FT sowing division in EU to sink euro?

by Jerome a Paris
Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 05:42:01 PM EST

EU divided over Greek IMF bailout Non-eurozone countries, led by the UK and Sweden, on Tuesday broke from the public position of Germany, France and other euro area states by suggesting that, if Greece required help, the International Monetary Fund was best placed to supply it.

A Swedish official said “the IMF has the technical knowledge” while officials in London suggested the risk of financial contagion from the Greek crisis meant that it should not be regarded as a matter exclusively for the 16 eurozone countries.

Unnamed "officials" making rather innocuous comments get transformed into policy statements by major countries that suggest fundamental divisions within the EU?! What kind of game is the FT playing??


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Berlin looks to build Greek `firewall'

Financial markets surged on Tuesday on hopes of a European rescue plan for Greece, as officials in Berlin admitted it was looking at how to construct a "firewall" to prevent the debt crisis spiralling out of control.

A German government official said that the steep decline in the euro and pressure on bond prices had forced Berlin to "take a significant step" in how to deal with the crisis.



In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 05:46:44 PM EST
What are the details of "Greece's budget crisis"?

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 02:17:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What kind of game is the FT playing??

The kind that can be played in the face of high anxiety absent clear leadership?

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer at eurotrib.com) on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 06:00:34 PM EST
Crunch time.

Is the Eurozone serious about being a major currency or are you people farting around?  If I was a central banker I'd be looking at this kinda thing:

Sovereign debt problems in some euro zone countries have triggered a sell-off in the euro, but its decline may slow given overstretched positioning and signs the euro-bashing trade has become one-sided.

The latest Commodity Futures Trading Commission data shows the number of net short euro positions -- effectively bets that it will depreciate -- rose to nearly 44,000 last week, levels last seen during the market chaos that ensued after Lehman Brothers collapsed in late 2008.

Euro/Dollar:

I'll note a butterfly trading position can be very profitable when the underlying market is whipsawing.  

Especially if you're a Market Maker and don't have to pay commissions.

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 06:34:00 PM EST
"you people" = ECB'ers.


No one could have predicted
by ATinNM on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 06:59:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Who gives a shit what non-eurozone countries think?
by paving on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 08:01:09 PM EST
The Serious People do.

- Jake

"Terraforming your own planet to make it uninhabitable hardly counts as epic win." - ThatBritGuy

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 08:32:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]
the things actually said by the quoted officials (that worries about Greece or Portugal could also impact Sweden or the UK, so they wanted their own worries to be taken into account) were not unreasonable per se. What was inappropriate was to turn these remarks by officials into official national policies and then one step further into "EU division"

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 05:03:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Narrative building 101.

And, as Quatremer says, the FT is the only paper read by market operators. So they set the conventional wisdom. And conventional wisdom is what markets reflect.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 05:08:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well for my own self interest, I hope the euro approaches parity with the U.S. dollar so I can once again afford to visit. If the euro dips below or approaches close to €1 = $1 then I'm buying. For right now, I'm just hoping it drops and have been for years.
by Magnifico on Tue Feb 9th, 2010 at 11:09:33 PM EST
Sterling weakens as eurozone's problems unsettle the markets - Times Online
Sterling tumbled to an eight-and-a-half-month low against the dollar yesterday as investors, worried about the continuing fiscal difficulties of some eurozone countries, fled to the safety of the greenback.


notes from no w here
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 03:57:48 AM EST
Keyboard froze, so I couldn't add this comment to quote above: So the Euro is causing Sterling's problems?  Bad boy Euro!

notes from no w here
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 03:59:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That's what happens when you're a peripheral currency of a larger currency area.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 04:23:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I am amazed each time I read something like "the safety of the greenback".
Uh?

"Few can believe that suffering, especially by others, is in vain. - Galbraith"
by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 04:02:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
For US investors, naturally.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 04:22:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That's what they think.
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 05:27:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And that's why the US$ is up: for no other reason than US-based investors are divesting from foreign-denominated assets, for no other reason than they believe US treasuries are a safe haven.

What baffles me is that we can have most of the finance ministers of the EU with their pants in twist over the conventional wisdom of US-based investors.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 08:46:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Jean Quatremer, in his Backstage Brussels blog, has been telling the story of the attack on the euro for a while now. He relates how the Greek launch of 5-year bonds (at an attractive but not exorbitant rate) was a success: €5bn wanted, €25bn offered, €8bn finally sold. After this the (totemic) spread on Greek-German 10-year bonds eased. But two days later (Wed 27 Jan) the spread jumped up again, and by Thursday stood at 385 base points, a sign markets were betting on Greece being ejected from the euro.

Rachida Dati et la dette grecque - Coulisses de Bruxelles, UERachida Dati and Greek debt - Backstage Brussels, EU
La raison de ce brutal décrochage ? Un article du Financial Times, le seul journal que lisent les opérateurs de marché, qui affirmait mercredi que la Chine venait de refuser d'acheter 25 milliards d'euros d'emprunt grec, un « placement privé » porté par la banque américaine d'affaire Goldman Sachs. Ce sera démenti plus tard, mais les marchés en profiteront pour exiger d'Athènes une prime de risque encore plus élevée, pour leur plus grand bénéfice.The reason for this brutal break-away? An article in the Financial Times, the only paper read by market operators, said on Wednesday that China had just refused to buy €25bn of Greek debt, a "private investment" mediated by US merchant bank Goldman Sachs. This would later be denied, but the markets used it to demand a higher risk premium from Athens, for their greater profit.

It's not easy to check back in the FT for the article he refers to (and he gives no link grr), but it's probably this one:

So Quatremer's narrative is already that the FT set the markets off on the attack last week.

Yesterday he says the speculation was easing off as operators unwound positions that might get stomped by ECB/EU action in support of Greece.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 04:28:11 AM EST
Note: Rachida Dati has nothing to do with Greek debt. She's there, says Quatremer, to draw more eyeballs to the blog post.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 04:31:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
last week the week before last.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 04:33:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
was big news last week, yes.

The more recent story is that GS and some hedge funds were under served in that debt offering and were not happy with that situation...

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 05:01:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What, they got outbid and are all pissy about it?

They could have bid more if they wanted a bigger share of the pie. That's what a market is about, isn't it?

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 05:09:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Big news, perhaps, but Quatremer accuses the FT of having set fire to Greek debt interest rates two weeks ago. I don't know if it's that simple...

There's an interesting coincidence, however, between the €25bn bid for the debt offering, and the supposed €25bn offer to China mediated by GS.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 05:14:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
nice, huh, how the whole planet is on an auction block, and china's the richest (almost only) bidder.

the auctioneers being the kindly souls who brought us the credit crunch, spawning summers and geithner along the way, adds a piquant twist to the tale.

wanna be owned by the saudis, or the chinese?

interesting also that they, with all their own story of domestic poverty, are getting the taste for high stakes international gambling on greece's economy, or in this case, not biting.

any one here feel that greece has a chance of pulling out of the red without the streets filling with the disgruntled, to the point nothing can contain their feelings?

what prevision or provision, or any kind of vision have they to counter the twin bogeys of climate change or peak oil?

they could be a solar leading edge euro nation, have they even considered incentives, i wonder?

maybe they're still in national PTSD from the colonels... the pakistan of europe, in that way.

papandreu doesn't seem like a fool, to my ignorant media-eye, but then neither does karzai, lol.

"Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do." Jim Hightower

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 08:11:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
A few days ago Simon Johnson gave the testimony to congress that the IMF is, in his view, completely ill-equipped to step into the Greek situation.
Would anyone care to illuminate that issue?
Why would he say that?

Why do I hear echoes of "Europe is Doomed!" from an economist whom I often admire?

Is he right about the IMF, and could we have failed to see some of the pieces of the puzzle here?

Grabbing what you can, as John Ruskin said, isn't any less wicked when you grab it with the power of your brains than with the power of your fists.

by geezer in Paris (risico at wanadoo(flypoop)fr) on Wed Feb 10th, 2010 at 10:55:25 PM EST
Well, the bullet points here about the IMF seem to make sense in that regard.  What about his assessment of the European part?  For instance:

"Going to the IMF" brings with it a great deal of stigma.  European governments are unwilling to take such a step as it could well be their last.

Greece and the other weak eurozone countries need euro loans, not any other currency.  If the IMF lent euros, that would be distinctly awkward - as this is what the European Central Bank (ECB) is supposed to control.

Or, to give the cynical view -- since the IMF operates as a loan shark to 'third world' countries, perhaps they feel the odds of Greece signing over its public infrastructure is low.

Maybe we can eventually make language a complete impediment to understanding. -Hobbes

by Izzy (izzy at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 12:57:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You make a very good point which is that foreign debt is toxic and that Greece's problem is not one of foreign debt.

Iceland imploded because of its foreign currency exposure - that is not going to happen to the Eurozone countries in any event.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 04:34:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'd need to get more info on the reasoning here, because I don't see anything [Europe.Is.Doomed™ Alert] about noting that the IMF is ill-equipped to help European countries.

The IMF is ill-equipped to help, full stop. Its track record over the last twenty years consists virtually exclusively of turning disasters into catastrophes.

- Jake

"Terraforming your own planet to make it uninhabitable hardly counts as epic win." - ThatBritGuy

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 04:26:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'd need to get more info on the reasoning here, because I don't see anything [Europe.Is.DoomedTM Alert] about noting that the IMF is ill-equipped to help European countries.
Revised Baseline Scenario: February 9, 2010
Caution: this is a long post (about 3,000 words).  The main points are in the first few hundred words and the remainder is supportive detail.  This material was the basis of testimony to the Senate Budget Committee today by Simon Johnson.
Accordingly, I think it is appropriate to just quote the first part. Detail can be found at the link to Baseline Scenario above.
A.    Main Points

...

  1. But thinking in terms of these headline numbers masks a much more worrying dynamic.  A major sovereign debt crisis is gathering steam in Europe, focused for now on the weaker countries in the eurozone, but with the potential to spillover also to the United Kingdom.  These further financial market disruptions will not only slow the European economies - we estimate growth in the euro area will fall to around 0.5 percent Q4 on Q4 (the IMF puts this at 1.1 percent, but the January World Economic Outlook update was prepared before the Greek crisis broke in earnest) - it will also cause the euro to weaken and lower growth around the world.
  2. There are some European efforts underway to limit debt crisis to Greece and to prevent the further spread of damage.  But these efforts are too little and too late.  The IMF also cannot be expected to play any meaningful role in the near term.  Portugal, Ireland, Italy, Greece, and Spain - a group known to the markets as PIIGS, will all come under severe pressure from speculative attacks on their credit.  These attacks are motivated by fiscal weakness and made possible by the reluctance of relatively strong European countries to help out the PIIGS.  (Section B below has more detail.)
  3. Financial market participants buy and sell insurance for sovereign and bank debt through the credit default swap market.  None of the opaqueness of the credit default swap market has been addressed since the crisis of September 2008, so it is hard to know what happens as governments further lose their credit worthiness.  Generalized counter-party risk - the fear that an insurer will fail and thus bring down all connected banks - is again on the table, as it was after the collapse of Lehman.
  4. Another Lehman/AIG-type situation lurks somewhere on the European continent, and again G7 (and G20) leaders are slow to see the risk.  This time, given that they already used almost all their scope for fiscal stimulus, it will be considerably more difficult for governments to respond effectively if the crisis comes.
  5. In such a situation, we should expect that investors scramble for the safest assets available - "cash", which means short-term US government securities.  It is not that the US has anything approaching a credible medium-term fiscal framework, but everyone else is in much worse shape.
...


En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 04:39:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

It is not that the US has anything approaching a credible medium-term fiscal framework, but everyone else is in much worse shape.

This is silly. Germany is clearly not in a worse shape, for one. and Germany is the country that matters here.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 05:23:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
In such a situation, we should expect that investors scramble for the safest assets available - "cash", which means short-term US government securities.  It is not that the US has anything approaching a credible medium-term fiscal framework, but everyone else is in much worse shape.
But you're right, the decision to go to short-term US tresury securities is not based on any actual comparison of medium-term fiscal prospects.

After all, who cares about medium-term fiscal prospects when you're trading three-month bills?

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 05:41:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
A major sovereign debt crisis is gathering steam in Europe, focused for now on the weaker countries in the eurozone, but with the potential to spillover also to the United Kingdom.
Recall Willem Buiter's blog post How likely is a sterling crisis or: is London really Reykjavik-on-Thames? (November 13, 2008)
The risk of a triple crisis - a banking crisis, a currency crisis and a sovereign debt default crisis - is always there for countries that are afflicted with the inconsistent quartet identified by Anne Sibert and myself in our work on Iceland: (1) a small country with (2) a large internationally exposed banking sector, (3) a currency that is not a global reserve currency and (4) limited fiscal capacity.

...

How and to what degree is this relevant to the UK? Iceland is a tiny country (about 300,000 people - the size of the city of Coventry). The UK has a population of over 61 million. Nevertheless, the UK is a small open economy for economic purposes: it is a price taker in the markets for its imports and exports and in global financial markets. Its share of world GDP in 2007 was 3.3% (at PPP exchange rates - somewhat higher at market exchange rates). Its currency is no longer a serious world reserve currency.

The UK banking sector's balance sheet is about half the size of the Icelandic banking sector as a share of annual GDP: just under 450% at the end of 2007 as compared to Iceland's almost 900%. Switzerland, another vulnerable country (small, no currency with global reserve currency status , large banking sector relative to GDP and limited central government fiscal capacity) has a banking sector balance sheet of just over 650% of annual GDP. With UK annual GDP around £1.5 trillion, that gives us a banking sector balance sheet of well over £ 6 trillion.

That should be the real worry, and is likely why, in the FT quote above the fold in this diary
officials in London suggested the risk of financial contagion from the Greek crisis meant that it should not be regarded as a matter exclusively for the 16 eurozone countries


En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 05:57:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Why was the US Congress debating whether the IMF should step in on Greece or not?

But, then again, the US has veto in the IMF and it is only natural that the US Congress would want to be informed of the US government's line at the IMF and possibly instruct the executive what they think the US should be advocating at the IMF.

So, the question becomes, why don't European parliaments have similar discussion in public view? When Spain was invited to the G20 meetings all you could read about in the Spanish press was whether or not Spain would go, and how pleased everyone was that Spain finally went, but not one line about what exactly Spain's position would be at the meetings, or even calls for this position to be made explicit.

En un viejo país ineficiente, algo así como España entre dos guerras civiles, poseer una casa y poca hacienda y memoria ninguna. -- Gil de Biedma

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Feb 11th, 2010 at 04:32:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]


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