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Wednesday Open Thread

by Nomad Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 12:02:16 PM EST

Hop aboard


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Or to pander to our beer-drinking compatriots, "Hops aboard".

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 12:29:42 PM EST
Tempting but I really shouldn't

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 12:43:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
have people been drinking enough to think it is still Wednesday?

or have I been drinking enough to skip a day?

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 01:31:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ha, yes, didn't notice that.

So far it's been thursday, unless it's just another manic Monday Wednesday

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 02:19:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hops d'abord!
I've still got a few left from a recent trip to Munich. Let's see:
Andechser Export Dunkel. Kloster Andechs since 1455, it says On the label. I like it. Dark, sweetish and slightly nutty (just like me, I hear you t hinking)

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 03:05:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Mmmm, nice. A touch sweet for me, but I wouldn't say no

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 03:49:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Schneier on security  - The Failure of Anti-Virus Companies to Catch Military Malware

Mikko Hypponen of F-Secure attempts to explain why anti-virus companies didn't catch Stuxnet, DuQu, and Flame:
[....]
I don't buy this. It isn't just the military that tests their malware against commercial defense products; criminals do it, too. Virus and worm writers do it. Spam writers do it. This is the never-ending arms race between attacker and defender, and it's been going on for decades. Probably the people who wrote Flame had a larger budget than a large-scale criminal organization, but their evasive techniques weren't magically better. Note that F-Secure and others had samples of Flame; they just didn't do anything about them.

I think the difference has more to do with the ways in which these military malware programs spread. That is, slowly and stealthily. It was never a priority to understand -- and then write signatures to detect -- the Flame samples because they were never considered a problem. Maybe they were classified as a one-off. Or as an anomaly. I don't know, but it seems clear that conventional non-military malware writers that want to evade detection should adopt the propagation techniques of Flame, Stuxnet, and DuQu.



keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 12:48:58 PM EST
Fact:  the internet is not a secure communications channel.

Fact:  computer operating systems are not a secure environment.

Until these facts are acknowledged and action taken from the basis of these two facts computers will be insecure.

Ever since I learnt about confirmation bias I've started seeing it everywhere

by ATinNM on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 01:08:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The only way to secure a computer is to keep it in a locked room with no internet (and probably no power either)

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 01:33:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Under the above facts, yes.

It is possible to change the situation, thus alter the facts, by changing the Internet and the computer environment.  To do that the IT industry has to stop making a living on the banks of Denial.  

A necessary, but not sufficient, change is for the IT industry to forbid downloading to program memory space.  They don't want to do that because it will dramatically and negatively affect their bottom line.

 

Ever since I learnt about confirmation bias I've started seeing it everywhere

by ATinNM on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 01:50:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
And now, it's back off to work I go.  

NB:  This work stuff is really interfering with my Quality Blogging Time.

;-)

Ever since I learnt about confirmation bias I've started seeing it everywhere

by ATinNM on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 01:51:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The whole way we have decided to use the Internet is a fundamentally and amazingly bad idea.
  • Eliminate all communication channels except those that go through government-controlled infrastructure?
  • Bypass the entire legal structure you've built up over 150 years of experience with telegraph and telephone access management?
  • Expose all industrial and personal bank accounts to every third-world hacker?
  • Connect tactical military computers to a wire leading directly to computers of the guys you're fighting?
  • Construct an entire national or regional communications infrastructure that relies on a single undersea cable that can easily be cut--by accident or on purpose?
  • Move all financial transactions to a system where transaction privacy is eliminated?
  • Rely entirely on a mathematical security algorithm that has not been proven secure and that could be (or already has been) broken by some 22 year old PhD student somewhere--or even by some grammar school kid who stumbles onto a fast factoring algorithm?
  • Require everybody to maintain dozens of passwords that are not to be written down--but must be--and that must contain random mixes of characters--but never do--and that must be at the same time secret from clever hackers while open to family members and caregivers?

It is completely crazy.
by asdf on Fri Jun 22nd, 2012 at 09:21:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Eliminate all communication channels except those that go through government-controlled infrastructure?

That is the case for all communications, except the man-with-suitcase variety.

Ultima ratio regnum and all that.

Bypass the entire legal structure you've built up over 150 years of experience with telegraph and telephone access management?

It doesn't, though. Legally, in most jurisdictions I know of, an Internet connection is just a fancy phone line.

Expose all industrial and personal bank accounts to every third-world hacker?

Eh, it's still a couple of orders of magnitude easier to expose a bank account through wetware vulnerabilities than through software vulnerabilities. The Spanish prisoner has become the Nigerian prince, but the underlying logic of confidence scams has not changed.

Connect tactical military computers to a wire leading directly to computers of the guys you're fighting?

In the event of a real war, the Internet will be a very early casualty. For precisely this reason.

But from the perspective of the imperial hegemon, we haven't had a real war in two generations. (Some of the colonies might disagree, of course...)

Construct an entire national or regional communications infrastructure that relies on a single undersea cable that can easily be cut--by accident or on purpose?

You can propagate an address file for a separate DNS architecture pretty fast if you need to because you got cut off from the root servers.

Bye-bye Internet, hello USNet and Euronet.

Move all financial transactions to a system where transaction privacy is eliminated?

That happened with the invention of the checking account. At the very latest with the ATM.

What, you think your bank observes transaction privacy? Really?

Then I have some vintage 2005 issue AIG stock you may be interested in.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Fri Jun 22nd, 2012 at 09:51:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Eliminate all communication channels except those that go through government-controlled infrastructure?

That is the case for all communications, except the man-with-suitcase variety.


I was thinking of things like the BBC, mimeographed local newsletters, flyers nailed to telephone poles...

Move all financial transactions to a system where transaction privacy is eliminated?

That happened with the invention of the checking account. At the very latest with the ATM.


Sure, but compare cash to any of those. Twenty years ago you would not buy groceries with a credit card, now you buy a single cup of coffee with one.
by asdf on Fri Jun 22nd, 2012 at 11:32:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I was thinking of things like the BBC, mimeographed local newsletters, flyers nailed to telephone poles...

The BBC is not government-controlled? That's news to me.

'Sides, flyers nailed to telephone poles are much easier when you can print them on a commonplace inkjet printer.

Sure, but compare cash to any of those. Twenty years ago you would not buy groceries with a credit card, now you buy a single cup of coffee with one.

Speaking as an economist, I cannot help but think that that's an awesome development.

You have no idea (or rather, you do and disapprove ;-P) of how much economic data you can get from just ordinary mining of data collected in the routine conduct of ordinary business.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Fri Jun 22nd, 2012 at 08:07:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ok, the thing about the BBC is that it provides a government controlled view from the UK. And there are, or were, plenty of other shortwave radio stations--controlled by their respective governments--that gave alternative views. The point is that if you're in Nigeria and want a view of the world that is not controlled by your LOCAL government, you could listen to these without the local government knowing. Sure, if you live in the UK and don't like the UK government propaganda, then the BBC might not be who you would listen to. But now that most countries other than China have discontinued short wave broadcasting in favor of Internet broadcasting, when a revolution breaks out in Syria or Egypt or whatever the first thing the government does--or can do--is shut off the Internet.

Re cash transactions, the point is that if I want to give $20 to my local alternative political party, a bill is untraceable. If I use my credit card, Acxiom knows about it and therefore the government knows about it. Anonymity of transactions is lost. The only people who will be retaining it are drug dealers who use $100 bills for everything.

by asdf on Sat Jun 23rd, 2012 at 06:46:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Bruce Schneier - The Vulnerabilities Market and the Future of Security

Recently, there have been several articles about the new market in zero-day exploits: new and unpatched computer vulnerabilities. It's not just software companies, who sometimes pay bounties to researchers who alert them of security vulnerabilities so they can fix them. And it's not only criminal organizations, who pay for vulnerabilities they can exploit. Now there are governments, and companies who sell to governments, who buy vulnerabilities with the intent of keeping them secret so they can exploit them.

This market is larger than most people realize, and it's becoming even larger. Forbes recently published a price list for zero-day exploits, along with the story of a hacker who received $250K from "a U.S. government contractor" (At first I didn't believe the story or the price list, but I have been convinced that they both are true.) Forbes published a profile of a company called Vupen, whose business is selling zero-day exploits. Other companies doing this range from startups like Netragard and Endgame to large defense contractors like Northrop Grumman, General Dynamics, and Raytheon.

This is very different than in 2007, when researcher Charlie Miller wrote about his attempts to sell zero-day exploits; and a 2010 survey implied that there wasn't much money in selling zero days. The market has matured substantially in the past few years.

This new market perturbs the economics of finding security vulnerabilities. And it does so to the detriment of us all.



keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 12:51:31 PM EST
I guess we all should've listened to Chris Cook.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.
by Drew J Jones (pedobear@pennstatefootball.com) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 02:23:27 PM EST
heh.
I'm saying nothing.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 03:18:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
About $15/bl in a month and the price has broken $80/bl. Locally, the price of gasoline has dropped over $0.50/gallon since late winter. But the cost of natural gas is going up.

As the Dutch said while fighting the Spanish: "It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 03:19:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That's because those damned communists are preventing us from fracking underneath your groundwater.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 04:44:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I keep reading pro-fracking articles that say the cost of natural gas has gone down significantly?
by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 05:12:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
One of these teams is going to end up scoring, but I couldn't pick which one. Stalemate, though Cech's mates have had the better of the first half.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 03:30:35 PM EST
Yea, it's a good game but I think Portugal are shading it

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 03:48:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This must be a record for hitting posts. Ronaldo must be on at least four in this match alone.

What's the english for "bicyclette", that over-the-head thing he tried in the first half?

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 03:57:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
oh goody. I'm thinking extra time and penalties.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 04:01:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, Portugal are through but they need shooting practice before the next game.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 04:42:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Bicycle kick occasionally but overhead kick generally.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 04:40:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Interview with Barak in Slate.
Q: And then a new administration might come into office.

A: They waited 4,000 years to have a nuclear bomb, so they can wait another four months. They want to see how the new president, be it Obama or Romney, sees it. In the meantime, they can enrich another [batch of] low-enriched uranium. They want to delay.

That strikes me as a rather stupid thing to have done. If they had just hurried up by, say, about 2,000 years, the outcome at Salamis would have been quite different.
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Jun 21st, 2012 at 04:14:07 PM EST
Nah, the Persians were bitter enemies of the Ottomans at the time, and didn't have a Mediterranean coastline or navy.  They would have been more likely to forge a tactical alliance with Christian Europe against the Ottomans than to further the imperial ambitions of the Sublime Porte.
by Zwackus on Fri Jun 22nd, 2012 at 06:07:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]


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