UK Elections: the Endgame

by ChrisCook
Tue May 11th, 2010 at 09:45:35 AM EST

I think the Lib Dems are going to jump with the Tories.

Labour are leaderless, fractured and knackered. Moreover, quite a few of them think it's a good election to lose.

One of the most interesting aspects of this election for me has been the resurgence of Labour at local level, particularly in urban locations.

Labour wins at local level show party still strong | LabourList.org 2.0.2 | LabourList.org

Labour has made significant gains in some of Thursday's local council elections, taking back a number of councils across the country.

Labour won 51% of the vote in Liverpool, winning the council back from the Lib Dems.

In Barking, Labour won all 51 council seats, while the BNP - who previously held eleven council seats - were able to return none.

In Hackney, Labour won a landslide over the Lib Dems, 50 seats to 3.

In Islington, Labour won twelve new councillors, and defeated the Lib Dems comprehensively, by 35-13. 

Enfield was won back from the Tories, and Coventry, Doncaster, Hartlepool, Oxford and St Helens were all won from no overall control. Camden was also won back from a Tory/Lib Dem coalition.

Across the country, Labour gained 249 new seats, while the Tories lost 78 and the Lib Dems lost 62.

Nathan Yeowell, head of the Labour group at the Local Government Association, said:

"The fightback has to begin at the grassroots level and in local councils. This is a platform from where we can fight back if there is a Tory administration and prove we are a viable alternative capable of providing services and protecting the needy and vulnerable who might be put at risk by cuts."


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An interesting speculation, but based on what rumour ? I still find the idea of a Con-Lib alliance difficult to fathom.

The tories right wing, which is the dominant wing by some margin, HATE the idea, especially as it comes with the possibility of a change to the voting system. They didn't like the Blond-ite "compassionate conservatism" sheep's clothing Cameron wore for the duration, but they put up with it on the promise of Victory. Now that hasn't happened, they want real conservatism on the basis that the public would obviously have voted for right wing conservatism but chose to support other, more left-ish parties, if this real conservatism wasn't on offer. (No, it doesn't make any sense to me either).

As for the Libs. I think a majority of the party would be aghast at the idea of putting Cameron in office. They might not revolt immediately, but give them a week or two to organize ....

It may sound neat on paper, but it's political nitro-glycerine.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:13:26 AM EST
Twitter's gone awful quiet today.

I presume the news channels are still breathlessly talking about nothing?

My favorite shot yesterday was a BBC high aerial shot of Westminster "This is the scene at the Houses of Parliament" - as if this contained any information whatsoever.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:18:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Might have revealed more information.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:22:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Ah, it did contain information. It said, "the BBC has hired a helicopter at a ridiculous hourly rate, so we have to show you some pictures of breathless inaction as if they was newsworthy in case some of you ungrateful wretches start muttering about "waste of public money".

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:24:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

17.000 bucks and it's yours, HD camera included.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:46:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What's the max wind strength it can cope with. I'm not sure much of the UK has the calm for such a toy.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:51:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's self-balancing in a mild wind, but otherwise you have to fly upwind and then track back into the wind. The harder the motors have to work the shorter the battery time. But these things do work in minus 20 C.

We thought of investing in one, but it can only lift 500 gms (which has to include telemetry equipment). That could include a fairly good 1080' HD camera, but not good enough for movies. We explored a dirigible solution, but that would have had to lift maybe 10 kilos (A Red camera body alone is 4.5 kilos). Then we abandoned the project ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:00:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
A couple of Labour ministers - including Andy Burnham -have come out against it.

For the Lib Dems, the prospect of Power will be just too seductive, especially since they've been out of power for getting on for a hundred years. The Lib Dems sold their soul to Labour in Scotland, and after a couple of years were dropped on their arse with Labour.

With current UK governance, it's lose/lose. If it goes well, the Tories will get the credit, if (when) it goes badly they're both fucked.

I have a grisly fascination at the prospect of what's coming next. I truly believe we will now see the end of the ghastly economic consensus we have had.

The good thing about having the Lib Dems in coalition is that they will not put up with the authoritarian government necessary to deal with the inevitable effects of the neo-liberal economic policies cutting the economy back to health.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:34:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I truly believe we will now see the end of the ghastly economic consensus we have had.

Not from the tories you won't. Nor from the NuLab filth infesting Labour's benches.

So those authoritarian policies will be needed cos once the Middle classes realise they're in danger too all bets are off.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:49:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Keep predicting different things and you may end up being right! ;)
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 10:39:33 AM EST
I think that what we have seen happen was in line with that Diary, actually, except that Clegg was not a party to the strategy.

I think that Mandelson/Campbell's aim was to engineer their man - Miliband - into pole position in a Lab/Lib pact and that Brown's resignation announcement - to which he has been reconciled for at least a week IMHO - was timed to bugger up Lib Con discussions.

BBC News - Election 2010 - Live coverage - General Election 2010

1602

The BBC's Jon Pienaar says talks between the Lib Dems and the Tories are now at the final "dotting the Is and crossing the Ts" stage. To use the metaphor of poker, Labour have folded and thrown in their cards.

 

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:05:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
ChrisCook:
except that Clegg was not a party to the strategy.

Pretty big except...

I've thought all along that Cameron was the most likely next PM, whether there's a formal coalition with the LibDems or not.

Whatever happens, the LibDems will have the power to bring the next government down. Yet what they would most want to extort from a government (or senior party in a coalition), electoral reform, is what the government will do all in its power not to give.

Complicated times ahead.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:34:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
afew:
Whatever happens, the LibDems will have the power to bring the next government down.

The problem is that this would bring the government down on top of themselves.

Interesting times indeed.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:44:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC: BREAKING NEWSNumber 10 recognises that talks with the Lib Dems have not and will reach not any positive conclusion, and they are now discussing the method of declaring that their side of the negotiation is over, BBC Radio 5 Live's political correspondent Jon Pienaar says.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:02:38 AM EST
So Lib/Lab coalition.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:03:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So no Lib/Lab coalition.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:04:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Nope.

The BBC are saying that the bombshell announcement yesterday by Brown was instrumental in getting the Tories to raise their bid......

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:12:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Jesus H Christ on an exploding unicycle - how much more useless could NuLab be?

Good to see John 'Psycho' Reid getting his revenge from beyond the grave.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:41:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC - Nick Robinson's Newslog: Signs that it may soon all be over

* A senior Lib Dem who's sympathetic to Labour who just told me the deal couldn't be done.

* News that, at last night's Liberal Democrat parliamentary meeting, not one but all four party negotiators reported back their fear that Labour was not serious about negotiations and was, instead, turning its minds to the forthcoming leadership contest.

* The fact that Vince Cable, who's so far kept his counsel, told the same meeting that though he had roots in the Labour Party he too feared that there might be only one serious offer.

* Andy Burnham apparently joining David Blunkett, John Reid, Tom Harris et al in telling his party that they should accept they have lost.

* The resumption of talks between the Tories and the Lib Dems.

* The sight of Gordon Brown's allies heading to Downing Street perhaps for one last farewell.

* The clincher for many, though, will be the sight of John Prescott calling for something he spent years fighting against - an alliance with the Liberals.



Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith
by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:15:38 AM EST
David Cameron to give a speech at St Stephens Club shortly

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:16:31 AM EST
A Conservative government for the UK could hardly come at a worse time for the European Union. Hell, New Labour were bad enough.

In practice, I can hardly see the Libdems going along with the Tories repatriating sovereignty as they have promised... so presumably there will be no major change on that.

Or will the Libdems keep their mouths shut and go along with the unacceptable, in the forlorn hope of getting serious electoral reform?

Ah the joys of sex when you're the junior coalition partner... no diagrams necessary, surely.

by eurogreen on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:21:52 AM EST
Apparently Labour talks foundered over "Civil Liberties issues" so what was that? ID cards?

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:22:24 AM EST
Could be the topic they were on when someone slipped a note, "aw, fock this, time to shut up shop and get ready for next election".


Utsukushikereba sore de ii
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 07:42:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Gordon Brown quits as PM as Lib-Dem deal falls apart | News

Gordon Brown is set to resign tonight and allow David Cameron to be Britain's new Prime Minister.

The Labour leader's final desperate attempt to cling on to power with a Lib-Lab deal crumbled amid a rebellion on his own side and policy disagreements with Liberal Democrat leader Nick Clegg.

This afternoon he retreated to No 10 to discuss his situation with senior ministers, friends and wife Sarah.

Mr Brown had planned to stay in power until the summer if the deal had worked, earning himself a place in history as the man who won a historic fourth term for Labour.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:22:37 AM EST
So Historic Blair Fourth term then.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:25:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Hopes of Labour-Liberal Democrat coalition foundering in face of revolt by MPs | Politics | guardian.co.uk

Hopes of a Lib-Lab coalition deal were foundering today in face of a revolt by Labour MPs opposed to any deal and angered at the lack of consultation.

The scale of the revolt, led by former home secretaries John Reid and David Blunkett, reflects anger across the parliamentary party that Labour is being bounced into a deal with Liberal Democrats.

Gordon Brown, who announced his resignation yesterday in order to open the way for a deal, was in the Commons today partly to try to shore up the mood of Labour MPs.

Alan Johnson, the home secretary, rushed out a statement in support of a deal to try to boost the pro-coalition forces, but Liberal Democrats appear to have got the clear message that any coalition with Labour will be inherently unstable.

Some Lib Dem negotiators were unimpressed by the demeanour of the Labour negotiators, claiming they showed no real interest in a deal.

In short, the Lib Dems saw they couldn't really trust Labour, something they've instinctively believed for quite some time, and figured they were better off getting what they could from Cameron.

And the world will live as one

by Montereyan (robert at calitics dot com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:24:51 AM EST
bloody purists !!! what is it with left leaning parties that they prefer solitary powerless purity over the power to achieve.

And how come these people were able to swallow their ideology whole when NuLab were scattering neocon idocies all over the manifesto, but suddenly, {holds pansies to nose} they're committed to the path of truth and purity.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:08:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
They probably imagine that the Lib-con pact will fall apart within 18 months, there will be an election in reaction to tory austerity and the public will rush back into the embrace of Socialism the Labour Party NuLab conservative-lite.

Meanwhile they can have their succession battles and ideological turmoils out of the public spotlight and return to the fray refreshed.

Good luck with that.


keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:15:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The Tories really want power whereas Labour really wants to engage in internecine warfare. Who would you rathar have as a partner?

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:27:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Put like that it sounds right.

I just don't think there's an internal battle of great import coming up in the Labour party.

It's either;-
Brown-ite neocon capitulation to the City, increased authoritarianism, surveillance and a smidge of social concern to pretend the Labour party means something,
or;-
Blair-ite neocon capitulation to the City, increased authoritarianism, surveillance and a smidge of social concern to pretend the Labour party means something.

Which may not be as wide as difference as some of them imagine. All they're arguing about is who's the captain of a sinking ship. They need a recognition of what the party is for; that median wage is 23,000 and wage inequality has gone rapidly in the wrong direction and the whole ethos of society should be changed. And, for the good of the economy, the City must be hobbled to serve the Country, not vice versa. but that's not gonna happen till this generation have gone and the party is refreshed with a new breed of angry activists desperate to take power back.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:43:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I disagree.

At local level there has been a great deal of activism, and something of a renaissance in urban areas. But there has been very little of the conventional old labour ideology, and a lot of synergy with the communitarian campaigns of Citizens UK.

I think that the Living Wage campaign is a sign of things to come. Mutualism and cooperativism are entirely congruent with this, and are also on a genuine roll in Labour thinking outside the Bunker. Labour are actually capable of implementing a meaningful 'Big Society'. The Tories are not, because at the end of the day they simply do not DO Solidarity and the Common Good.

In terms of personalities, I think that Jon Cruddas - whom I met at a TUC gig in Newcastle - is a class act, and that he will be a key player in whatever comes next. Of the existing crop, I think Ed Miliband is one of the few in with a shout in due course.

The Labour Party this time next year will look very different, I believe, and I do not think Blair-ism and Brown-ism will play much of a part in it.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:08:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If that is what is happening just below Parliamentary level, then these are promising developments.

However, the current crop of MPs and first-preference candidates have been carefully selected and parachuted into constituencies over the last 15 years to create a Westminster party of a particular ideological bent; ie NuLab. Whatever happens elsewhere in the party, these people will have to move on before there can be significant improvements with regard to who is grasping the levers of power.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:26:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Going to 'Out' myself, here.

As a long time Mutualist I don't see how you are going to 'get it done' in the UK without extensive land reform.  Land, by that I mean "dirt," ownership in the UK is horrifically unfair, anti-Public Good, and a substantial barrier to restarting economic activity.

Plus you've got the damn CAP system supporting the whole thing.

Even mentioning the words, I would expect, would cause pearl clutching vapors in the entire Ruling Elites: Con, Lab, Lib/Dem.  AND you will run smack into the monarchy who, lets face it, practically own the whole island.  

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:43:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I agree with everything you say.

But there's more than one way to skin the cat, and the fact of the matter is IMHO that our existing financial system is terminally broken.

As I have posted here, I think that the consequences of the direct instantaneous connections of a networked financial system will be an evolution to a completely new architecture. Implicit within that will be a direct approach to investment in land/location which dis-intermediates the conventional deficit-based mechanism, and leads to a transition of intermediaries to a role as service providers. This is in fact in their interests, since it reduces the capital requirement to that necessary to cover operating costs.

The Internet interprets Ruling Elites as damage and routes around them.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 02:19:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But there's more than one way to skin the cat, and the fact of the matter is IMHO that our existing financial system is terminally broken.

Absolute agreement from me.  

The trick is, broken systems can keep chugging along for decades if they are dissipative ... meaning, roughly, if all the 'forces' for change don't combine to move the system to 'something else.'  The whole point of the Ruling Elites is to prevent that from happening.  So, what we see historically is everything going right along until the whole thing collapses, to a greater or lesser degree.    

You and Sven and several others place a great deal more faith in the Internet than I do.  Example, some fairly knowledgeable people - people I trust as an Information Source - claim there are entities that capture and analyze all internet traffic between the US and Europe.  Given existing technology it is possible to 'brute force' a mimicry of Human Cognitive and Natural Language processing IF you're willing to throw 100 or more million dollars at the problem.  There's two operational results from that:

  1.  It is (potentially) possible to interdict Internet traffic from one site, or even one person & all that that implies

  2.  It is (potentially) possible to interdict all Internet traffic except for the chosen

And there's the existing capability to take down the 'Internet' while still allowing internet communication: email, blogs, twitter, etc., for chosen sites and people.  As we have seen recently in Iran.

Mobile communication is even easier to control since the basic software to accomplish the mission is inherent in the design.  And we saw that in Iran, too.

Monitoring this traffic allows deducing Formal and Informal patterns and patternings of communication.  Which has all nice & juicy intelligence 'stuff' I won't go into.  

Monitoring this traffic allows insertion of mis-information and other intelligence operations geared to "mucking-up" the flow of information within the target(s) degrading the Quality of information flow.  

My assessment, then, is depending on the Internet as a sina qua non of "The Revolution" is a mug's game.  


No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 03:07:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This is why I have been so interested in WiMax, and competing systems, as localized citywide nets that can also operate independently of the Internet as a whole. I see decentralized city systems as one answer to the risks you cite.  I also see them as capable of 'denationalizing' a population and increasing diversity. The overlaying of geographical communities on virtual communities is something that's being experimented with in several European countries - The Netherlands has been a leader in this, but also the Nordics. Many universities have overlaid communities already - a system that needs scaling up to town size. That technology will be with us soon.

There are other ways to do it - like cascading wifi, which links all the little 50 metre domestic nodes - but WiMax will spread faster imo. I'm no tech expert though.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 03:49:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I know a Communications and Information Systems Expert who would be willing to relocate if the package was right.  His knowledge and depth of theoretical and practical aspects of Communication and Information is vast, extensive, and (dare I say) even useful.

I highly recommend him.

;-)

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 04:53:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I really don't know how all these social networking systems might fit together, though some friends and I spend quite a lot of time talking about pieces of it. And your expressed scepticism is good: we can only move on to socially, politically and economically fair systems if all aspects are considered and discussed. But something is happening on a major scale and IMO the Internet or any other form of rapid peer-to-peer low cost interaction is at the heart of it. When that is joined together with local communities, it changes the whole flow of information within society. The ramifications of that are really worth discussing.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 05:16:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Technologically, the Internet is incredibly easy to break and is a long way from being independent. No technology - including WiMax - can fix that.

As a narrative, the Internet is becoming more influential. There's now a huge and growing gap between bullshit MSM story-telling of the sort we've all seen over the last few days, and direct participation.

The most obvious thing about the BBC and Sky coverage was how infantile and passified it was. Viewers are clearly supposed to be awed and humbled as the great and the good take very, very important decisions on their behalf.

This might have worked fifty years ago and it may work on some of the population today. But a lot of people know it's bullshit, and they resent it.

Unfortunately blogging isn't an alternative to influence - it just feels like one, and while it's a fine safety valve it hasn't yet had much of an effect on policy.

The most encouraging moment was the demo outside Clegg's window and the mess it made of Sky's presentation. If that demo had been big enough and sustained enough to last from Thursday onwards, I don't think we'd have seen the Lib Dem sell-out.

The corollary is that influence depends on numbers and on perceived leverage. The Internet on its own is an impotent tool of political influence. But when it's taken into the real world it has the potential to unite people into more effective personal political participation.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 05:31:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What I found interesting, and hopeful, was the FaceBook page some students put up 'bout an HOUR after they were locked-out of the voting booth.  I learned about it on the some - don't remember which - Brit election re-twitter page.

And there was a vibrant discussion (read: bitch session and shouting match) almost as soon as it went 'live.'

That's pretty damn amazing.


No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 05:44:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It is, but it had no effect on the outcome - and worse, it creates an illusion of representation and participation where none actually exists.

It's the same with the BBC's 'Have Your Say' comments section - they're edited, but I doubt they're read by anyone who actually matters, and if they are they don't have anything like the influence of the network of incestuous relationships that the supposedly great and good use to maintain themselves in power.

Change won't happen until it becomes possible to break into and influence those networks, or it becomes policy that those networks should be as public as possible.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 05:50:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The Internet is a communication medium.  Another trite example (I'm into trite today, apparently): you telephone people to tell them about a political action, wouldn't expect the 'phone call to BE the political action.  But the telephone call and/or calls, e.g., work a telephone tree,  the more people are aware of the action which is a necessary for having lots of people show up and engage in the action.

No one could have predicted
by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 06:07:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]
P/N

You're jumping to the conclusion data flow is the same as Information flow. Trite counterexample: you can call me on your brand new Nokia N900 SmartPhone and jabber Finnish at me all day long at a humongous sent data transmission rate.  I'd receive every bit of data; my information received would be, "Duh?"

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 05:39:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
When in fact your response should be"Täh?"

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 03:28:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But that is what computers do best: see patterns where we cannot.

You obviously missed my comment on Jibbigo.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:32:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
They currently can't see anything, which is one of the problems.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:40:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
infer, surmise, datamine, detect, recognize, visualize data, etc etc

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 06:50:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Neither can politicians. So there's no reason in principle not to replace parliament with an iPhone app.
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:06:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... four or five dissident backbenchers could threaten to take down the government by forming a splinter party.

Not as if four dissidents have ever split off from the Labour party before to break from the Libs ... oh, no, that was four splitting off to join the Libs.


Utsukushikereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 07:45:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
So Labour has given up and is looking to the next election.

No one could have predicted
by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:51:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Slight error.

So Labour has given up and is looking to the next election.

There. Fixed.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:56:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
SCOOP. Guardian snapper Graeme Robertson photographs Nick Clegg's hand-written note - LD minister in every department?


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:22:56 PM EST
 I like his red lines. Just watch him fold.
by eurogreen on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:27:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Fresh from the Grauniad:

They photographed his notes.
"Red Lines :
Europe
Immig
Trident"

by eurogreen on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:23:55 PM EST
Oh. Bugger. According to the Grauniad, those would be the Tories' red lines!

I used to have a soft spot for the libdems. Sort of.

by eurogreen on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:36:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
How can Clegg possibly go along with Trident?  That thing is a 100 million pound plus interest bit of pointlessness.  He came out against it, rather famously, during the debates saying more-or-less that.

No one could have predicted
by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:03:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Easy, the Labour party have already made the commitment, so the spend is authorised and continues until it's stopped.

If it is never discussed, then it never arises. So they agree that, as a point of contention, it will not be discussed. Simples.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:06:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If it's a Done Thing then why is it a Conservative Red Line?

Doesn't make sense.


No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:14:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It was a tory red line in case the LDP insisted that, as a pre-condition for the allaince, that Trident went. It evidently never arose.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:19:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That POS is going to be a money sink for the next 20 years!

As bad, if not worse, than that stupid aircraft carrier Labour bought 4-5 years ago.

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:48:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Pointless military spending is as sacrosanct here as it is over your way.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 02:15:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
He said electoral reform -- which AV doesn't seem to come anywhere near to qualifying for -- was also a precondition for a coalition.  So...yeah.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:20:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
VIVAAAAAAAAAAAAA POSHBOOOOOOOOOOOYY!

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 12:40:41 PM EST
Now, now.  Cameron is a Man of the People™.



No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:13:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
LibDemz and Toriez innit?

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith
by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:22:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hug-A-Hoodie!

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 01:35:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ed Balls now on BBC saying talks w LDs broke down on, among other things, faster deficit reduction including cuts this year.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 03:15:56 PM EST
I agree. To me, it looks like the reality has settled in that neither Labour nor the Tories can/will offer the proportional representation election. So, with that fantasy/dream finally out of the way, the PTB pressure for 'stable govt' (i.e., big majority govt) will work and the LibDems will 'have to' join the conservatives. In less than 24 hours, is my humble guess.

fairleft
by fairleft (fairleftatyahoodotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 03:25:42 PM EST
... with 2nd preference voting, if they survive the next election, within 20 years they could be back in government.


Utsukushikereba sore de ii
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 07:48:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But neither Labour nor the Tories want to and/or can really offer a PR referendum. We already knew the Tories couldn't, but it looks like Labour has too many dissenters to confidently offer the referendum either. Why would Labour give up first-past-the-post, when they can see from this election that the LibDems are seemingly permanently the third party in a two-party system? Give up that for a year or two of unstable rule during a deep recession full of austerity and cutbacks? Well, that's at least the thinking of a fairly large number of Labour 'dissenters' against those who would be willing to exchange a PR referendum for power.

fairleft
by fairleft (fairleftatyahoodotcom) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 11:20:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That's why it was AV that was on the table in reality ... Labour definitely would want that, for the short and medium term electoral benefit, which made the offer to bring a bill on AV credible, which forced the Tories to partially match that part of the offer with a referendum (that they will sabotage if they can).

With only a razor thing majority, likely to fall at any time its convenient for someone else to have an election at Labour's expense, and with the ever present prospect of a small Labour dissident breakaway bringing down the whole house of cards, Labour could obviously not raise the bid to a bill on PR, so PR was not on the table with the Tories.

Utsukushikereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:10:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It's hard, from an American viewpoint, to categorize the LDs. Are they really going to get proportional representation from the Tories? Or ANYTHING ELSE that was on their platform? I mean, if you look at their website, they're practically opposites???

How long before this coalition collapses? Maybe we need another pool...

by asdf on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 08:16:17 PM EST
... on a voting system that their coalition partners will run against vigourously, including if possible poison pills that will turn votes against it outside England as well.

And other than that, they get to share the blame when the Tories stink up the joint.

The only way the LD's come out of this ahead is if they finally pull the trigger on an issue with massive popular opposition, furiously declare that it breaks the coalition agreement, and vote no confidence in their own government.

... uhm, after the poison pilled electoral reform has been passed so that they can get second preference votes after nobody will be interested in giving them their first preference.


Utsukushikereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Tue May 11th, 2010 at 08:51:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
OTOH general perceptions of PR, and its almost inevitable result of coalition governments, may change if this coalition doesn't work.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 03:32:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Which is highly likely, alas.
With PR, you'd get coalitions indeed, but natural ones. Here it's ludicrous, it's the coalition of the two most different parties, on the sole basis of numbers.

"Few can believe that suffering, especially by others, is in vain. - Galbraith"
by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 03:36:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... on PR are they? I thought the Tories offer was AV (2nd Preference) and fixed terms.

However, the Tories will include fixed House terms, which will be unpopular since the Tories will be a very unpopular government by the time the referendum is in front of the voters, and they will prefer the possibility of an early election to turf the Coalition government out by then. That's part of the poison pill.

Of course the Tories only hope of surviving more than a year or two is if the LD's can't choose the right time to break over some "matter of principle" and vote no confidence to force an early election. So if they loose their campaign against the referendum and it passes, in return they get the chance to hang onto government and hope that the economy is better by the time of the next election.


Utsukushikereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 10:30:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Will need 55% of house to dissolve house so will need some Tory voters.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 10:45:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You can have a confidence vote with 50%+1 but you need 55% for an early election? That doesn't work.

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 10:57:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Is that it? In Oz, the PM can call an election (well, request the Head of State to call an election), and it seems like both Labour and most non-Tory regionals/minor parties in Britain would have reason to want a caretaker government to call an early election if Tory support has slumped.

That would put it in the LD's and some Northern Irish support to win a no confidence vote in the Tory/LD government and confidence in a caretaker unity government.

Almost everyone except the Tories wanting an election is part of the "when the time is right" I was referring to.

But there are obviously details in the unwritten British constitution that I don't know about.

Utsukushikereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:05:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The Tories are not going to give the LDs electoral reform, or financial reform. A lot of the LD rhetoric is about fairness and greenness (fair taxes, green taxes, access to education...). You'll get none of that from the tories. There are going to be strong tensions over foreign policy (Trident and the European Union).

I think once it became clear that Labour was not up to a rainbow coalition Clegg should have allowed the Tories a shot at a minority government by not opposing Cameron in a Confidence Vote. Now the Lib Dems not only won't get any of their policy goals but they will be blamed by the Tories when the coalition falls apart and they have cemented the perception of being Tory-lite among the Labour rank-and-file (the idea of the Social Democratic Party 'betrayal' of Labour in the 80's dies hard and this doesn't help).

So Clegg will achieve none of his policy objectives, will be perceived as having failed the test of government by the Serious People, and will have a harder time getting more seats next time, let alone negotiating with Labour.

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 04:15:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Not to speak of civil liberties. The Tories may not introduce ID cards, but I'm sure the rest of their policy is very illiberal.

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 04:17:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But he'll get a nice job consulting and speechifying when he stands down.

And possibly a book deal or two.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:17:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
They're not going to get PR.  At least not a system that will do them much good.  Worse, having now formed a coalition with Cameron, they're going to find it impossible to pull Labour votes in the future, I suspect.  "Vote LD, Get the Tories" is now a reality.

I can't see how this works out well for the LDs.  Aside from getting some small concessions, they've basically signed their name away to the Nasty Party.

Not that forming a coalition with Labour would've been a great thing.  The LDs were between a rock and a hard place.  The answer, I think, would've been to allow a minority government.  But that also would've been disastrous for Clegg, who'd already lost seats.

Labour is in a much stronger position than might have been feared.  They lost the majority but maintained 258 seats.  My guess is, barring a much-faster-than-expected recovery, this will be a short period of Tory rule.  The budget cuts will be bad enough, but if they tip the economy back into recession, it's going to immediately reinstate the view that the Tories are idiots.

Then everybody will sit around wondering what went wrong while saying, "Well, at least we kicked the guy out who warned this would happen.  Boy, he was shit, wasn't he?"

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 04:36:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
As was said before, the only decent way out for the LD would be for them to bring down the government when the Tories push for something unacceptable. Which should be soon.
And then state loud and clear that Tories broke their promises on the electoral system as well.

Regrettably, the concerted media action to rein in the LD surge worked enough to kill the window of opportunity.

"Few can believe that suffering, especially by others, is in vain. - Galbraith"

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 04:51:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Drew J Jones:
that also would've been disastrous for Clegg

For all three leaders, this entire situation was: either you get into government, or you're finished as party leader.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:01:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So Clegg sacrificed his party's future for a pirrhic personal career gain?

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:03:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That's my reading.

What do you think of the SocDem/Liberal divide in the party? Deep enough to split under stress?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:10:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I can't really speak to that but I don't think anyone actually identifies as SocDem or Liberal, and I also don't think the divide is enough to split the party.

Assuming (?) Clegg represented the "Liberal" and Chris Huhne the "Soc Dem" wings in the 2007 leadership contest, one can say the contest was extremely close but also extremely civil and supporters of both candidates would have been happy with the other winning.

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:16:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, he's apparently agreed to the £6bn spending cut, ditching the national insurance tax increase, scrapping his mansion tax, going along with Trident renewal, getting on board with capping immigration, and a number of other Tory positions on Europe and elsewhere.

So they've basically agreed to...become Tories?

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 06:50:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
ThatBritGuy:
But... Clegg could still put the knife in by siding with Cameron. I wouldn't be completely surprised if he did that.

The pattern is completely consistent - in the same way that Blair turned out to be a proto-Neocon, Clegg has turned out to be a closet Tory.

As the cliche says - it doesn't matter who you vote for, the government always gets in.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:39:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I admire about the UK political ethos : you only get one shot at success as a party leader. Quick turnover at the top slot for the losers.

This seems to be the rule in democracies generally, and I only wish it would apply in France.

by eurogreen on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 06:08:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Look at the good side of France. At least you don't keep appointing the losers to actual positions, as in Israel - Shimon Peres has been a perpetual loser for most of his career.
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 06:19:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Clegg statement:
...

Before I say anything more about that coalition government I would like to express my thanks and admiration for Gordon Brown. He has been a towering figure in British politics for well over a decade. And the manner in which he has acted over the last few days has demonstrated immense dignity, grace and a profound sense of his public duty.

We are now going to form a new government More importantly than anything else, we are going to form a new kind of government; I hope this is the start of a new kind of politics I have always believed in. Diverse, plural, where politicians with different points of view find a way to work together to provide the good government for the sake of the whole country deserves.

...

I am sure you have many questions, maybe many doubts. But I can assure you I would not have entered into this agreement unless I was genuinely convinced it was a unique opportunity to deliver the changes you and I believe in.

  • Fair taxes.
  • A fair start in life for every child.
  • A new approach to our discredited banking system and the prospect of green and sustainable economic growth.
  • And new, open politics which you can trust once again.

...


The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 04:58:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Migeru:
changes you and I believe in

Change you can believe in?

That could make a slogan.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:03:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
There's also a bit of Bushism in the statement
... the good government for the sake of the whole country deserves.
Don't they have copyeditors...!?

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:05:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
When you've got nothing but a laundry list of fluffy words to pronounce, who needs copy editors?
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:08:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
From Baroness Ros Scott (President of the Liberal Democrats)
... the [Lib Dem] Federal Executive and parliamentary party yesterday approved the coalition agreement negotiated with the Conservative Party.

Both bodies endorsed it overwhelmingly, by much more than a three-quarters majority. The provisions of the `triple lock' procedure approved by conference in 1998 have therefore been satisfied, and there is no requirement for a special conference to endorse the agreement.

However, Liberal Democrats remain a democratic party, and we believe it right to consult our membership on this momentous occasion in our party's history. The Federal Executive is therefore calling a special conference to take place on Sunday 16 May (1-5pm), in the National Exhibition Centre in Birmingham.

The only item of debate on the agenda will be a motion to endorse the coalition agreement. ...

Discuss.

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:28:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So, what if the coalition agreement gets voted down at the Conference?

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 10:48:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So nothing. The MPs and executive carry on regardless.

Besides, it's not clear how many members the LDs will still have by then.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:00:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Is there any polling on how Lib-Dems would split if choosing between the two big parties?  I suspect they'd lean towards Labour, but obviously don't know for sure.

Curious to know what kind of backlash there'll be on this.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:13:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No doubt that will pop up in the next couple of weeks

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:30:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Parties in the UK - and possibly in most countries - are used to herd members from the top down rather than to listen to them from the bottom up, so I think we'll see a Labour-style cabinet-by-diktat approach.

Labour's core membership accepted a shift to Blairite presidentialism with some damage, but without organising itself into a formal or explicit opposition. Just the opposite happened - dissenters were purged, and the members who were left were mostly willing to accept top-down influence, even if they weren't comfortable with it.

So we'll see maybe 25-30% splitting to Labour, another 10-20% leaving completely, and the rest staying put.

And because internal democracy is relative to the numbers of active members, and not to the numbers of people who might be members if they felt there was a chance to be influential, this will consolidate the infuence of the cabinet and the MPs and push the LDs further towards Tory territory.

Tory-friendly LDs can stay in the party comfortably now, while Labour-friendly LDs have to leave and move towards an alternative party that is - or was - less responsive than the LD structure used to be.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:44:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Anyone have a reading on the effect on the aggressive UK offshore wind prospects?

Skennah Kowa
by Crazy Horse on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:23:34 AM EST
<surveys horizon>

No lack of wind.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:04:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Ah yes, but is it blowing hot or cold, is it a wind of change and is it blowing in the right direction? Will it bring the Icelandic disease in its wake or is this all a wind up? Specifically CH is looking for aggressive offshore wind.  I thought most of the Tory Toffs had offshored already, so that's a lot of hot air gone elsewhere.

Frank's Home Page and Diary Index
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:43:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC: Cameron's cabinet: A guide to who's who
PRIME MINISTER - DAVID CAMERON [CON]

The Old Etonian had dazzled [the 2005] party conference with his youthful dynamism and charisma, reportedly telling journalists he was the "heir to Blair".

DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER - NICK CLEGG [LD]

He has campaigned against the government over civil liberties and opposed the Conservatives' spending cuts plans, attempting to create a distance between the Lib Dems and what he calls the "old parties".

FOREIGN SECRETARY - WILLIAM HAGUE [CON]

The new foreign secretary has plenty of experience to call upon, having been Tory leader himself from 1997 to 2001 and shadow foreign secretary until the election.

CHANCELLOR - GEORGE OSBORNE [CON]

Mr Osborne took a key role in the election campaign and has been at the forefront of the debate on how to deal with the recession and the UK's spending deficit.

DEFENCE SECRETARY - DR LIAM FOX [CON]

As shadow defence secretary he has led his party's criticism of funding for the armed forces under Gordon Brown and he retains that brief as the party moves into government.

HEALTH SECRETARY - ANDREW LANSLEY [CON]

Mr Cameron had long guaranteed Mr Lansley - who has played a key role in convincing people that the NHS is a high priority for the Conservatives - the role of health secretary in a government led by him.

BUSINESS/BANKING - VINCE CABLE [LIB]

He is expected to have some sort of Treasury/business job, probably including some brief to oversee the banking system. It is not yet clear what the title of the post will be.

ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE -CHRIS HUHNE [LIB]

After[ the 2007 contest] Mr Huhne, who had been environment spokesman, was promoted to the home affairs brief. He made a fortune in the City before entering politics, and is seen as being on the left of the party.

OTHERS EXPECTED TO FEATURE IN COALITION CABINET:

DAVID LAWS [LIB]

After [the 2005 election] he moved to work and pensions and then, in 2007, to speak on children, families and schools. He earned plaudits from some in the Conservative Party in this role.

... Has been tipped as a possible education secretary.

DANNY ALEXANDER [LIB]

... Danny Alexander will probably be Scottish Secretary. ...

He was also the former media chief of pro-euro campaign group Britain in Europe, which brought together leading Labour and Lib Dem voices with business groups.

MICHAEL GOVE [CON]

... one of the names in the frame for the position of Home Secretary, although that is one of the key positions yet to be announced. ...

Mr Gove headed the Policy Exchange think tank for three years before landing the safe seat of Surrey Heath.



The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:39:46 AM EST
If Laws is made Home Secretary, and Gove Education Secretary, then I might consider that the Lib Dems have not been entirely Clegged over without the vaseline.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith
by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:47:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
HOME SECRETARY AND MINISTER FOR WOMEN AND EQUALITY - THERESA MAY
LORD CHANCELLOR AND SECRETARY OF STATE FOR JUSTICE - KEN CLARKE
HEALTH SECRETARY - ANDREW LANSLEY
BUSINESS/BANKING - VINCE CABLE
ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE - CHRIS HUHNE

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:19:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
This in from Claverton:


http://www.chrishuhne.org.uk/speeches/000051

Energy efficiency not nuclear is the answer to energy needs
Tuesday 9 May 2006
Speaking at the Associate Parliamentary Renewable And Sustainable Energy Group (PRASEG) today, Liberal Democrat Shadow Environment Secretary, Chris Huhne MP said:

"Becoming energy efficient presents a clear challenge to Government, business, and the individual. We need to turn our full attention to the end user in the domestic sector who has been driving the overall increase in CO2 emissions in the UK.

"Overall energy usage is increasing at 0.7% per year, with a 1.5 % a year increase in electricity demand. But reducing use and increasing efficiency is one of the most cost-effective ways of meeting the problem.

"Part of the answer may ultimately be regulation, some of which will, under single market rules, have to be at EU level.

"Beyond energy saving, we need to encourage those technologies that either sharply reduce or eliminate carbon emissions. Tidal and wave power, solar power, geothermal power and biomass are all likely to have a role to play.

"No private sector investor has built a nuclear power station anywhere in the world without lashings of government subsidy since Three Mile Island and Chernobyl. The World Bank refuses to lend on nuclear projects because of the long history of overruns.

"Our message is clear, No to nuclear, as it is not a short cut, but a dead end. Yes to energy saving, yes to renewables, and yes to a sustainable energy future."

This statement is made before he's in the cabinet.  Wonder what changes come now.  he's right on the value of energy efficiency, in fact, a Manhattan Project is deserved.  He is very wrong on blaming the individual, of course.

Skennah Kowa

by Crazy Horse on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:13:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Although i suppose one could read his comment as supporting regulation aimed at strengthening efficiency policies which affect the individual energy use.

how much i love political speeches.  for their substance.

Skennah Kowa

by Crazy Horse on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:20:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Though domestic users are 'responsible' for 'demanding' more electricity than industry/commerce etc. However, the failure is mostly governmental/institutional inability to make an acceptable argument for reductions in domestic demand both by encouraging conservation (e.g.  insulation), waste (e.g. plasma v LCD), smart metering, self-generation, and so on.

The media, including the persuasion industry, have played a major part in that failure because they make their money by pandering, not arguing.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:49:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I think that Crazy Horse meant that the individuals may be responsible for electricity consumption, but not for the rise in C02 -ie, it's not individuals that chose to have no energy policy, or to favour fossil fuel plants.

"Few can believe that suffering, especially by others, is in vain. - Galbraith"
by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:32:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You are paraphrasing what I was saying.

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:44:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Then I didn't understand your post.
I thought you were only talking about increased efficiency (insulation and so on), rather than improved production.

"Few can believe that suffering, especially by others, is in vain. - Galbraith"
by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:12:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
My point - which maybe wasn't clear because it referred to other conversations with CH not in ET - was that a reduction in domestic demand would have a great effect, and it could be fairly immediate. Improved production, especially of renewables is going to take some time. Jérôme published a chart here some while ago that made it clear that a reduction in domestic demand, where there is much waste due to ignorance, a failure to invest in long term personal benefits, and just plain ostentatious energy use, would have instant effects. That it is a problem of knowledge promotion.

As an extra point, I think one of the critical changes that needs to take place is to make developers responsible in some way for the long-term energy needs of buildings. They are not motivated to do so. This motivation could be achieved by a number of methods, from building codes upwards.

In Finland, a house seller is legally responsible for five years for any defects found in the house that were not reported to the buyer at the time of sale. If developers were forced to also publish the projected heating and cooling energy demands of their building, they could be held accountable for the difference in cost. The published figures would then become a house price influencer and hopefully a spur to competition in improving the figures for their new buildings.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 01:26:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Remarkably, he didn't mention wind...

Frank's Home Page and Diary Index
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot dotty communists) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:48:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
He is very wrong on blaming the individual, of course.

The Lib side versus the Social Democrat side.

Utsukushikereba sore de ii

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 10:33:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Cameron's daring will change politics for ever | Daniel Finkelstein - Times Online

Emerging from the cinema a few years back, having watched Kevin Costner's Dances with Wolves, my friend remarked that he thought it the greatest film ever made. I looked sceptical. "Well," he said. "Something has to be."

So in the same spirit, let me write something I have always fancied writing without appearing ridiculous. And now I can. This is a defining moment in British political history. Something has to be.

Like Robert Peel's decision to repeal the Corn Laws, and split the Conservative Party for a generation, or Stanley Baldwin's gentle manoeuvring to install the first Labour Government in 1924 and thus dish the Liberals, David Cameron's generous offer to the Liberal Democrats has changed British politics for ever. Whether it succeeds or not.

I think that Finkelstein is right that this election changes UK politics forever.

But I believe that the Tories, and the Lib Dems with them, are fundamentally unable to enact the radical liberal policies - from Smith through J S Mill to Lloyd George - capable of solving our financial problems when combined with a new mutualism.

This is because the only way to do so is to tax or otherwise share wealth - and the unearned income that derives from it. ie taxing privilege rather than people. As the party of Property, this is something the Tories cannot ever do. They simply do not DO solidarity. The Big Society will evaporate and Red Toryism with it, I suspect in the face of the drastic conventional fiscal measures they (and New Labour) actually believe are necessary.

Labour now has an opportunity to colonise this ground, through the new approach to networked mutualism and communitarianism, exemplified by Citizens UK and the Living Wage campaign.  This mobilises the union movement, community groups of all kinds, and also operates interfaith to mobilise the efforts of those adherents of all religions who take practical steps to make life better for their fellow men

I think that this opportunity cannot tke place top down. The Labour Party as currently constituted is no longer fit for purpose, and is incapable of the necessary changes.

I think the new politics - if it comes - will originate from the wave of urban labour councils who will undoubtedly bear the brunt of this government's EasyCouncil policies. There is no place for New Labour in this politics.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 05:44:18 AM EST
So will we now have both the Guardian and the Daily Mail supporting the Government at the same time?

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:24:14 AM EST
Yes, I made a snarky comment about it on a Guardian editorial.  "So you endorsed the Lib-Dems in hopes of a LabLib coalition and PR, and instead you got Cameron.  Heckuva job, Brownie."

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:26:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Douglas Carswell MP: Queen's Speech: The Great Repeal Bill

First proposed by Daniel Hannan and me a few years back, it seems like the Great Repeal Bill is going to make it into the Queen's Speech.

The Great Repeal Bill is a chance to scrap all the restrictive and illiberal laws that we face after 13 years of Labour



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:27:24 AM EST
Including the House of Lords Act? From the link in the page you cite
This Act increasingly excludes hereditary peers from the House of Lords thereby replacing the ancient concept of 'Noblesse oblige' - the "Obligation of the Nobels" with the inferior prospect of creating a peasant underclass reminiscent of the 14th Century, lorded over by a parasitical form of master or 'squire' with no inherent misgivings with which to reign-back on his newly-re-enabled exploitation of the poor.
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:34:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well the hole swathe of that is a right wing wet dream, removing income tax and replacing it with a sales tax

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:44:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Note the bit on climate change right below it, too.

Pure Republicanism on both counts.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:49:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But it is noticeable that they dont want to repeal the hunting act 2004 (at least I cant see it in there) I know it was in the last Libdem manifesto, and it was made a free vote to help the Welsh rural MPs

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:04:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And looking again the race relations act!!! Jesus are the BNP in this coalition too? (or would they have been if theyd have got any seats)?

So full on repeat of the 80's with proper race riots then.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:08:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah, I noticed that, too.  Classy bunch.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:13:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
This is not only about repealing Labour's legislation from the past 13 years. The list includes:

  • Weights and Measures Act 1985
  • European Works Council Directive (1994)
  • Companies Act 1985
  • Health and Safety at Work Act 1974
  • Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977
  • Town & Country Planning Act 1947
  • The Leasehold Reform Acts, 1967
  • Race Relations Act 1976


The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:18:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And notice for some strange reason, all the money laundering regulations too,  Makes me think that There's more to Ashcroft than meets the eye.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:22:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And then there's something later about abolishing obsolete/unnecessary institutions such as the Houses of Parliament (since all legislation now comes from Brussels) and the BBC (because of its bias - as we saw during election night, surely?)...

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:24:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well it is a hotbed of left-wing radicals who don't parrot every bit of Tory praising lunacy are neutral

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:33:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Fucking hell. Wait 'til In Wales sees that ...
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:59:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"Compassionate Conservatism!"

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:15:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well hopefully thats the rights version, and we'll actually see an entirely different and slimmed down version

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:25:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The Wikiversity page includes commentary that is not entirely on-board with this:
Members of the public are able to add to the list of laws and rules to be repealed in the draft of the Bill below. You are also highly encouraged to join the debate about why certain legislation should be included (or excluded) from the Great Repeal Bill.

This experiment in direct democracy allows ordinary citizens to have a direct say in drafting of legislation, which is believed to be the first of its kind

...

"An opinion by a business that a law is a burden is not sufficient to make that law wrong. ..."

"Specify what aspect of the Companies Act you find objectionable. Is it the environmental audit or the facrt that companies have to mke an annual report? Just naming the companies act will not do."

The whole page is astroturfing or a collective laundry list with no coherence. Can it be seriously considered as a bill?

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:31:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Also:
xxiv The Arbitration Act 2006  Gives the judgements of Sharia courts recognition in law[Citation needed]  
xxv Terrorism Act 2006[53] Sections 23 to 25; 28 days detention without charge is too long  
xxvii Criminal Justice Act 2003[54] Section 7 and 306 14 days detention without charge is too long  
xxviii Terrorism Act 2000[55] Section 13, Sections 44 to 47 improve freedom for peaceful protest, remove power to stop and search without probable cause  
xxix Criminal Justice and Public Order Act 1994 [56] Sections 34 to 39; re-introduce the right to silence


The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:33:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I think probably not, after the initial personal panic. but too much experience of Tory government has taught me its always worse than you expect.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:41:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What kind of MPs are Douglas Carswell and Daniel Hannan? Of the Boris Johnson school of comedy politics?


The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:52:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I assume you are not intending that there is no place for comedy in politics?

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:16:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's more reassuring when it's intentional.
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:20:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Sven for President!

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:22:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
of the State of Mind ?

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:47:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Daniel Hannan? judge for yourself



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:22:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
History repeats itself

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:33:06 AM EST
Banks fear shake-up from Conservative-Lib Dem coalition | Business | guardian.co.uk

Fears that the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition government would break up the banks and impose a punitive levy on their businesses loomed over the UK banking sector this morning.

With the former Treasury spokesman Vince Cable widely expected to be handed a portfolio for business and banks later today, the MP who launched some of the most outspoken attacks on the greed and excesses in the City is now being unleashed on the sector.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:37:12 AM EST
David Cameron Isn't Foreign
So David Cameron will be the new British prime minister.

It is almost impossible for an American to satisfactorily parse the differences that separate Britain's major party candidates. In American terms, Britain's three contenders are all Democrats--more progressive than middle of the road, even.

The clearest ideological shadow that can be laid on them seems to be the extent to which they might recall the past, even though they have disavowed it. So the suggestion has been that Gordon Brown really, truly, deep in his heart of hearts, still held a sentimental candle for socialism and hard-core trade unionism, and that David Cameron is really just a scornful, landed-gentry, old-school-boy type.

The contest appeared to be, at least from my American view, how plausibly reconstructed each candidate could make himself seem--how modern. How free of the past.


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:56:05 AM EST
ceebs:
In American terms, Britain's three contenders are all Democrats--more progressive than middle of the road, even.

wha?

giant sucking sound as the word 'progressive's meaning continues its warped disappearance into the black hole of media spin.

"Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do." Jim Hightower

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:13:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Adam Boulton and Kay Burley: almost 1,500 complaints to Ofcom | Media | guardian.co.uk
Media regulator Ofcom has received almost 1,500 complaints about Adam Boulton's on-screen clash with Alastair Campbell and Kay Burley's interview with electoral reformist David Babbs.


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:12:56 AM EST
From 2005

Scrap the DTI, says Lib Dem trade spokesman | Business | guardian.co.uk

The Liberal Democrat trade spokesman, Vince Cable, today called for the abolition of the Department of Trade and Industry.

"Why does it exist? What is its £5bn budget actually for? I very seriously question is it actually a useful level of expenditure," he told the party's conference in Brighton.

"It would be far more useful to British industry to invest in education, for example adult education, to deal with the scandal of the millions of adults who can't read.

Guess what he's ended up in charge of...

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:21:17 AM EST
another pol getting it wrong. you can't fix the education system till you stop the politically inspired nonsense in kindergarten and junior schools.

The first thing kids should demonstrate before they can learn anything else is the ability to recite times tables and READ. Till they can do that, a teacher is wasting time.

First temr in school should be triage. Find out who can and who's struggling. Stream aggressively with more and more help for the strugglers till we're in 1 on 1 territory.

the aim should be that no child gets to 9 without reading writing and basic arithmetic.

Then, once you've stopped the conveyor belt of failure, you can think about working out how to help adults.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:48:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
@gimpyblog The Tories have just put a man who believes that poor people have shrunken brains as Work & Pensions Minister!

He quotes Iain Duncan Smith thusly:

@gimpyblog "Basically what is happening with these children is they are probably going to school with a brain the size of a child of one,"


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:44:30 AM EST
Little Nicky and his fine, fine colleagues.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:48:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
There's no denying the fact that the Tories won over 300 seats...

The British have just voted for a party that would make someone Work and Pensions Secretary who believes that poor people have shrunken brains!

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:50:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I thought it was tories with the shrunken brains

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:49:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
11 million of them?

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 03:22:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, 59m voted for Bush.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 03:24:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Gary Gibbon on Politics - Solving the logistical mysteries of the coalition

One mystery solved. The PM sees the prospective ministers first then they see the deputy PM.

A bizarre human resources set-up for a bizarre political confection. Does the PM do the job interview and the deputy PM the benediction?

It's a good way of introducing some Tories to a man they barely know (Nick Clegg that is) and starting personal rapports when there has been lots of bad blood between these parties

Patrick McLoughlin will be the chief whip for the coalition but there will be separate Lib Dem whipping for personal matters etc.

The Lib Dem ministers will sit on the front bench with the Tories but the backbenchers are expected to want to sit in a block.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:48:25 AM EST
ceebs:
there will be separate Lib Dem whipping for personal matters etc.

mmmm, how british...

"Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do." Jim Hightower

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:32:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Gordon Browns election agent says that he will remain as an MP

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:49:27 AM EST
John Rentoul - Traitor Cameron
I thought there were too many people on the left always on the lookout for someone to betray them, but it is an affliction of the right too. The Margaret Jackson Award for Instant Charge of Betrayal goes to Gerald Warner of the Telegraph:

The Heir of Blair has managed to exceed his mentor's 10-year record of betrayal in just 24 hours. The Conservative Party is now in the thralls of a relentless process of dissolution.


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:55:08 AM EST
Gerald Warner also writes in the 'Scotsman'.

Somewhat to the right of Genghis Khan and the only living example of 'Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells'.

Modern conservatives engage in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy: the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.Galbraith

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 07:16:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Cameron drops pledge to raise NHS spending in real terms | Westminster Blog | FT.com

The coalition document is yet to be published. But I've been told that the ring-fence on NHS funding has been lifted.  The exact wording is:

"We will increase NHS spending in every year of the parliament."

This meets the Lib Dem policy of not protecting any department from public spending cuts, while guaranteeing that health funding will at least be flat in cash terms . The Tory manifesto had, of course, promised real terms increases in the health budget.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 08:57:03 AM EST
And so it begins.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (myfriends@thisispancakes.com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 10:14:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Hadley Beeman (hadleybeeman) on Twitter
The Identity & Passport Service confirming cancellation of ID cards & National ID Register http://bit.ly/cmwv3M


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:05:48 AM EST
Well there claims to be a leak of the agreement, but the site its on is down

the excerpt I can see is this

Heresy Corner: A new birth of freedom

The parties agree to implement a full programme of measures to reverse the substantial erosion of civil liberties under the Labour Government and roll back state intrusion.

This will include:

* A Freedom or Great Repeal Bill.
* The scrapping of ID card scheme, the National Identity register, the next generation
of biometric passports and the Contact Point Database.
* Outlawing the finger-printing of children at school without parental permission.
* The extension of the scope of the Freedom of Information Act to provide greater transparency.
* Adopting the protections of the Scottish model for the DNA database.
* The protection of historic freedoms through the defence of trial by jury.
* The restoration of rights to non-violent protest.
* The review of libel laws to protect freedom of speech.
* Safeguards against the misuse of anti-terrorism legislation.
* Further regulation of CCTV.
* Ending of storage of internet and email records without good reason.
* A new mechanism to prevent the proliferation of unnecessary new criminal offences.


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:09:54 AM EST
Liberal Conspiracy » Exclusive: Was this the Con-Lib agreement?

ve been sent this document from a source who wishes to remain anonymous.

They say this document forms the basis of the agreement between the Libdems and Conservatives. I'm not going to publish the Word document, but here it is in HTML format.

------------

Conservative Liberal Democrat coalition negotiations

Agreements reached

11 May 2010

This document sets out agreements reached between the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats on a range of issues. These are the issues that needed to be resolved between us in order for us to work together as a strong and stable government. It will be followed in due course by a final Coalition Agreement, covering
the full range of policy and including foreign, defence and domestic policy issues not covered in this document.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:45:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The Conservative Party | News | News | Coalition Agreement published

The Conservatives and Liberal Democrats have released a document setting out the agreements reached between the two parties on a range of issues.

These are the issues that needed to be resolved between us in order for us to work together as a strong and stable government.

It will be followed in due course by a final Coalition Agreement, covering the full range of policy and including foreign, defence and domestic policy issues not covered in this document.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:51:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Liberal Democrats version: Conservative Liberal Democrat coalition agreements.


The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:14:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
... without explicit reason to store them would be a big win to corporations for reducing risks of exposing corporate liability (as we have been seeing in the States recently) ... worth quite a bit in terms of rights to those lesser human being types of persons.

Utsukushikereba sore de ii
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:19:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
So LibDems allowed to Abstain on Marriage tax, so it will go through then.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 12:58:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
@krishgm "the press looked from Tory to Lib Dem and from Lib Dem to Tory......but already it was impossible to say which was which"


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:34:23 AM EST
@KerryMP So all depts covering child poverty - Treasury, DWP, DCSF - have Tory leads. That worries me.


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:35:31 AM EST
@girlonetrack The Cleggeron: "This is what the 'new politics' looks like". What, like two rich, public school boys? Very "new".


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 09:41:34 AM EST
Tax increase on planes and no Third runway at Heathrow.

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 10:50:00 AM EST
Hear the latest from Alastair's Blog: Sign up for RSS feed

Alastair Campbell's long-awaited diaries will be published in full following Gordon Brown's resignation as Prime Minister, Random House announced today.

Extracts from Mr Campbell's diaries were published as The Blair Years in 2007 and he always intended to publish the full diaries in chronological order. The first of the four volumes will be published on 3rd June. Entitled Prelude to Power, it covers the period from John Smith's death in May 1994 to Tony Blair becoming Prime Minister in May 1997. It opens with forty pages of hitherto unpublished material recording the discussions that led to Tony Blair, rather than Gordon Brown, becoming leader of the Labour Party.



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:31:12 AM EST
Benjamin Cohen on Technology - "David Cameron New Prime Minister. We are doomed" tube sign viral is genuine

I thought it was a fake when I was shared on Facebook this photograph of a London tube information board saying:  "Good Service All Line. Service Update: David Cameron New Prime Minister. We are doomed."

But it turns out I was wrong, Transport for London said in a statement: "Our service information boards are in public areas of stations and are used to update our customers of service changes.

"This message has been removed, we are urgently investigating how it appeared, and apologise for it."



If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 11:31:57 AM EST
Tally ho: why Hunt has the scent of BBC blood in his nostrils - TV & Radio, Media - The Independent
But the two digital television channels should think again because there may have to be further bloody incisions. Jeremy Hunt, the Conservative shadow culture secretary, is unconvinced such "expensive" services offer value for money. "These are channels costing nearly £100m each to run, but with very, very small audiences," he says. "There may be good public service broadcasting reasons why this investment is sensible but I'd like to hear arguments beyond the simple one that everyone pays the licence fee. The reality is that there isn't enough money even in the BBC's generous licence fee pot for it to produce programming for every single niche that exists."


If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 01:16:02 PM EST
New Thread Time?

This one is getting awkward to navigate.

No one could have predicted

by ATinNM on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 01:30:03 PM EST
New thread is now up.

The brainless should not be in banking -- Willem Buiter
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed May 12th, 2010 at 03:28:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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