Wednesday Open Thread

by In Wales
Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 10:13:48 AM EST

I think it is Wednesday...



A Nomad photo from the snows of Netherlandia
posted by afew
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Oh hurrah, it is.  How are you all?

Ad astra per aspera
by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 10:14:35 AM EST
Picked up the wine and rest of the food today. Finland is wonderfully white at the moment and it looks as if it will last through the holiday.

I just had some fish fingers - possible a new tradition in pre-Grand Bouffe crapfood.

My back is playing Old Harry after a session of snow clearing.

I might watch Dr Strangelove tonight, to get into the Yuletide spirit ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 10:30:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I might watch Dr Strangelove tonight, to get into the Yuletide spirit

That'll do it! Especially enjoyable with a bottle of your favorite. Merry fucking Christmas!

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer at eurotrib.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 01:10:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You're welcome, geez ;-)

Slim Pickens on a falling nuke will be a close approximation of my yuletide, in about 24 hours.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:10:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I almost posted another response suggesting Slim Pickins in a Santa outfit riding the bomb down as "I be Seeing You" played. Apocalypse for a deranged world is so satisfying until we consider that we go with it.  Even that might be o.k., but not our children too.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer at eurotrib.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:22:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm thinking of having a couple of warm up beers tonight to just prepare myself for the mayhem to come.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 01:40:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Are there such things as beer trainers?

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:11:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Of course. Tho' when you're on your game you just wrap your laughing gear around a tasty 6.5% London porter

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:07:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I am fine, finally unwinding, done all the shopping and nothing left I have to do. :-)

How are you?

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 10:41:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I am in a very good mood. Had a long chat with my good friend about business in general and our work in particular, morals, what is happiness and all the other stuff that accompanies a couple of G+Ts.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:03:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Not having much chance to stop by.  Pretty busy. 3 carloads of stuff and clothes have gone to the charity shop this week.  Yesterday I went to the butcher to get the capon, did the supermarket shop, dropped off more bits at the charity shop, did two loads of washing, tidied and hoovered the newfound floorspace, made dinner and apple crumble and watched Twilight on sky movies.  I see what all the fuss is about now.

Ad astra per aspera
by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 05:57:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
3 carloads of stuff and clothes have gone to the charity shop

Making space for Santa? ;)

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 06:01:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Making space for me would be a good start.

Ad astra per aspera
by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 07:00:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
not only has it been wedensday so far, it'll be wednesday all day.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 12:29:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Tomorrow eve is the big celebration in Finland, not Xmas Day. The order of the eve is: sauna, G+T, main blowout, mysterious knocking on windows to herald the approach of Santa and to get the kids in a frenzy, gifts for the kids, coffee and avecs for the adults, general presents (very very few by law), then some table games, then the wonderful Finnish ritual of löhö: doing very little at all on the sofa (or, in my case, a leather Kukkapuro easy chair).

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 10:37:33 AM EST
Similar here, Christmas Eve is the big event, however, it is not Santa who is coming, but the "Christkind" (Christ-Child).

The people in my surrounding have stopped a while ago making gifts, except for the kids.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 10:43:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I try to make stuff rather than buying - IF I give presents.

So what does this child christ do? How do they dress?

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:05:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Das Christkind brings the gifts.

Christkind - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Christkind is a sprite-like child, usually depicted with blond hair and angelic wings. Martin Luther intended it to be a reference to the incarnation of Jesus as an infant. It is presumed by some to be so, but seems to be rooted in the Alsatian-born myth of a child bringing gifts to the baby Jesus.[citation needed] Children never see the Christkind, as parents will always tell them that the Christkind just disappeared before they came.

Since the 1990s, the Christkind is facing increasing competition from the Weihnachtsmann in the American version of Santa Claus, caused by the use of Santa Claus as an advertising figure.

I remember when I was a kid, on christmas eve the living room door was locked and the keyhole covered. :-) aahhh - then some time after dinner, which was usually very early. Then after dinner my grandmother went to check if the livingroom door was open and if das Christkind has visited. Well, of course, it usually was and the candles on the decorated christmas tree were burning.

I also never saw the christmas tree bevor das Christkind visited, it was said that it also decorated the tree.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:21:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, that is a pretty good description of indoctrination ;-)

"always tell them that the Christkind just disappeared before they came". The explanations of why proof cannot be offered, you just have to accept what we say, is a warning sign.

Kcurie could have a field day....

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:28:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, but it was fun and exciting anyway. :-)
by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:43:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Beijing billionaires wonder if money can buy love | Reuters

The country's economic boom over the last three decades may have generated a clutch of super-wealthy Chinese, but it has not guaranteed all of them love.

Last Sunday, a privileged group of 21 single billionaires and 22 single women attended what state media called one of the Chinese capital's most expensive parties ever -- a match-making ball with tickets costing 100,000 yuan ($14,650) a head.

The 21 billionaires were all registered members of Golden Bachelors, a Shanghai-based match-making agency dedicated to helping wealthy Chinese men and women find their potential better half, which also organized the event.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 10:45:45 AM EST
Do I assume the women are just really attractive gold-diggers or are they wealthy also?

I love the smell of roast chicken in the morning!
by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:03:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

.....at about 1.00...

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:30:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]
actually DID to become billionaires in ... where ... Communist China?  Were they given authority to oversee construction/start-up of a string of factories with instructions from the government to get the job done, become wealthy, or else?

I love the smell of roast chicken in the morning!
by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 06:21:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Twank. Since its Fat Bearded Guy In Red Fur day or something I have a request: Could you please drop the "Re:" when editing the Title? It's very confusing.

Wait this is important. Someone is wrong on the Internet.
by generic on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 08:44:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Sorry, didn't know.  I don't think I'm the only one who does that, or am I wrong?

I love the smell of roast chicken in the morning!
by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 09:02:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Oh Oh Oh!  I get it.  It's OK to edit the title but lose the Re: also, which for some reason, I thought was ... something.  I'm there.  Got it.

Hey, after 2 years, I'm still learning.

I love the smell of roast chicken in the morning!

by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 09:05:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

thank you, lambert

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 12:01:45 PM EST
an entire day spent sitting at my desk at work waiting to go home. I was reduced to watching Rush on Youtubes. Actually I quite like Rush, but after a couple of hours of letting my brain shrink I simply couldn't think of anything more current or interesting.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 12:31:29 PM EST
I've now finished work and so can look forward to laying in tomorrow and then doing nothing but watching the fox trying (and failing badly) to catch pheasants in the garden.

at some point I'm sure I'll watch some telly and no doubt have a teeny-weeny beer type drink while i'm at it.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 01:45:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
And I read that as' watching Fox trying to catch peasants' - and for a moment it made perfect sense as a Helenism.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:07:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm now gonna worry aboput the idea that you've all got helenisms that you swap and laugh about behind my back.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:09:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Don't be silly!

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:17:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I am guessing you're referring to the Canadian band and not American drug addict.
by Magnifico on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:02:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Oh yes.



keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:11:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I can see what you mean...Is that Lifeson on guitar? Frikkin brilliant!

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:16:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Have you read the Motorcycling round the Americas after personal tradgedy book?

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:16:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What, the "Zen &.." one ? Yea, several decades back. I have been looking for it in second hand shops cos I think i need to revisit it.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:19:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If it's the Zen and Oily Rags book, I think Chris C has cornered the market ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:26:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
No This one

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:33:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC News - Steam train's snow rescue 'glory'

Passengers were rescued by a steam locomotive after modern rail services were brought to a halt by the snowy conditions in south-east England.

Trains between Ashford and Dover were suspended on Monday when cold weather disabled the electric rail.

Some commuters at London Victoria faced lengthy delays until Tornado - Britain's first mainline steam engine in 50 years - offered them a lift.

They were taken home "in style", said the Darlington-built engine's owners.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 12:53:36 PM EST
how can they not have noticed they were being steam hauled ? Much as I love steam, the acceleration is rubbish compared to modern traction.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 01:01:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
is a beautiful sight.

Of course I think steam in any other season is beautiful too.

by Magnifico on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:00:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
{sigh}

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:14:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Looks like my breath this morning during my 70 minute walk to and from campus.  Wonderful feeling afterwards.

I love the smell of roast chicken in the morning!
by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:10:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I can assure you, your breath will not smell the same.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:18:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What does steam from this type of engine smell like?  Never been near one.

I love the smell of roast chicken in the morning!
by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:59:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Fire and brimstone.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith
by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 06:28:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Contented dragon.

It's the smell of high temperature coal, not the same as hearth coal as it's more tarry, mixed with a mid-note of oil.

but smells are hard-wired to memory and emotion. So it's also happiness and youth.

A child once defined love as the sound you can hear on Christmas morning if you stop unwrapping presents and really listen. A steam engine smells of that.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 08:43:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It is over 10C here today and raining. The low was above 5C so I have not bothered with a fire yesterday or today, preferring to save the wood for below freezing weather when the heat pump is less useful. But I did get a couple of day's firewood onto a covered porch yesterday and finished getting flower boxes and the metal baskets that support them put away under cover.

Last night we went to see Avatar.  I actually quite liked it. The Pandoran critters were quite believable. I once dreamed that I had been born with a tail. My mother indignantly denied it. The dream had been quite vivid, with sensations of twitching my tail.  Perhaps the Kundalini energy had been overactive.  The audience was mostly under 30, but well behaved, unlike my wife's party recent experienced on a weekend. I do hope that the overall message of atunement to the environment vs. the corporate view that "nature" is just dead and of unlimited exportability sinks in to their sensibilities.  

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer at eurotrib.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 01:31:00 PM EST
Good friend of ours saw and highly recommended it.  He also said to shell out the $2 to see it in 3D.

The last time I went to a movie theater I vowed I would never go to another.  Kept that vow for 6 six years.  Most movies I have zero interest in viewing and most of the rest I can view in the comfort of my own home, hear the soundtrack over my own sound system¹, not have someone coughing flu all over us (happened the last time) by buying/renting the DVD for 25%/1% of the cost of going to a theater.  

And we don't have to watch 27 trailers of previews for films the producers would have to give me money, free sex, and drugs to sit through.

But I guess I'll end-up going to this one.  I do want to see what is happening with 3D animation.  If nothing else I'll get a nice 2.5 hour nap.

¹  In New Mexico the soundtrack is considered an optional externality: great if the audience can hear but, in the general scheme of things, not all that important.

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:36:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I wasn't that impressed...

3D is not a better approximation of sight, it is damned unusual. And uncomfortable. It is a new medium (in its current guise), but is as relevant as the pop-up book is to world literature. The only thing that is driving this is beating file-sharers and physical unit pirates (espec. in Asia).

I shall probably see the damn thing - though a 10.30 am press show might assuage my guilt. I may even like it. But it is really the last firework in the Lumière display.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:46:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]
LOL

The audience in the picture looks like they are all eagerly awaiting the joys of root canal surgery.

Except for the lady third on your right who has apparently fallen asleep.

It's funny.  The techniques and technology of film making are progressing at a rapid clip.  Yet the process and practice of story-telling is heading ever-downward.  To quote Harlan Ellison, "It's like a dead rat embedded in a Lucite block."

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:57:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Finding the answer to that little conundrum is what we are about?

My standard lecture on the subject describes the 'concept editor': someone who can speak the language of many different groups, and translate visions between them. I aspire to be a concept editor. The group that is most tricky to deal with is the punters. Evolving all the time.

And the artistic question, as ever, is to what extent do you educate the punters and to what extent do you entertain them? A spoonful of tolerable medicine. And yet art, like advertising, is aimed at pointing out the inadequacies of the punter's life.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:09:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Whatever you do, it's elitist. ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:10:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Need an English to American translation.

By "punters" do you mean the audience or the backers of a film?

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:20:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Punters are them as buys the tickets.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:21:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But as I've said before, there are three sales processes in any project: selling to the group who you need to create critical creative mass, selling to the investors/pre-buyers/commissioning editors/publishers, and selling to the punters. All of them need different narratives.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:24:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I was thinking more of the product narrative than the (various) "sales campaigns."  

Oh, well.  Nothing to do with me.  I know too much, and too little, to want to get into the Film business.

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:49:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm not sure the bad and good distinctions (of e.g film-making) are useful any more. 100 years ago the distinction between fact and fiction was perceived as more clear. Back then they thought they knew what an 'oeuvre' was.

But I still claim that there is no such thing as an original 'oeuvre'. Never has been. Because for an 'oeuvre' to be successful in any way, it needs to communicate through what an audience knows or thinks it knows already. What the audience already knows about a 'work' is implicit in it's ability to vibrate the audience in some way - that is, a work must always reference what has gone before, otherwise it can have no 'meaning'.

The distinction between 'reality' and fiction was easier to smudge in the days of linear presentations. But in the non-linear life which we now lead (and have always lead), it becomes more difficult to control the psychedelic experience of life, and to divide what is real from what is not real.

The drone operators in Arkansas, directing drones in Afghanistan that kill people, play a video game. An extreme and trite example perhaps. IMO the next 10 years will be spent arguing about what is real. As ever ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:10:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
In a very real sense there is no Real.  It's all interpretations OF reality.  On the other hand, "interpreting reality" such that you can jump off a bride and fly is a quick learn in the limitations of interpretation.

In almost the same way, an artist's -- if we want to start throwing insults around - oeuvre cannot be singular because communication require some overlap in "vocabulary."  (I spare you the standard ATinNM discourse re: Piercean semiotics¹)  The desperate search for "originality" by western artists -- including film makers -- is a Modern (Post-Modern?) obsession, not a necessary aspect, part, or property of Art tho' it may be a necessary aspect, part, or property of the currently existing Art business.  

¹  You're welcome.

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 06:06:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
here's the evening's poetry, colman

ATinNM:

such that you can jump off a bride and fly

for the uxurious amongst us, that rings so true...

"Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do." Jim Hightower

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:15:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
ATinNM:
 The desperate search for "originality" by western artists -- including film makers -- is a Modern (Post-Modern?) obsession, not a necessary aspect, part, or property of Art tho' it may be a necessary aspect, part, or property of the currently existing Art business.  

mmm, chewy...

PNing a bit, but i see it a bit differently.

first of all, one may seek to be original in a manner that belies desperation, more of a quest for calm.

but if you sub novelty, then i agree.

just to carry a tradition on without undue embellishment, now there are many artists content with that, even making a living.

the art business makes more off of novelty, as the public rewards that more highly, as it reflects and accompanies the deconstruction of the past that is presently accelerating.

i would submit that the 'sweet spot' for a career artist is when he or she knows that the fans want something not too different from the last offering, but leaving room for evolution.

the worst would be to have to stay a step ahead of a zeitgeist that was slipping away faster than you can run, or conversely to have such a rigid fanbase that they wouldn't show up unless the artist were faithfully cloning their own pasts for them, with little or no room for growth, because that would be confusing and make them feel superannuated.

"Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do." Jim Hightower

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:29:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I think punters are customers in England...

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:59:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
UPDATED: Copernicus Grades Cameron On The Science of AVATAR!! -- Ain't It Cool News: The best in movie, TV, DVD, and comic book news.

First, a little background: I'm a professor of astrophysics who has
searched for planets, worked on SETI (Search for Extraterrestrial
Intelligence) programs, and taught classes on life in the universe.
Right now, I'm helping to build a global network of telescopes to
search for planets and supernovae.

That is a long-winded way of saying that it is part of my job
description to think about the possibility of life on other worlds.
So when James Cameron makes one of the most expensive movies ever
made, and one that puts us right in the middle of an alien culture... in
3D.... well to say I'm interested doesn't begin to cover it.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 07:36:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Sven
I wasn't that impressed...3D is not a better approximation of sight, it is damned unusual.

Remembering the 50s, I elected for us to see in in normal vision. We got seats in the last row, had no one in front of us and were able to see it as a movie vs. an experiment in a "new" visual technology. I DON'T like putting uncomfortable paper thingies over my glasses. From your reaction it sounds like I made a good choice.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer at eurotrib.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:36:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I too tend to prefer DVDs to cinemas with all those irritating people munching snacks, pushing one's seat, etc., but I will make an exception for this one and try to see it in 3-D.

There's a positive, in-depth (pardon pun) by Manohla Dargis in the NYT. More important than the 3-D was the other technology:

"Mr. Cameron has said that he started thinking about the alien universe that became Pandora and its galactic environs in "Avatar" back in the 1970s. He wrote a treatment in 1996, but the technologies he needed to turn his ideas into images didn't exist until recently. New digital technologies gave him the necessary tools, including performance capture, which translates an actor's physical movements into a computer-generated image (CGI).

...
 In keeping with his maximalist tendencies, Mr. Cameron has shot "Avatar" in 3-D ... an experiment that serves his material beautifully. This isn't the 3-D of the 1950s or even contemporary films, those flicks that try to give you a virtual poke in the eye with flying spears. Rather Mr. Cameron uses 3-D to amplify the immersive experience of spectacle cinema.
...

After a few minutes the novelty of people and objects hovering above the row in front of you wears off, and you tend not to notice the 3-D, which speaks to the subtlety of its use and potential future applications. Mr. Cameron might like to play with high-tech gadgets, but he's an old-fashioned filmmaker at heart, and he wants us to get as lost in his fictional paradise as Jake eventually does.

... one of the pleasures of the movies is that they transport us, as Neytiri does with Jake, into imaginary realms, into Eden and over the rainbow to Oz.

If the story of a paradise found and potentially lost feels resonant, it's because "Avatar" is as much about our Earth as the universe that Mr. Cameron has invented. But the movie's truer meaning is in the audacity of its filmmaking.

... Movies rarely carry us away, few even try. They entertain and instruct and sometimes enlighten. Some attempt to overwhelm us, but their efforts are usually a matter of volume. What's often missing is awe, something Mr. Cameron has, after an absence from Hollywood, returned to the screen with a vengeance. He hasn't changed cinema, but with blue people and pink blooms he has confirmed its wonder."

http://movies.nytimes.com/2009/12/18/movies/18avatar.html

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice. Blog - Nice Experience

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:59:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Very occasionally I regret not seeing a film on the Big Screen.  Memoirs of a Geisha leaps to mind.  Not sure if the visuals of the film came from the director Rob Marshall or the cinematographer Dion Bebee.  So I'll probably head to a theater to see Nine.

Anything by Ridley Scott needs to be seen in a theater.

The scenic shots of New Zealand in Lord of the Rings were stunning and some of the special effects shots were nice.  The rest, i.e., most, of the films ... not really.

POTENTIAL SPOILER FOLLOWS

One aspect of Avatar, if my Informed Sources are correct ;-), I find intriguing is the film's use of the Yggdrasil motif.  It was used in The Fountain but in such a disconnected way, and it's so unfamiliar with modern audiences, I doubt it came across.  
 

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:29:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Entirely boreal, my dear Watson.

Shades of: Tapio

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:34:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

....this I am looking forward ro....

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 06:12:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The movie The Fountain is one of our all time favorites and there are certain similarities to that and to Norse mythology in Avitar, but I would say the Pandoran sensibility is more that of the Native Americans at the time of European contact.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer at eurotrib.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:55:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
We saw Avatar at the IMAX.  It's definitely worth seeing in 3D.  In fact, it's probably only worth seeing in 3D (this is deftly handled, unlike, say, Disney's Christmas Carol, which is one obvious 3D set piece after another), because the script really isn't very good, the story tediously derivative, and some of the dialogue close to giggle-out-loud awful. We walked back to the train ticking off the films in which we'd seen the key scenes before. And one of us was 11.

I don't want to give the impression it was unalloyed suffering-it wasn't. And I stopped looking at my watch during the battle scenes at the end. But without the 3D, a very ordinary film.

by Sassafras on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:23:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm thinking that if you want to add depth to a film, shooting in 3D may not be the best way to do it.
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 06:11:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's again the McLuhan distinction between hot and cold media: hot media require you, the audience, to infer a great deal from the limited amount of data you are given. The process of inference is 'involving'. And since the inferences are individual, the audience can be 'involved' in many different ways.

Cold media, normally 'high-resolution', have fewer interpretation possibilities, and are thus usually more 'distant' from the audience. 3D points out that you are a consumer.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 07:01:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It is the lack of inference-the patronising tedium of being spoon-fed-that irritates me about a lot of films, including this one.

But, I have found that I'm drawn deeper into films by the experience of 3D. Something to do, I think, with the more "physically" immersive experience. Even though I haven't seen a 3D film yet that's actually all that good.

by Sassafras on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 09:09:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That's closer to it, I think. It's a beginner-level point in all kinds of story-telling and persuasion that you show, but you don't tell. Showing puts the action inside the reader's/viewer's head. Telling is distancing and irritating to anyone with even basic literarcy.

You get the best kind of writing when there's a scene where no one is saying or doing much, but you know exactly what they're thinking and feeling, what motivates them, and what their plans are.

Cameron is one of the people most responsible for reducing science fiction cinema to comic book narratives, especially from Aliens onwards, which elevated the grunts vs marines trope to the cliche that it's become today, in film and in print.

Compare with 2001, where there was so much showing and so little telling, especially at the end, that a lot of people had no conscious conception of what was happening - but they still had a sense that it was moving and even profound.

But 2001 assumed that audiences were aware enough to follow. Most recent films have left that assumption behind, and assume that audiences are made up of gum chewing fools out for a roller coaster ride and some eye candy.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Dec 24th, 2009 at 11:25:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 01:34:10 PM EST
I thought that if you oberve you can't know the date, but if you know the date you can't observe.

Or am I being too literal ?

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 01:46:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
So Observant Jews are the one group you can be sure dont know when Christmas is?

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:18:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Only if they know quantum physics.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:23:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Or Inclusive Middle Logics.

No one could have predicted
by ATinNM on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:38:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Some logics are only possible when you're not thinking them.
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:50:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Or: "So Observant Jews are the one group you can be sure don't know when Passover is!"--if they are physicists.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer at eurotrib.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:59:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, according to http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/p8550e/P8550E01.htm

In Iraq, the principal lamb­ing season of Awassi ewes is in No­vember, and in Lebanon, the Syrian Arab Republic and Israel in Decem­ber-January.

So if the flocks were being watched by night, it makes sense that it would be in December or January. Regardless of whether you're a physicist...

by asdf on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:32:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC News - Bernie Madoff moved to prison hospital

Disgraced Wall Street financier Bernie Madoff has been moved to the medical centre within the prison where he is serving 150 years for fraud.

He was transferred on 18 December, a spokeswoman at the Butner Federal Correctional Complex in the US state of North Carolina confirmed.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 02:53:14 PM EST
I feel a plea coming on

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:15:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Saunders Syndrome no doubt.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:30:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Exactly

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:16:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Given the number of wealthy people who would like to make an example of him, he'll live longer behind bars, assuming long life means anything to him now.

I wonder if he can still order out for women?

I love the smell of roast chicken in the morning!

by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:51:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
funny pictures of cats with captions


You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:36:22 PM EST
Foreign Policy: Dead Man Gets Passport

...the best technology can't keep a country safe when the bureaucracy behind it fails.
 
by Magnifico on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 03:43:50 PM EST
Snowy scenes - The Big Picture - Boston.com
Last Monday was December 21st - the Winter Solstice, or the shortest day of the year (in the Northern Hemisphere). The 21st would also have also been the first day of Nivôse, the first winter month of the long-abandoned French Republican Calendar, named after the Latin word nivosus, which, appropriately means "snow or snowy". Collected here are a handful of recent photographs of these snowy days for those of us in the north.


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 04:34:42 PM EST


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 05:15:47 PM EST
I think someone's pinched the blades for scrap...
by Sassafras on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:27:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It was really quite odd, you'd see the tip of a blade every now and then emerge from the fog. unfortunately s a passenger in a car on a dual carriageway, no control over pausing for picture taking.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:33:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
At least you could take a picture as a passenger ;)

I've given up attempts at "Take a picture, quick.  No, there. There! THERE! Oh, never mind," when I'm driving.

by Sassafras on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:45:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
took lots today though, snowy trees and buildings. grand day out.


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 at 09:55:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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