European Tribune

European Salon de News, Discussion et Klatsch - 12. August

by Fran
Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:15:57 PM EST

On this date in history:

1866 - Birth of Jacinto Benavente, a Spanish writer and Nobel Prize Laureate, who was one of the foremost Spanish dramatists of the 20th century. (d. 1954)

More here and here


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EUROPE
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:16:42 PM EST
EU under pressure to shed light on expert panels - EUobserver

EUOBSERVER / BRUSSELS - A transparency campaign group has written to seven European commissioners to pressure them to make good on a promise to reveal the names of the people who sit on the expert groups that influence EU legislation in key areas.

ALTER-EU, made up of 160 organisations, on Friday (8 August) sent letters to the commission president, vice-president, and commissioners in charge of industry, energy, research, health and environment to ask whether the commission intends to take the name-publishing step "by the summer" as it promised earlier this year.

The commission has often been accused by NGOs of giving industry too much of a say

It said it is "deeply concerned about the lack of progress so far on the issue of over-representation," referring to advisory groups where business lobbyists outnumber NGOs and civil society groups.

The transparency group says that the only way to avoid "privileged access for certain specific interests" is to establish consistent membership criteria and called in the letters for an "open and transparent process" for the selection of such expert groups.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:22:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]


When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 04:43:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]
the problem is not trusting experts, it's not knowing who they are or who they work for.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:47:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Since we don't in fact know much about these points concerning almost all the experts that influence major questions, that's a bit of a quibble, isn't it?

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 08:29:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
`Clinton, Chirac blocked Karadzic's arrest'
 

BELGRADE: Former US and French Presidents Bill Clinton and Jacques Chirac "personally" blocked plans to arrest the Bosnian Serb leader Radovan Karadzic, wanted for a genocide trial over the past 13 years, a former official of the UN war crimes tribunal said in an interview published yesterday.

Florence Hartmann, a former spokeswoman of the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY) prosecutor, said in an interview with the daily Blic that "sometimes the arrest was blocked personally by Chirac, another time it was Clinton."

Karadzic was arrested in July in Belgrade after 13 years on the run. ICTY accused him in 1995 of genocide and leveled other charges over his role in atrocities such as the massacre of 8,000 Muslims in Srebrenica during the 1992-95 Bosnian War. The former president of the Serb entity in Bosnia, Karadzic claims that he made a deal with the former US envoy, Richard Holbrooke, to withdraw from politics and fade away and so avoid arrest and trial.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:27:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Czech President Rejects EU Chemical Industry Law | Europe | Deutsche Welle | 11.08.2008
Czech President Vaclav Klaus has vetoed a law placing the country's chemical industry under tougher European Union rules, calling it bureaucratic and bad for business.

In a statement released on Monday, Klaus said that neither the Czech Republic nor the whole EU needs such a regulation.

 

"There is no reason to further toughen legislation in this field. People are not endangered by chemicals," he added.

 

The bill, passed by parliament last month, implements an EU directive that requires manufacturers and importers to register chemicals with the new Helsinki-based European Chemicals Agency.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:31:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"In fact, it is chemicals who are endangered by people," perjured President Klaus.

Skennah Kowa
by Crazy Horse on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:47:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Regulating chemicals is communism. Also, scientists should help us and take into consideration the political effects of their scientific opinions...

"The basis of optimism is sheer terror" - Oscar Wilde
by NordicStorm on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 04:56:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Is he awrare of Love Canal ?

Or as Jeffrey St Clair wrote in his essay "Something about Butte"

Butte has gone from being the richest hill on earth to the world's most expensive reclamation project and the nation's biggest Superfund site. The only good paying jobs in town these days go to the supervisors of those charged with cleaning up the mess and to the medical technicians who routinely test the blood of Butte's children for arsenic and lead....

It's the oldest story in the West: privatize the profits, socialize the costs, the risks and the fallout. And then hightail it out of town



keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:11:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Eehm, Klaus? Implementation of Directives is not optional.

This is a useless symbolic veto. I guess the Czech parliament will overrule, or Klaus will budge when the EU threatens to cut off the stream of money.

(This is the REACH Directive, by the way. Why no bad pun, Deutsche Welle?)

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:42:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
and had been buddies with assassinated Rwandan Hutu president Juvénal Habyarimana: these were two reasons he supported the Hutu militias during their genocide of the Tutsis, according to Linda Melvern, an investigative journalist and author who testified in July 2007 before the Rwanda commission investigating France's role in the genocide.

Democracy Now! | Rwanda Accuses Top French Officials in 1994 Genocide

ANJALI KAMAT: Why, in your analysis, do you think that the French officials and the French government was supporting Hutu militias in Rwanda?

LINDA MELVERN: ... the rebel army that was created, the Rwandan Patriotic Front, invaded Rwanda from neighboring Uganda in October 1990. The French saw this as aggression by an Anglophone country, Uganda, against a Francophone country, Rwanda. They did not see the RPF fighting for stateless refugees. They saw the RPF as part of a plot by Yoweri Museveni in Uganda to take over a part of Francophone Africa, and for that reason they supported the Habyarimana regime.

For the three years of civil war, without French military help, then the dictatorship would have fallen. It was French military help that kept Habyarimana in power. And he was, by all accounts, although this is very difficult to prove, he [Mitterand] was friendly with Habyarimana. These two men, Mitterrand and Habyarimana, were friends. They spent time together. Their children spent time together. Habyarimana had a flat in Paris. So it was a very close relationship, apparently.

The fear--and this comes through in documents that have been released from the Mitterrand archives--certainly Mitterrand feared that what he called a Tutsiland was going to be created. And once Rwanda was lost to Anglophone influence, then French credibility on the African continent would suffer a blow, he believed, from which it would never recover.



Cynicism is intellectual treason.
by marco (cowannar at gmail punkt com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 03:54:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
SPECIAL FOCUS - Caucasus Crisis
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:18:02 PM EST
NATO, EU to Hold Crisis Talks as Russia Advances in Georgia | Europe | Deutsche Welle | 11.08.2008
As Russian troops and tanks advance further into Georgian, officials from NATO and the EU scheduled talks over the war in the Caucasus to show they can make a difference in their own backyard.

Pleading for a hands-on approach from NATO and the European Union, Salome Samadashvili, Georgia's ambassador to the EU, told journalists in Brussels on Monday, Aug. 11, that the organizations "need to show that there will be a political cost for this action in terms of the relationship of the Russian Federation with its Western partners," DPA news agency reported.

 

"Either we find a way to respond to (Russia's military action) together or we have to live with the decision that we will face a different world tomorrow," she added.

 

Georgian forces retreated on Monday to Tbilisi from other parts of the country in order to defend the capital.

 

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:20:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
News Analysis - In Georgia and Russia, a Perfect Brew for a Blowup - News Analysis - NYTimes.com
As the bloody military mismatch between Russia and Georgia unfolded over the past three days, even the main players were surprised by how quickly small border skirmishes slipped into a conflict that threatened the Georgian government and perhaps the country itself.
Several American and Georgian officials said that unlike when Russia invaded Afghanistan in 1979, a move in which Soviet forces were massed before the attack, the nation had not appeared poised for an invasion last week. As late as Wednesday, they said, Russian diplomats had been pressing for negotiations between Georgia and South Ossetia, the breakaway region where the combat flared and then escalated into full-scale war.
"It doesn't look like this was premeditated, with a massive staging of equipment," one senior American official said. "Until the night before the fighting, Russia seemed to be playing a constructive role."
But while the immediate causes and the intensity of the Russian invasion had caught Georgia and the Western foreign policy establishment by surprise, there had been signs for years that Georgia and Russia had methodically, if quietly, prepared for conflict.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:21:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
EU-Russia relations in jeopardy as bombs hit Tbilisi -EUobserver

EUOBSERVER / BRUSSELS - The suspension of EU-Russia negotiations on a new bilateral pact, freezing talks on visa-free travel for Russian citizens and holding back EU humanitarian aid to Chechnya until Russia ends aggression in Georgia could be among ideas debated by EU foreign ministers in Brussels on Wednesday (13 August).

A mountain top church in the Georgian countryside

Once fighting dies down, the EU may also offer to send policemen - but not soldiers - to help keep the peace in Georgia's breakaway regions and speed up free trade and visa facilitation deals with Georgia and Ukraine, "to show that those countries are not part of a 'grey zone' for Russia to expand [into]," a senior EU diplomat told EUobserver.

The EU launched talks in July on a new pact to replace its old Partnership and Cooperation Agreement with Russia and pays around €18 million a year in aid to help rebuild war-torn Chechnya. But Russia's incursion into Georgia last week threw EU-Russia relations into turmoil, in the gravest European security crisis since the 1999 Kosovo war.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:22:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Al Jazeera English - Europe - Georgia signs EU cease-fire pledge

The Georgian president has said that he has signed a cease-fire pledge proposed by envoys from the European Union.

Mikhail Saakashvili said on Monday he signed the document together with Bernard Kouchner, the French foreign minister and Alexander Stubb, his Finnish counterpart.

While a Kremlin spokesman dismissed Saakashvili's cease-fire claim, Vladimir Putin, the Russian prime minister, said the West had mistaken the real aggressors for the victims.

Putin, shown speaking on Russian state television, singled out the United States, saying Washington was helping to bring Georgian troops home from Iraq.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:23:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
US Role in the Georgian Crisis - Middle East Online

Christopher King argues that the US and NATO are behind the Georgian invasion of South Ossetia but have misjudged Russian resolve. He says it is time for Europe to distance itself from NATO, which has become a US tool, and to choose whether it wants Russia as a friend or an enemy.

 
The European Union needs to re-evaluate its relationship to both the United States and NATO.

I've said recently (see "The USA, Russia and the spinoff from Iraq and Iran" and "Iran's `provocative missile test'") that US plans to instal a missile shield in Poland and the Czech Republic are designed to cause trouble between Europe and Russia as well as distracting Europe from US Middle Eastern outrages. These missiles, under US control, are supposed to protect Europe and if you believe that, you probably believe in the tooth fairy. US negotiations for these missiles don't appear to be going very well since the Poles and Czechs don't much like the idea of being targeted in response by Russian missiles and the Russians have been musing about installing their missiles in Cuba for a re-run of the Cuban missile crisis and near nuclear war of the 1960s. That would not be popular with US voters. What do do? Are there any trouble spots that can be stoked up to show Russia as an aggressor? What about Georgia and the South Ossetia separatists on Russia's southern border?

So we've arrived at having a US/NATO-sponsored provocation with Georgia invading its breakaway semi-independent province. South Ossetia's declaration of independence was supported by almost all its residents. The South Ossetian argument is that if the West and NATO supported Kosovo's independence from Serbia, they should support its independence from Georgia. That sounds reasonable. No? Of course, no! The difference is that South Ossetia wants ties with Russia and the US has been pressing for Georgia to join NATO.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:27:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
A nice theory....if the WH had shown any talent at succesfully accomplishing this sort of duplicity previously.

I mean, they've tried it, but it's always so ham-fisted it's ridiculous. This, if the guy is right, is so crisp, so meticulous that it cannot possibly be these guys doing it.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:33:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The Associated Press: US can't do much to stop determined Russia

In talking points on the conflict obtained by The Associated Press, the Bush administration claims it had no specific advance warning that Georgia would try to retake control of a breakaway border region largely loyal to Russia.

That doesn't mean diplomats, intelligence analysts and others weren't worried about worsening Russian relations with Georgia over the past two years and in particular about the shoving match over ethnic conflicts left over from the Cold War.

Rice went to the Georgian capital of Tbilisi to try to calm things down in July, but infuriated Russia with a public endorsement of Georgia's "territorial integrity." Saakashvili used the visit to display his close relationship with Washington, the organizing principle for an imperfectly democratic government that has collected millions of dollars in U.S. aid.

U.S. officials say they gave Saakashvili a strong warning not to put a match to the ethnic tinderboxes in South Ossetia and Abkhazia, even as Rice and others took Georgia's side in public. Bush backed the Georgian claim when he visited Tbilisi in 2005.

"The path of freedom you have chosen is not easy, but you will not travel it alone," Bush said then.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:52:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Everyone together now ...

NUKES NUKES NUKES NUKES!

Rah Rah Rah!

Com'on, let's see some real action.  Enough of this pansy crap.

Welcome to ET, Paul Krugman

by THE Twank (paszeski__aaaaaaatttttt__yahoo.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:38:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This sentiment was lovingly crafted by Richard Cheney in association with "Dungeons-R-US"

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:43:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Good Morning Helen (AM for me anyway).

Good news.  On Washington Journal this AM they have a call-in about the environment.  Most callers are now suspicious about ANYTHING coming out of the Bush administration.  Took only 7-8 years.  Americans are slow but they get there eventually.

NUKES NUKES NUKES !

And what about all of the new fangled "particle beam x-ray jock-strap blah blah" weapons which have been developed in places like Lawrence Livermore Lab over the past 50 years?  Let's roll THEM out.  Nukes are so YESTERDAY!

Welcome to ET, Paul Krugman

by THE Twank (paszeski__aaaaaaatttttt__yahoo.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 07:41:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Vladmir Putin attacks the West's 'cynical support' for Georgia - Times Online

A defiant Vladimir Putin hit out at America and the West today for its "cynical support" of Georgia, saying that Russia would continue its military operation until "its logical end".

The Russian Prime Minister blasted the West for continuing to support President Saakashvili despite Georgia's attack on South Ossetia, which he said "wiped from the face of the earth ten Osettian villages".

"The scale of cynicism is surprising and the skill to present white as black and black. The trick to present the aggressor as the victim of an aggression and to place the responsibly for the effects on the victims," Mr Putin said.

He criticised the United States for transporting 800 Georgian soldiers from Iraq, some of whom have been deployed in Gori on the border of South Ossetia.

[Murdoch Alert]
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:28:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ronald D. Asmus and Richard Holbrooke - Black Sea Watershed - washingtonpost.com
by Ronald D. Asmus and Richard Holbrooke  

In weeks and years past, each of us has argued on this page that Moscow was pursuing a policy of regime change toward Georgia and its pro-Western, democratically elected president, Mikheil Saakashvili. We predicted that, absent strong and unified Western diplomatic involvement, we were headed toward a war. Now, tragically, an escalation of violence in South Ossetia has culminated in a full-scale Russian invasion of Georgia. The West, and especially the United States, could have prevented this war. We have arrived at a watershed moment in the West's post-Cold War relations with Russia.

Exactly what happened in South Ossetia last week is unclear. Each side will argue its own version. But we know, without doubt, that Georgia was responding to repeated provocative attacks by South Ossetian separatists controlled and funded by Moscow. This is a not a war Georgia wanted; it believed that it was slowly gaining ground in South Ossetia through a strategy of soft power.

Whatever mistakes Tbilisi has made, they cannot justify Russia's actions. Moscow has invaded a neighbor, an illegal act of aggression that violates the U.N. Charter and fundamental principles of cooperation and security in Europe. Beginning a well-planned war (including cyber-warfare) as the Olympics were opening violates the ancient tradition of a truce to conflict during the Games. And Russia's willingness to create a war zone 25 miles from the Black Sea city of Sochi, where it is to host the Winter Games in 2014, hardly demonstrates its commitment to Olympic ideals. In contrast, Moscow's timing suggests that Putin seeks to overthrow Saakashvili well ahead of our elections, and thus avoid beginning relations with the next president on an overtly confrontational note.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:34:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ronald D. Asmus and Richard Holbrooke - Black Sea Watershed - washingtonpost.com
This moment could well mark the end of an era in Europe during which realpolitik and spheres of influence were supposed to be replaced by new cooperative norms and a country's right to choose its own path.

The US, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with the promotion of spheres of influence right up to the borders of Russia... Indeed, the US is somewhere out there on the sidelines looking on, you know, worriedly.

<...> Moscow has invaded a neighbor, an illegal act of aggression that violates the U.N. Charter and fundamental principles of cooperation and security in Europe.

Good grief! The US, of course, never carries out illegal acts of aggression by invading neighbouring or other countries.

<...> As Swedish Foreign Minister Carl Bildt pointed out Saturday, Moscow's rationale for invading has parallels to the darkest chapters of Europe's history.

Oh, right, let's channel William freaking Kristol while we're about it.

Clintonian assholes.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 04:05:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Heh.  I saw Holbrooke on Charlie Rose Friday night calmly and with a straight face explaining that Putin is attacking Georgia so that the wealthy Russian Oligarchs can get more beachfront property on the Black Sea.  I wish I were lying.  (Of course, when Putin offers wealthy Russian Oligarchs a jail cell, I'm sure Holbrooke's no more happy...)

"This is nothing compared to how Putin rigged Eurovision."
by poemless on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 04:10:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Because Monte Carlo and Antibes are too far away for their private jets? And Georgia is all that and a bag of nachos as an oligarch tourist destination?

Assuming there's anyone around to write history books, this particular period's itchy rash of less-than-zero US media coverage is going to be making people's brains explode centuries from now.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:20:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Did I mention S. Ossetia is land-locked?  I think he was implying Abkhazia, byt way of S. Ossetia.  But just in case someone, say, Holbrooke, for example, tries to sell you some beachfront property in S. Ossetia - know there is none.

"This is nothing compared to how Putin rigged Eurovision."
by poemless on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:24:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I assumed that 'attacking Georgia' meant rolling tanks right across the region towards those shining miles of endless and sunny Black Sea beach front property.

Yeah, there's a pipeline or something near there too. Maybe they'll want to arrange some day tours.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:37:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Sack Saak - Moon of Alabama

Could the media please stop to repeat the lunatic uttering of this idiot?

Georgia's President Mikheil Saakashvili told foreign reporters his country's army has killed several hundred Russian servicemen and shot down at least 80 Russian aircraft.

Someone should tell Saak to SHUT UP instead of emphasizing Russian casualties (which are very likely much lower than he says). Consider how such talk sounds on Russian TV and how Russian civilians and politicians will react to it.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:35:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
his country's army has killed several hundred Russian servicemen and shot down at least 80 Russian aircraft.

Reminds me of this quote attributed to Air Chief Marshall Dowding in the film "Battle of Britain"

If we're right they'll give up. If we're wrong, they'll be in London in a week


keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:41:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Moscow issues ultimatum as fighting in Georgia spreads - International Herald Tribune

TBILISI, Georgia: Russia issued an ultimatum to Georgian forces on Monday to surrender completely in and around the western pro-Russian separatist enclave of Abkhazia, in a sign that fighting could escalate on a second front in the west of Georgia.

The ultimatum called for Georgian forces to surrender in the Zugdidi district along the border of Abkhazia. A Georgian official close to the president, Giga Bokaria, said the ultimatum raised alarms that Russian troops would now push into Georgian territory in the west unchallenged by Georgian troops, which have been tied up in fighting further east near the other pro-Russian separatist enclave of South Ossetia.

The pivotal question in the conflict, which has involved heavy fighting since late last week, is now whether Russia -- which has poured troops into both Abkhazia and South Ossetia -- will push beyond these regions and further into Georgia.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:35:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The State | 08/11/2008 | Georgian president's Web site moves to Atlanta

The Web site of the president of Georgia, the small nation that is battling Russian forces over a breakaway enclave, was moved to a U.S. hosting facility this weekend after allegedly being attacked by Russian hackers.

The original servers located in the country of Georgia were "flooded and blocked by Russians" over the weekend, Nino Doijashvili, chief executive of Atlanta-based hosting company Tulip Systems Inc., said Monday.

The Georgian-born Doijashvili happened to be on vacation in Georgia when fighting broke out on Friday. She cold-called the government to offer her help and transferred president.gov.ge and rustavi2.com, the Web site of a prominent Georgian TV station, to her company's servers Saturday.

Speaking via cell phone from Georgia, Doijashvili said the attacks, traced to Moscow and St. Petersburg, are continuing on the U.S. servers. The president's site was intermittently available midday Monday. Route-tracing performed by the AP confirmed that the sites were hosted at Tulip.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:43:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Al Jazeera English - Europe - Saakashvili says 'no surrender'

Mikheil Saakashvili, Georgia's president, has spoken of the "cold-blooded, pre-meditated, murder" of his country and said that there would be "no surrender" to Russian aggression.

 

Appealing to the international community to step in to resolve fighting over the breakaway region of South Ossetia, he said: "The world has a moral duty to stop the madness."

 

Saakashvili made the comments at a news conference in Tbilisi, the Georgian capital, on Monday.

 

His remarks came as Russia's Interfax news agency said Georgian forces were continuing to shell Tskhinvali, the South Ossetian capital, early on Monday, killing three Russian peacekeepers and wounding 18 others.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:50:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Uh huh, but wasn't it his own boneheaded moves that got him into this mess in the first place?

"The basis of optimism is sheer terror" - Oscar Wilde
by NordicStorm on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:04:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Maxwell Smartkashvili: "Say, I hope I wasn't out of line with that little bombing run in South Ossetia..."

--
$E(X_t|F_s) = X_s,\quad t > s$
by martingale on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 08:19:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
DailyKos - BobJohnson - Why Bush's massive 'lame duckness' is a danger to U.S. interests

While watching Putin and company roll over Georgia, I was reminded of an article I read last summer in the excellent international security journal published by Stratfor.

The article, published on August 21, 2007, was written by George Friedman, CEO of Stratfor. Friedman is a self-described "conservative Republican," but he warned then of the dangers to U.S. interests of Bush's growing lame duck status:

Thus, Bush is a lame duck commander in chief as well. Even if he completely disregards the politics of his position, which he can do, he still lacks the sheer military resources to achieve any meaningful goal without the use of nuclear weapons. [...]
 This opens a window of opportunity for powers, particularly second-tier powers, that would not be prepared to challenge the United States while its forces had flexibility. One power in particular has begun to use this window of opportunity -- Russia.


keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:22:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
this is spot on.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:50:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
As I stated up above ...

NUKES NUKES NUKES NUKES !

Rah Rah Rah!

Welcome to ET, Paul Krugman

by THE Twank (paszeski__aaaaaaatttttt__yahoo.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 07:43:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The implication is if American troops weren't tied up in Korea, Japan, Iraq, in boats off Iran, and where ever else my tax dollars have them, and if Bush were in year 2 of his first term, that Russia would be loathe to spend its political and military savvy and oil/gas begotten strength [extend list as required] with its neighbors (EU, China, Iran, to name a few.)

I don't think it is true. One example: Russia playing in Iran is a natural on many levels.

Notwithstanding, I read Friedman's/Stratfor's piece on the Georgian faux pas last weekend. Unfortunately it is mostly behind a wall now. But his blaming Saakashvili for foolish behavior and not blaming Russia at all was a shock to me at the time. Friedman might have 20/20 vision straight in front, but the remainder of his goggles usually distort all his analysis along neo-con curves.

Here is how John Mauldin explained it in his newsletter, since Friedman was at Mauldin's kid's wedding:

George Friedman from Stratfor was at my daughter's wedding rehearsal dinner last night. He had just found out about the invasion of South Ossetia by Georgia and was keeping track of the events over his Blackberry from his correspondents on the ground in Georgia.

The media is not particularly excited over the events in Ossetia and Georgia, and the markets seem indifferent. It's much more important than it looks. This the first time since the fall of Communism that the Russians have directly and openly intervened in the former Soviet Union under the claim, made by Dmitri Medvedev, that Russia is the guarantor of security in the Caucasus. That's what the Russian Prime Minister Putin also said. Russia has claimed a sphere of influence in the Caucasus. And that is of historical importance. (Think Monroe Doctrine.)

This is payback for Kosovo. Putin didn't want an independent Kosovo and was ignored with contempt. Payback is an independent Ossetia, with Russian military intervention guaranteeing it. If it's good enough for the Americans and Europeans, it's good for the Russians too. Why the Georgians invaded Ossettia is opaque. For some reason they felt they had to move. The Russians were clearly ready and by dawn had armored formations in South Ossettia and air strikes in Georgia. (The Russian army is about 40 times the size of Georgia, and far better equipped.)

The question on the table now is whether the Russians will stop there or are going into Georgia proper. US embassy personnel are being evacuated - at least some of them - so the US takes this seriously. The US has no military options at this point. We've been talking about the window of opportunity Iraq has created by diverting US forces. Well, the Russians just climbed through the window.

The important thing to watch isn't the US or Europe. It is what the states of the former Soviet Union do, from the Baltics to Ukraine to Kazakhstan. The Russians have announced that there is a new sheriff in town, and this does not apply only to Georgia. These countries hear the message - the foreign minister of Lithuania went to Georgia this morning. All of them are calculating what this means for them in the future. And you need to be thinking about world energy, grain, and other primary commodity markets if Russia dominates the FSU and starts to manage everyone's commodity production and sales. While Georgia has little oil or gas, the pipelines from Russia go through there.

Ossetia is a province (country?) of 70,000. Normally, one would think these events were of little importance. But if Russia is making a statement of a new policy and intends to rebuild the former empire in at least a de facto manner? The US has training troops and personnel in Georgia. They are quite pro-American. While the world focuses on the Olympics, the real show may be in the Caucasus. Let's hope cool heads prevail. It is interesting to note that Bush and Putin were meeting in Beijing over this topic. I wonder what Bush will see when he stares into Putin's soul this time.

I asked and George agreed to establish a free page on his web site for the next few weeks, which they will update periodically on the situation there. This is something we should monitor. The link is http://www.stratfor.com/analysis/intelligence_guidance_conflict_south_ossetia This is one of the reasons why I read Friedman and Stratfor. No major news media had eyes on the ground when the trouble broke out. George did. In an interesting twist, the Russian news media is quoting Stratfor as a source. The world is truly strange.  



Never underestimate their intelligence, always underestimate their knowledge.

Frank Delaney ~ Ireland

by siegestate (siegestate or beyondwarispeace.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 08:11:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Exilded: Georgia Gets Its War On...McCain Gets His Brain Plaque.  By Mark Ames

The outbreak of war in Georgia on Friday offers a disturbing and somewhat surreal taste of what to expect from John McCain should he become our nation's Commander in Chief. As the centuries-old ethnic animosities between Georgia and Ossetia boiled over into another armed conflict, drawing in neighboring Russia, McCain issued a stark-raving statement from Des Moines that is disturbingly reminiscent of the language used in the lead-up to NATO's war against Yugoslavia in 1999, a war McCain zealously pushed for:

"We should immediately call a meeting of the North Atlantic Council to assess Georgia's security and review measures NATO can take to contribute to stabilizing this very dangerous situation," McCain said.

Calling on NATO to "stabilize this dangerous situation" is not going down well with Russia, where images of dead Russian peacekeepers and of frightened Ossetian refugees streaming across its borders have put the country in a very vengeful mood. It's hard to imagine what measures NATO could take under a McCain presidency, but in the mind of a man who thinks US troops should stay in Iraq for 100 years, and who runs around singing "Bomb Bomb Iran!" it's not hard to guess-and even harder not to be horrified by what it may mean come January 2009, should he win.

McCain's call to NATO-ize the war is not only frightening, it's also delusional: both NATO and US forces are already stretched beyond the breaking point, even by Joint Chief of Staff chairman Michael Millen's own recent assessment.




"This is nothing compared to how Putin rigged Eurovision."
by poemless on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 05:58:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I hope McCain isn't planning to wage a NATO led war against Germany...



"This is nothing compared to how Putin rigged Eurovision."

by poemless on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:20:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Typical Bush III malapropism.
by afox (afox at rockgardener dott com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 09:18:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Fortunately President Bush is great friends with Chancellor Merkel of Russia -- gives her back rubs & everything.  I think together the US and Russia can restrain Germany from any more military actions against Georgia.  

It would be terrible if the conflict spread to Alabama or South Carolina.

</snark>


Och nu den svenska kocken bakar en Alaskan älg jägare. Bonk! Bonk! Bonk!

by ATinNM on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 09:50:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But her days may be numbered.

"It now appears that an effort may be underway to depose Russia's duly elected government" (0:50)

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 10:52:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
SRB: Saakashvilli's War

However, the main thing one should notice is that this effort to equally blame Russia and Georgia is predicated on a kind of colonial erasure.  Namely, absent from this formulation are the South Ossetians themselves. Their agency is rendered invisible or worse reduced to the body upon which the larger powers dance.  Perhaps we should redo the narrative to include them?

The reality is that South Ossetia is not alone in its aspirations for ethnic self-determination.  The situation in South Ossetia, as with other places where political borders don't align with ethnic ones, is kind of ethno-waste of modernity. When the Bolsheviks drew up its Republics, Autonomous Regions, and autonomous oblasts in 1936, the North Caucuses was an artificially crafted mosaic where political borders ran counter to (emergent) ethnic ones.  The Ossetians where split politically into North and South, while their ethnicity remained unified.  When the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991, the South Ossetians became one of the many internal Others for the Georgians to proclaim their new found nationalism. That is, Great Georgian Nationalism was predicated on its vicious denial to the Other.  Brutality comenced.  As Human Rights Watch reported in 1996,

Between 1989 and 1992, fighting flared in the South Ossetian A.O. and in Georgia between ethnic Ossetian paramilitary troops and Georgian Interior Ministry (MVD) units and paramilitaries. South Ossetia had demanded to secede, and Georgia cracked down on the renegade area by sending in troops. Approximately 100,000 ethnic Ossetians fled Georgia and South Ossetia, and another 23,000 Georgians headed in the other direction. One hundred villages were reportedly destroyed in South Ossetia. Also the North Ossetia-Georgian border went largely uncontrolled, providing an almost unhindered access point for weapons, fighters, and ammunition in both directions.

Since then South Ossetia has overwhelming approved seceding from Gerogia in two referendums, yet their right to self-determination remains ignored.

Contrary to Cold War Triumphalists, neo-Hegelian End of Historyites, Kantian Perpetual Peaceniks, and the Death of Nation State globalists, walls continue to be erected to create or harden ethnic-religious identities. If the symbol of the 20th Century was the Berlin Wall, the 21st appears to be marked by its fragmentation and redepolyment across a variety of ethno-political spaces. The concrete walls at the US-Mexico border, Israel-Palestine, and the streets of Baghdad (For the conjunction between walls and Shia and Sunni ethnic cleansing see Derek Gregory's excellent "Biopolitics of Baghdad"), have their biopolitical and virtual expression in the new states of Southeastern Europe and the aspiring ones in the Caucuses, South Asia, and China. The formerly bipolar world of the 20th century has begotten a shotgun splatter of ethno-nationalist states of the 21st.

This is why, however much people want to point to South Ossetia as a Russian proxy, they still have to somehow account for the fact that South Ossetians gleefully take those passports, use Russian currency, and are running not into Georgia but into Russia to escape the violence.  I think we have to remember that however one wants to attribute blame for the conflict, there are some real reasons why the South Ossetians want to ditch Georgia altogether. Yet in all the reporting that has come out in the last few days, the South Ossentian voice as an agent of his or her own present and future has been more or less muted.  In its place has stood a number of metonyms: Russia, Putin, Georgia, rebels, proxies, oil pipelines, NATO, the United States . .



"This is nothing compared to how Putin rigged Eurovision."
by poemless on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:01:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
SRB:
Contrary to Cold War Triumphalists, neo-Hegelian End of Historyites, Kantian Perpetual Peaceniks, and the Death of Nation State globalists, walls continue to be erected to create or harden ethnic-religious identities.

Whoa.

Is that sentence even legal?

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:33:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I know what you mean, I read it twice and had th...eyes..glazi.n.g....ovuuuuuh moment.

That's what happens when you let politico-wonks out of their cage and talking to normal people.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:39:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What, there was a problem with that sentence?  Where?

I thought it was relatively comprehensible.

That's just strong jargon.  Out of control jargon is where you can't even tell where the subject, object, and verb of the sentence are, or when you're surprised when you reach the end of the sentence to find a question mark.

by Zwackus on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 10:14:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It was comprehensible, but perhaps just slightly florid.
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 08:24:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
lol

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 03:44:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
EXILED ONLINE - MANKIND'S ONLY ALTERNATIVE » War Nerd: South Ossetia, The War of My Dreams - By Gary Brecher

Saakashvili just didn't think it through. One reason he overplayed his hand is that he got lucky the last time he had to deal with a breakaway region: Ajara, a tiny little strip of Black Sea coast in southern Georgia. This is a place smaller than some incorporated Central Valley towns, but it declared itself an "autonomous" republic, preserving its sacred basket-weaving traditions or whatever. You just have to accept that people in the Caucasus are insane that way; they'd die to keep from saying hello to the people over the next hill, and they're never going to change. The Ajarans aren't even ethnically different from Georgians; they're Georgian too. But they're Muslims, which means they have to have their own Lego parliament and Tonka-Toy army and all the rest of that Victorian crap, and their leader, a wack job named Abashidze (Goddamn Georgian names!) volunteered them to fight to the death for their worthless independence. Except he was such a nut, and so corrupt, and the Ajarans were so similar to the Georgians, and their little "country" was so tiny and ridiculous, that for once sanity prevailed and the Ajarans refused to fight, let themselves get reabsorbed by that Colussus to the North, mighty Georgia.

Well, like I've said before, there's nothing as dangerous as victory. Makes people crazy. Saakashvili started thinking he could gobble up any secessionist region--like, say, South Ossetia. But there are big differences he was forgetting--like the fact that South Ossetia isn't Georgian, has a border with Russia, and is linked up with North Ossetia just across that border.

Most likely the Georgians just thought the Russians wouldn't react. They were doing something they learned from Bush and Cheney: sticking to best-case scenarios, positive thinking. The Georgian plan was classic shock'n'awe with no hard, grown-up thinking about the long term. Their shiny new army would go in, zap the South Ossetians while they were on a peace hangover (the worst kind), and then...uh, they'd be welcomed as liberators? Sure, just like we were in Iraq. Man, you pay a price for believing in Bush. The Georgians did. They thought he'd help. And I just saw the little creep on TV, sitting in the stands watching the US-China basketball game. (Weird game--the Chinese were taller, muscled the boards inside but couldn't shoot from outside. Not what you expect from foreign b-ball teams at all.) I didn't even recognize Bush at first, just wondered why they kept doing close-ups of this guy who looked like Hank Hill's legless dad up in the stands. Then they said it was the Prez. They talk about people "growing in office"; well, he shrunk.
by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:02:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Russia Advances in Georgia, but How Far? - The Lede - Breaking News - New York Times Blog
While the fighting in South Ossetia has been well-covered, both sides seemed to disagree on Monday on key aspects of the conflict. In comments from government officials and reports from news organizations, a complicated picture of the continuing fight emerged. Georgia is arguing that the entire country is threatened, while Russia insists that its ground assault remains limited to the first conflict zone. According to President Bush, Russia was responsible for a "dramatic and brutal escalation."

Very useful blog post as to where the conflict stands.
by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 06:38:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It'a bit annoying that the wholedisucssion is predicated on Russia having invaded deep into Georgia, when witnesses on the ground all say this is not the case.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:52:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah, but 'Russia has moved into Georgia proper' was all over the news yesterday evening in the US. So it's useful to have a post that presents those reports and the evidence and statements to the contrary.
by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 08:03:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC NEWS | Europe | New Georgia clashes mar UN moves

Russian-backed rebels in Abkhazia say they have begun an operation against Georgian forces, as UN moves to achieve a ceasefire failed to make progress.

The rebels say they are trying to push Georgian forces from a strategic gorge in the west of the breakaway province.

France's president is visiting Russia and Georgia on Tuesday but a new French draft resolution at the UN has already drawn strong Russian criticism.

The US president has meanwhile strongly attacked the Russian "invasion".

George W Bush said the Russian actions in Abkhazia and the other breakaway province of South Ossetia were "unacceptable in the 21st Century" and that Moscow was guilty of a "dramatic and brutal escalation".

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 01:12:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
EU's Sarkozy Heads to Russia as Georgia Faces Abkhaz Attack | Europe | Deutsche Welle | 12.08.2008
French and current EU President Nicholas Sarkozy was due in Moscow Tuesday morning in a bid to resolve the ongoing Ruso-Georgian conflict. Abkhaz separatists meanwhile began attacking Georgian forces in the morning.

After an otherwise quiet night, Abkhaz forces apparently began an offensive against Georgian troops on Tuesday, Aug. 12, in an attempt to drive the latter out Upper Kodori Gorge, a piece of the breakaway region still controlled by Tbilisi.

 

Thee foreign minister of the Abkhaz separatist government, Sergei Shamba, told Russian television that a UN observer mission in the area had been warned of the operation and pulled out before fighting began.

 

France's president, whose country currently holds the rotating EU presidency, meanwhile was due to arrive in Moscow in the early morning for a meeting with his Russian counterpart, Dmitry Medvedev. He was then scheduled to continue on to Georgia to meet President Mikheil Saakashvili.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 01:13:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Wow, just wow.

Hope you're holding your breath. I know I am.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 02:06:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But this is just so awesomely great! When peace breaks out, there's another thing for him to take credit for...
by someone (s0me1smail(a)gmail(d)com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 02:22:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Okay, I understand his track record for prima donna opportunism.

However, all things being equal, what he is doing would be a good thing, right?  He is trying to provide a high level channel of communications between these countries, working for dialogues over violence.

If his efforts contribute to an eventual truce, then he will have done a good thing, even if he was partly motivated by getting more praise as a great peacemaker.

Or is the consensus simply that he is such a nitwit that all his diplomatic to-and-fro'ing is useless at best or perhaps even counterproductive to finding a peaceful resolution to this mess?

Cynicism is intellectual treason.

by marco (cowannar at gmail punkt com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 03:41:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Or is the consensus simply that he is such a nitwit that all his diplomatic to-and-fro'ing is useless at best or perhaps even counterproductive to finding a peaceful resolution to this mess?

Pretty much: he seems good at making dramatic statements, not so good at implementing anything or getting results.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 04:13:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
For instance, his contribution to the debate on the Lisbon Treaty in Ireland has been such as to make pro-Treaty people consider voting no next time rather than be told what to do by the likes of him.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 04:25:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Let's say that Sarkozy prides himself on taking a tough-guy blunt attitude to diplomacy (Napoleon-style), and so far it has garnered him an impressive series of failures.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:53:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, he tends to take it, that is, until the counterpart coughs, or raises an eyebrow, or anything really. Then he's all poodle, which seems to bring failure equally effectively.

"The womb that spawned that thing is fertile yet"
by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 08:13:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We're all doomed, aren't we?
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 03:29:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Kouchner did manage to get Saakashvili to agree to the cease-fire! Powerful diplomacy!

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (jeromeguillet@yahoo.fr) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:53:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Experts: South Ossetia, Abkhazia Have No Right to Secede | Europe | Deutsche Welle | 12.08.2008
Georgia and Russia have both invoked international law to justify their actions in the current conflict. But German legal experts say that only one side seems to have a justifiable point in doing so.

Was it legal for South Ossetia to secede from Georgia in 1992? Did this happen in line with international law, which grants every nation the right to self-determination?

 

It's a clear-cut case, said Andreas Zimmermann, who teaches international law at the University of Kiel. Even if South Ossetia were to be recognized internationally as a nation and were granted the right to self-determination, this would by no means give it the right to secede, he said.

 

"The right to self-determination does not come with a right to secede," Zimmermann said. "It's a right to autonomy, to minority rights and the like. It only becomes a right to secede when we're talking about a situation of genocide, hence when fundamental basic and human rights are no longer guaranteed."

 

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 01:14:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
He then says, as expected

Zimmermann added that in light of this, one could argue that Kosovo in 1998 had a right to secede.

But not a word about Slovenia, where there was no suggestion of genocide.

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 01:43:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Le Monde.fr : Actualités à la Une
Le président russe annonce la fin de l'opération militaire en Géorgie
Le président Dmitri Medvedev a annoncé, mardi, avoir donné l'ordre de mettre fin à l'opération militaire russe "visant à contraindre la Géorgie à la paix", rapporte l'agence Interfax. (AFP et Reuters)

Russian president Dmitri Medvedev announced on tuesday he had given order to end the military operation "aiming at force Georgia to accept peace"

"Ne te courbe que pour aimer..." René Char

by Melanchthon on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:03:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
AFP: Russia 'orders end to operation against Georgia'

MOSCOW (AFP) -- Russian President Dmitry Medvedev said on Tuesday he had decided to cease Russia's military operation against Georgia, Russian news agencies reported.

"I have taken the decision to end the operation to force Georgian authorities into peace," Medvedev was quoted as saying at a meeting with defence officials.

The Associated Press: Russia's Medvedev halts military action in Georgia

MOSCOW (AP) -- Russian news reports are quoting President Dmitri Medvedev ordering a halt to Russian military action in Georgia.

Medvedev says in a statement carried by Russian news agencies that the Russian action has punished Georgia and restored security for civilians and Russian peacekeepers in South Ossetia. At the same time he ordered the military Tuesday to quell any Georgian armed resistance that appears.

Now for Sarkozy to take credit...

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:24:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The aggregators (Google News to be exact) are way behind: latest AP wire on Google:

The Associated Press: AP Top News at 4:00 a.m. EDT

ZUGDIDI, Georgia (AP) -- Russian tanks roared deep into Georgia on Monday, launching a new western front in the conflict, and Russian planes staged air raids that sent people screaming and fleeing for cover in some towns. The escalating warfare brought sharp words from President Bush, who pressed Moscow to accept an immediate cease-fire and pull its troops out to avert a "dramatic and brutal escalation" of violence in the former Soviet republic.

Perhaps Sarkozy has a chance to do something desperately heroic yet...

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 05:46:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That was 3 hours ago (and is a report on what happened Monday). Medvedev ordering a stop is the latest news.

It's too bad the AP does not have news on its own site, like the AFP or Reuters. It's been hard to follow this through google news, as a lot of the news it aggregates is 6 hours behind the curve, and a lot of news has simply taken over the Georgian statements (especially re- the alleged capture of Gori by the Russians, yesterday).

Overall it was possible to keep a fairly good overview by checking everything with the agencies.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 07:57:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No, not three hours before! And Google US has continued, since, to place other headlines above the Medvedev announcement.

It's behind the curve, for sure. And, er, consensual?

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 08:46:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I think I missed the point that you are talking about the google news front page (you are, right?).

The AP and AFP stories I quoted above were also on the google feed. You have to eehm... use teh google, then it is quite useful as an aggregator.

The front page is useless for following events in a real-time manner. It is, I guess, driven by interests of generating revenue and driving traffic. Politics could also come in, though I don't know.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 09:06:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Where we're talking at cross purposes is I'm considering the media aspect of Google News' front page, you're looking at Google News as a tool. (Which I'm also used to using it as, though I'm finding it increasingly frustrating, whether one browses or searches).

I think politics, as in confirming ideological bias, comes into driving traffic and creating revenue, yes.

When locusts move on, they leave nothing behind

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 09:12:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We're back on the same page ;-)
by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Tue Aug 12th, 2008 at 09:34:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
WORLD
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:18:22 PM EST
Iran, EU Willing to Resume Nuclear Talks | Europe | Deutsche Welle | 11.08.2008
Iran and the European Union reiterated their willingness to resume talks on the dispute over Iran's controversial nuclear programs, according to the ISNA news agency.

Iran's chief nuclear negotiator Saeid Jalili and EU foreign policy chief Javier Solana agreed by phone to continue what Iran called "talks in a constructive atmosphere," Iranian State media reported Monday, Aug. 11.

 

"Solana and Jalili voiced satisfaction at the constructive trend of negotiations in Geneva and the contacts afterwards," the television broadcast said.

 

According to the report, the two had voiced the same willingness in a phone call on Aug. 4.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:21:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The Importance of Iran - Middle East Online

The American-European-led diplomatic minuet with Iran is the most interesting and significant political dynamic in the world today. What happens on the Iran issue will determine power relations for years to come - far beyond Iran's immediate neighborhood, argues Rami G. Khouri.

 
WASHINGTON - The American-European-led international diplomatic minuet with Iran is the most interesting and significant political dynamic in the world today. What happens on the Iran issue will determine power relations for years to come, far beyond Iran's immediate neighborhood. Many critical issues are captured in the Iranian nuclear question, including global energy flows; the credibility and impact of the UN Security Council; the limits of economic and political sanctions; the capacity of determined regional powers to defy greater global powers; the interplay between Israeli, Western and global interests; the coherence of political Europe; and, the spirit and letter of international law, conventions and treaties.

Beyond political posturing in Iran, the United States, Israel and Europe, three core issues are at stake here: Iran's right to develop nuclear technology for verifiably peaceful purposes; Israeli concerns that an Iranian nuclear bomb would be an existential threat, which Israel will never allow to happen; and, Western fears of Iran's military power, nuclear capabilities, and radicalizing political influence around the Middle East.

The current situation sees the US-led Security Council five permanent members plus Germany ("5+1") incrementally raising their enticing offers to Iran while simultaneously increasing sanctions on Iran for not heeding the call to freeze its uranium enrichment activities, which are vital for producing nuclear power and/or weapons.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:24:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]
130,000 Filipinos displaced as fighting escalates in the south - International Herald Tribune

MANILA: The number of Filipinos displaced from their homes reached 130,000 as fighting in the southern Philippines intensified Monday, with the military and the police sending more troops to fight against Islamic separatists, officials said.

The conflict, which began late last week, coincided with elections Monday in the Autonomous Region in Muslim Mindanao that had, in the past, proved to be violent. Although officials said the elections went on peacefully, sporadic violence was reported, including the bombing of electric towers in one province.

Social-welfare officials warned of a potential humanitarian disaster as the fighting between troops and elements of the Moro Islamic Liberation Front, which had been confined to two provinces, threatened to spill over to other areas.

Thousands of refugees had been housed in more than 40 refugee centers, officials said, but most of them chose to leave their communities and seek shelter with relatives in other provinces.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Aug 11th, 2008 at 03:23:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]