civil unrest or the imposition of an autocratic regime.

The UK and US have gotten pretty close to autocratic regimes in the past, but have usually settled for impoverishing vast swaths of the working class instead of drifting into revolution.

I think France has had a rockier past and, of course, Germany is in a class by itself. I can't predict what will happen this time, certainly the tools of oppression are much more refined that in prior periods.

The people always have the option of exerting their power by withholding their labor and spending, but it seems to take more political awareness than seems to exist at the moment. Maybe the spreading strikes among fisherman and others will lead the way.

Policies not Politics
---- Daily Landscape

by rdf (robert.feinman@gmail.com) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 07:44:07 PM EST

When the economy and social structure of a society goes into a decline we usually see one of two outcomes: civil unrest or the imposition of an autocratic regime.

Yep and that is why I think things like Anglo Disease and peak oil are so... passé.

Yes, the analysis was correct, spot on, perfect. In fact is was so correct that we are now entering a period past that. The credit and energy binges are over (or at their end).

The question now is: as the shit is hitting the fan in front of our eyes, how do we answer that?

What will happen in "the west" where scarcity makes a comeback? We do have strong democracies, but we also have atomized, less organized grass roots than before. Furthermore people of my age and below were educated in a sort of self-centered, egotistic fashion ("you are consumers!", not friends, not members of a community, not even producers).

I am afraid that you are right: authoritarianism along with scapegoat finding (foreigners, immigrants, criminals - of the small fish kind) is the "standard" answer. Lots of space for typical ultra-right speech.

How can that be countered?

Of all forms of caution, caution in love is perhaps the most fatal to true happiness - Bertrand Russell

by tiagoantao (put_my_login_here <> gmail com) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 06:32:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We mayb be a little late since the alternative narrative needs to be planted in people's mind ready to take over when painful facts force a realization that the dominant narrative is inadequate. In this sense, the last 15-20 years of doldrums and third-wayism from the mainstream European Left are really bad news.

So I agree with you, it is crucial to start hammering out an alternative narrative as well as reminding people why the old one is wrong. Our problem is that it's easier to diagnose problems than to agree on solutions (the herding cats problem).

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 05:29:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Herding cats--

If you want cats to congregate--offer them food

If you wish cats to do something for you--The cat will wonder why you want it to do something for you--and look at you strangely

If you wish cats to have common behaviours--give them common play spaces and toys

....

heh...herding cats--why would anyone want to herd cats?  That's not how cats work, surely?  So--new techniques!  We have lots of cat owners here, so--given that we are a collective of cats rather than dogs or cows--we need some of that cat-knowledge...

or...er....cough!

Don't fight forces, use them R. Buckminster Fuller.

by rg (leopold dot lepster at google mail dot com) on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 06:05:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If, as it seems to be, foresight is so rare, shouldn't we thank the SUV drivers.
After all they are the one's that make peak oil production in times of very high production, and leave our societies easy ways to cut demand, after there is undoubtable proof of the finiteness of oil.

by Martin (weiser.mensch(at)googlemail.com) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 07:49:02 PM EST
... means that the peak in oil production will necessarily come at a time when more oil is being produced than previously?

The inefficiency of SUV's means that we in the US start with an even more unrealistic image of how well we have to be doing before we are starting to be doing "OK".

I guess all that steel will be good for who-ever is buying scrap steel in large amounts over the next three to five years ... but all up, there's a big deadweight loss in being further away from sustainability than any the economy of any other society on the face of the planet.


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 09:46:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"Doesn't the 'Peak' in peak oil mean that the peak in oil production will necessarily come at a time when more oil is being produced than previously?"

I think that comes with the package of the definition of "peak"

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 05:55:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But it doesn't say something about the absolute level of the peak. Assume demand would be lower. Then peak oil would occur later, with a lower absolute peak output, and with less oil remaining in the grounds, and with less easy to cut waste demand.

Of course this is only a good deal, if one assumes, that it is at least highly unlikely, that a real commitment to develop alternatives only starts after peak-oil has become obvious. But that seems to be not an unrealistic assumption.


by Martin (weiser.mensch(at)googlemail.com) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 07:44:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The last sentence was some kind of double negation. I meant, "...that it is at least highly unlikely, that a real commitment to develop alternatives starts before peak-oil has become obvious."

by Martin (weiser.mensch(at)googlemail.com) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 07:47:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... buying here.

The sustainable energy budget we are going to be living with is the same budget, no matter how frugal or flagrantly wasteful we were during the fossil-fuel era.

It is harder to climb down to that sustainable budget if we do it (1) earlier and (2) with a higher level of waste built into all of our production and consumption systems.

Just for the sake of the thought experiment assume that later peak. That also means that the decline from the peak will be more gradual in terms of BTU's that need replacement or elimination per year.

Having all that extra "waste" to mine is not a net benefit ... sure, some of that waste will be low-hanging fruit but some of it won't be ... especially the waste build into our settlement system.


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 09:57:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Tax instability (which happens only whan taxes go up, not down, of course) is the cause of the production decline.

I had wondered, whether gradual tax cuts have a growth effect comparable to Ponzi-lite market expansion. When new tax cuts (or interest rate cuts) are continuously predictable, wouldn't that give extra opportunities for cheap privileged  refinancing and making money "out of air"? After all, libertarians never say, we need zero taxes, or 0.00001% taxes, they always say we need more tax cuts.

by das monde on Sun Jun 1st, 2008 at 09:59:10 PM EST
When fiscal policy becomes predictable it can be factored into strategic planning. Does that mean it then loses its effect?

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 05:09:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I already came to a conclusion that any best intentioned system can be strategically over-planned for a narrow unintended purpose, turning initial common objectives on their head. Say, the "know how" of running autocracy on Democracy OS system is growing pretty handily. Soon we might be wondering, that no one could have predicted that Bush would try dictatorship after all :-]

But yet other game is when tax and rate policies are possibly engineered specifically to profit insiders most handily, while keeping appearances of "great" economy for a next election cycle. While a market expansion, a new resource, or another rate cut is possible, you can run run any voodoonomics without much headache, and fool any empirical econometrists.

by das monde on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 07:01:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The Torygraph
All businesses are reluctant to invest in a region if they fear its tax policies will change suddenly and without warning - none more so than oil companies, which make their investment decisions on a 20 to 30-year horizon.

This is, at best, economic (sic) with the truth. After the tax increase Gordo made a promise that there would be no more increases for the life of the parliament. Since it's likely to be Cameron next time around, more tax increases are unlikely.

See e.g.

UK treasury sees small output drop | World Oil | Find Articles at BNET.com

The government "has given a commitment to no further increases in North Sea taxation for the lifetime of this Parliament," the report said. The next UK Parliamentary elections are expected in 2009 or 2010.

Note also that the noobs at the Treasury are still expecting the decline in production to be 'temporary.'

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 07:16:58 AM EST
The effect of tax predictability must be relative. Hence races to the bottom...

On the other hand, how sensible is so sensitive pondering to "needs" of investors? There is more to life on Earth than playing with cash flows.

by das monde on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 07:12:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
With your leave, I would like to use the topic on news deconstruction to ask two questions. The first about anglo-disease, the second about peak oil.

Firstly: we have had a lot of reflexion on this site around anglo disease and its consequences on the economic growth worldwide (and especially in US/UK). Nevertheless, in France, a lot of mainstream commentators point out that no recession may be detected yet. What would be the reasons? Could we say that the real economy, even in US has managed to resist the markets crunch? Would the subprime crisis really be over? We can also find theories that point out a separation between subprime-ladden US and happy-growing Europe.

Second question on peak oil and speculation:
I've stumbled across this article from a F. William Engdahl which asserts that as much as 60% of 120$ barrel price could be speculation driven. I found this data again in blogs and website from the french internet. Has it any value? How may it be related to oil extraction data? What may be answered to people saying that actual production is sufficient for actual demand?

by Xavier in Paris on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 11:04:53 AM EST
No real answers, but -

  1. Could it be that the dollar slump 'boosted' US GDP? (E.g., could the GDP deflator be affected just at the rght time?)

  2. Engdahl is a crackpot denier of Peak Oil who claims oil is created inorganically from the Earth's crust. So I won't hold my breath that there are credible sources for such a claim.


*Traitor*, n.
A benighted individual who perceives an illusory distinction between serving his nation and abetting the criminals who govern it.
by DoDo on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 12:27:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]
These are quite interesting articles in relation to market goings on

ICE, ICE Baby

More ICE, ICE Baby

Engdahl is off-beam on some aspects of the oil market, and spot on in many others.

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 at 02:05:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
thanks for the comment on engdahl. I looked for him on the internet, and got the feeling that he was writing on everything thrilling that could give him good author royalties, to say the truth. (GMO, pea oil...)

But I met the 60% argument quite a few times on the internet

by Xavier in Paris on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 03:39:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... of an employment-recession ... we have had rising unemployment, on the broad based measure, for three of the past four months, and at 9.1% are already halfway to the peak unemployment rate of the 2001 recession.

That's combined with 0.6% (annual rate) growth in Q1, which is, after all, precisely what is expected with growth down below the 2% ... somewhere in the range of 2% to 3% growth is required in most high income countries just to keep unemployment stable (much higher than that in China, due to the rapid annual growth in the Chinese labor force).

And, yes, it is quite possible that it was the falling US$ that put the brakes on the slide into recession ... but if it slowed the slide, it did not reverse the slide. And an economy running at 0.6% is going to slide into recession sooner or later, unless a strong growth driver, or combination of moderate growth drivers, comes along to restore economic growth.

Most of the conventional wisdom judgments on this are heavily biased by the fact that the "economics" reporting that pays the bills is "what people participating in stock and other financial asset markets want to read". Given a commercial imperative to focus on financial market events that play out in hours or day, its not surprising if the business press sometimes has difficulty covering business cycle events that play out in weeks and months.

To a certain extent ... and this is on top of, not instead of, the impacts of ideological blinders ... there's a form of commercially-driven Attention Deficit Disorder at work.

On whether something will show up to pull the US out of the employment-recession before it blows up into a GDP-recession ... well, after a decade in Australia, seeing one potential recession after another nipped in the bud through unintended side-effects of government policy or through just plain good luck, I'm never going to say never ... but it doesn't look very promising.


Utsukushii kereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 at 01:24:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thanks for your comment.

This is what I was wondering about: the fact that some indicators seems quite grim, while in the (french) press you may find optimistic analysis of US economic situation.

If I'm understanding you, there are already unemployment problems, but no impact yet on GDP growth. It should have some impact in the future, unless other undetected yet events happen. And how it will turn cannot be predicted, because it depends of so many factors.

by Xavier in Paris on Wed Jun 4th, 2008 at 04:56:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Additionally, we don't know (or at least I don't know) how much of US GDP actually exists and how much of it is I-mow-your-lawn-you-mow-mine funny-money.

- Jake

Your representatives may not listen to you. But they do read your e-mail.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Wed Jun 4th, 2008 at 10:52:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
How much of the "service" sector is funny money, in general?

When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Jun 4th, 2008 at 11:02:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I suppose that that is in the eye of the beholder.

- Jake

Your representatives may not listen to you. But they do read your e-mail.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Wed Jun 4th, 2008 at 11:28:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]


Display:
Go to: [ European Tribune Homepage : Top of page : Top of comments ]